Why don't railroads advertise?

Trains Magazine General Discussion
21

I’m coming in late on this thread, (since there is no “next” button on these postings, and I get tired of scrolling up and down, and it may have alraedy been said) but advertising to the general public is very important- shippers know who the railroads are but does the public? or does the public even give a hoot? Well if they dont, the railroad brass better, because the decisions regarding money, (not just for amtrak), regulation and possible re-regulation, pollution and environmental controls, etc. are all made by elected officials who hear from people who DO GIVE A HOOT about their interests.

The railroads have NO advocates in the general public- just people who complain to elected officials about blocked crossings, loud horns, un-repaired crossings and everything else that is bad about railroads. I speak from experience being both a former City Manager, and now a Public Works Director, that the RR better get its act together, and get a positive spin on their story, because “they” are out there and they want you out of their way.

Let me tell you, even in a small town the RR never cuts its grass, sprays round-up on the property of adjacent property owners, never maintains the most visable aspects of their operation, never picks up its debris left along the road, and in the case of the CSX here never returns phone calls. ( I had to threaten once to start pulling up the roadbed to get a call returned) Do you think they are building a population here that gives a hoot about the RR’s problems? This is a nationwide problem!!

When the RR’s face the congress discussing reregulation, or passenger travel, etc. they whine, but do nothing to mobilize any support- why??? Because they spend the rest of the year ignoring or worse, angering that general public.

Something to think about. —Ralph M.

22

gdc,
Wow, your good! I need to go back to the Library and check on some data. I promise, I will try to have some answer’s for you ASAP.
TIM A

23

Ralph, Thank you for the responce. I agree with you. Railroads need to clean up there image a bit. The easiest way to do that is through advertising.
TIM A

24

Ralph, couldn’t agree with you more. The RR had better start at least keeping their property clean or debris free. They should realize that nobody wants to have their business next to a trash filled lot owned by a RR.

P.S. Next time you are out fanning and see some trash “Pick It Up” If for no other reason than to leave the place better off then when you got there.

BAA 9.0 Clear

25
  1. How do you know it’s the railroad’s property?
  2. If it is, how is an ad campaign going to help clean it up?
  3. What kind of trash are you talking about?
26

Sir, I believe you’re confusing advertising with public relations. These involve two different concepts. I also hope your municipal attorney advised you about damaging the property of others.
Regards and have a safe day. gdc

27

Tim,
I mentioned this in another post to this same thread, so I’ll mention it to you also. Remember the difference between public relations and advertising. They require different approaches.
Regards and have a safe day. gdc

28

Oh here we go with the attorneys again!!! Wherever the he** you all are from must have one more surplus of attorneys because I can’t hardly read a f*@#!%^ post on here lately with out somebody mentioning a GODAMED ATTORNEY!!! JEEEZZZZZZZZZ USSSSSS!!! If this cat doesn’t know destroying or threatening to destroy a railbed isn’t a crime, he needs not an attorney, but a suregeon to replace his brain!!!
Disregards, BS (and lots of it)

29

Hi QM, Ralph & Tim A; I’m the one mentioned the UP ad on TV. Glad you can grasp the importance of the general public’s recogniztion and support of the railroads. Believe me, as a former Freight Agent, the railroads do advertise where it counts!
Wally

30

what is the best way for the r.rs. to impress upon the public that r.rs. are important to them?

it will take a lot of money and a lot of understanding of who should hear the message and tailoring the message to the audience’s interests…

much discussion has been made in this forum about safety at grade crossings, passing thru r.r. property, etc. r.rs. must become more pro-active on presenting their views on these issues. the story must be posted in all the media: tv, papers, mags. this is a year-round project, not just until the acccidents go down… madd produces messages about duis all year long… the r.rs. must do the same… they should also visit schools every year and present talks, slide shows, interviews, etc., with students, to project the danger in violating safety rules pertaining to the r.rs. this would be very popular with students talking to r.r. employees who dress as they do on workdays, and handle q&a from students about anything r.r.-related, as in this forum. classes can hold talks afer the visit about what they have learned and write essays and hold picture contests about safety violations by “civilians”… it could spread to an area-wide movement about r.r. safety and kids helping kids to understand the dangers, and adults, too… this would work especially well in an area with intense r.r. activity ( an area in proximity to r.r. property where tresspassing is commonplace and close-calls and injuries are routine )

r.rs. should become more active in local issues involving r.r. safety, train movements that disturb nearby residents… minor problems to r.rs., but a big deal to those who live next door to the rail yard… r.rs. must project an image they have been not been good at for a hundred years, namely, that they care about the issues in communities where r.r. property is vandalized, stolen or otherwise tampered with…
r-roaders say, we’ve always cared about children crossing tracks, people awakened at night by engine horns and the theft of our custome

31

Sorry to always be the bearer of bad news, but this is a fine example of corporate welfare and a good reason not to waste hard earned profits on something silly like advertising. I sincerely hope this doesn’t offend the hard core railroaders, I’m sure in the case of UP, the unions ensured that you received your fair share of the $378 million in net income through big fat bonus checks. Something is wrong with the following picture:

UP posts strong numbers in face of soft 2002 economy

Union Pacific Corporation reported revenue for the fourth quarter ending Dec. 31 of $3.17 billion, up 5 percent from the year-ago quarter. Net income was $378 million up 37 percent.

