Why has DC power all of a sudden become ADC?

Model Railroader Electronics and DCC
1

Why have DC control systems all of a sudden become ADC? Is it to keep up with DCC which has three letters? Did you DC people start thinking you were being snubbed because you didn’t have the same amount of letters in the description of your chosen method of powering? My guess is that it is an attempt to show that the system takes AC power and converts it to DC. Shouldn’t it really be ACDC? Or, is ACDC not used because then it would be confused with the Rock Band by that name? Also, by that standard, shouldn’t the DCC guys actually be using ACDCC? So, the DC guys would still be behind in letter count. Is this what the neighborhood “shrink” might call letter count envy?

Maybe it’s because with our new Computer Techno Society, names must change every couple years; so, that we have to re-learn/re-think things many multiple times during our overly confused lifetimes.

I’m sure someone will take the above as a serious question and feel a need to explain the reason for the change to all of us of less tech. savy!

[soapbox]

2

Where did you see the ancronym “ADC”?

It could mean a number of things, including Analog Direct Current. The terms DC and DCC could be confusing so it may be an attempt to lessen confusion.

The typical meaning in the digital world is analog to digital converter, a device that converts an analog signal to digital values.

3

“I do not run DCC, i still use ADC”.

4

is there a difference between DC and ADC? is there such a thing as an ADC throttle?

i found nothing to answer the question when I googled ADC throttle and variations

5

It would be really useful to know where that quote came from? I suspect it might have been right here on this forum? - tomikawaTT, aka Chuck?

But I do suspect Betamax is correct and the user is refering to “analog direct current”, which would be differernt from my control system since I use digital direct current - my Aristo wireless throttles use square wave full voltage pulse wave modulation just like a DCC decoder to control motor speed.

Analog would imply simple varable voltage regulation of speed.

My control system had lots of letters and fancy names long before DCC came along - it was called MZL control by its creator in the 1970’s, and is part of a group of control methods called “Advanced Cab Control”, or ACC, by Paul Mallery.

On a related note, if anyone has seen the latest copy of Model Railroader, there is an piece about the control system on the Elmhurst Model Railroad Club - it is basically a digital touch screen version of my system, done with PLC’s rather than relays.

But of course they still needed relays for the power distribution.

They are mixing DCC and DC at the same time - I could do that as well, just like they are doing.

Sheldon

6

Maybe it means Anti Direct Current [:O]

7

Another attempt to start a discussion. lol

Rich

8

It was nice to hear about Sheldon’s system again.[}:)][:D]

Joe

9

Here is one of the places I have seen ADC used. The referenced term is in the first paragraph of this thread:

http://cs.trains.com/mrr/f/744/t/240200.aspx

10

If you read through that thread, you will see the OP isn’t familiar with many terms used. I believe he came up with that on his own assumption of there being DIGITAL DC versus ANALOG DC …

Mark.

11

Nobody should doubt how perceptive you are, Rich! LOL!!! [bow]

12

Analog Train Control. Sounds like something a LION would build. LION has Analog Automation on the layout of him.

Think of it like a subway train (no wait, it is a subway train). The power is always on, the LPP driving the train slows down and then stops at the stations. How did he do that what iwth no computers, no throttles, no brakes, no reversing switches? Sub stations (ok, I only have one 10.2 volt x 10 amp regulated power supply) keep track power steady. Left rail is GROUNDED, right rail gets the power from the sub station, just as if it were the third rail in the city.

The Power rail is gapped, and the gaps bridged with 5.1 ohm resistors. The train slows down as it approaches the stations. The last gap is not bridged, so the train stops. A time clock pulls a relay across the exit gap and the train starts, it picks up speed as it crosses more bridged gaps until at last it is drawing full voltage again.

That’a all it is. Real simple. LION just watches the trains of him run and run and run. Him operates the tower at 242nd Street. Just that, nothing more.

Well, him did add hundreds of relays, but that is for the signal system, and it will prevent the clock from releasing a train if the next station down the line is already occupied, but that is a different system entirely.

Did I say that there was no reversing switch? Subway trains do not go backwards, the signal system does not permit this, and there is another train only a few seconds behind yours. And a T/O who backs his train without permission is also without a job.

Anyway. The LION likes what him built, and so him never gets tired of telling you about it. As far as ADC goes, LION been building trains for 50 years: Hime never herd of it. But then the only herds him is interested in is of Wildebeests.

ROAR

13

Yes, I believe I too have had conversations on this forum with that poster and he is refering to “analog direct current”.

Why does my spell check only work on some parts of this forum/web site?

Sheldon

14

Looks like someone who is getting into “analysis paralysis”, where the more study is done the more confusing it becomes.

Making up your own terminology doesn’t help either, as it just confuses the issue and adds more confusion later. Analog DC is an oxymoron, as DC control is by its very nature analog. Digital DC just adds to the confusion, as the two technologies are mutually exclusive.

Whatever he wants, it looks like a custom solution…

15

Mark, had this been the only reference to ADC I had seen, I would agree with you. However, I’m unable to remember exactly where I have seen ADC used before; but, assure you this is not the only time.

16

The only reference I can find for ADC with reference to our hobby is “Analog to Digital Converter” …

http://www.susa.net/wordpress/2012/10/picmosfet-pwm-model-train-controller/

Mark.

17

Perhaps PM Railfan misused the term.

Rich

18

Hopefully this [2c] worth will provide some clarity.

ADC refers to nothing other than ‘Analog Direct Current’. Not suprising most havent heard of this as 99% of us are model railroaders, not electricians. Ask an electrician what DCC is and he will be scratching his head. And before DCC ever became DCC… what did you call it? You didnt call it anything because it didnt exist.

Analog DC, or the term rather, has been around for quite some time. I see quite often the ill-worded “old style DC” or “straight DC” all the