Revenue for the fiscal year ended Dec. 31 was $12.5 billion, up 4 percent, while net income grew 39 percent to $1.34 billion from the year-ago period. Quarterly and annual results include the company’s Overnite motor cargo division.

Operating revenue from UP’s rail operations was $2.83 billion, up 4 percent, and operating income rose 1 percent to $562 million. Operating ratio was 80.1 percent compared with 79.7 percent. Revenue ton-miles increased 2 percent to 131.2 billion.

Rail operation’s revenue for 2002 grew 3 percent to $11.16 billion, and operating income jumped 12 percent to $2.25 billion. Operating ratio declined to 79.8 percent from 81.4 percent. Revenue ton-miles increased 3 percent to 518.7 billion.

UP said quarterly results were driven by strong revenue growth of 10 percent in the automotive segment, agricultural (8 percent), and industrial products (7 percent). Chemicals revenue grew 3 percent, while intermodal and energy revenues declined 2 percent and 3 percent respectively.

Despite strong results for 2002, UP plans to cut up to 1,000 jobs, or 2 percent of its work force, this year. About 300 people will be laid off by March and another 700 more positions will not be filled this year as people leave or retire. Union Pacific employs about 48,000 peo

32

Sir, Am I reading this right? Does that date say 1995? The date on my computer say’s 2003. That news was put out over 7 years ago. What does this article have to do with railroad advertising today? Please explain, so I understand the piont you are trying to make?
TIM A

33

gdc, Now that you cleared up some of the misunderstandings that I had. I will probably start a new thread. I have very little knowledge of railroads for I am an Electrical Engineer by trade. My two boy’s like watching trains. They got it from watching Thomas the Tank Engine. We do not get into it like some fans do. We do not know one engine from another.That is why I like visiting this sight. It helps us understand what we are watching.
TIM A

34

Tim, Contact Trains, they did an article on a group which has a full size thomas, they take it to train shows and exhibitions. The story quoted the lady running the program as saying that more kids and adults seemed to reconize thomas, and respond to the program than any thing she had ever seen before. Bet both your and your sons would have a blast.
Ed

35

Hi Tim, went looking, try trains mag, may 2001 issue, page 28. The group had Thomas at the Strausberg(sp) railroad muesuem.
Ed

36

If i know it went by train i will buy it.

37

gdc,
Yes Sir, you are correct. Now that I think about it, I was getting Public Relations confused with Advertising. I wish you would have told me this yesterday. I wasted 2 hours at the Library reading up on advertising when I should have been reading about Public Relations. Yes, you are correct again. They need to be handled differently.
But not to let the trip to the library be a total waste. I found some interesting facts while there on the skewed data over quality. The Librarian called the Chysler Neon plant in Belvidear Illinios. She spoke to a Mr. Rundard who works in Quality control. (Some library’s offer this service for free.) He said shipping Neons by rail results in a 3% damaged in transit rate. While shipping by truck results in a 16% damaged in transit rate. I’m still trying to get the Intermudol figure’s. Trucking and railroads are kind of secretive about there damage rates. Those figure’s are out there you just have to know were to look.
TIM A

38

Mike,
What does this responce have to do with railroad advertising? If you want to starte a thread on railroad finance’s I will be more then happy to responed.
TIM A

39

Tim, we service the volkswagon/volvo facility at the port of houston. To clue you in, we are not, under any circumstances allowed to kick a empty or loaded tri or bi level autorack. They can not be used as bumpers, you can not kick against them. We are forbidden to allow any autorack to roll free, for any eason. Sounds like we take car of them?
Good job on research, keep digging…
Ed

40

I wish I had thought about the difference earlier too, but PR and advertising were not my field. Rail operations and forensic accounting were. I’m impressed with what you appear to want to learn and the depth of your questions. In 35+ years, I’ve not met anyone who wanted to learn to the extent you do. Do you have a major university near you? If so, you would probably do well in their transportation curricula.
As I recall, this all got started when you son asked you why a siding appeared to be unused? Is he still as interesed in railroads? Would you also like to discuss matters that would be of interest to him?
Public Relations and Advertising. Railroads do both. Sometimes it’s not apparent to the public and sometimes it is.
Which thread would you like to follow? I’ll do my best to answer.
Regards and have a safe day. gdc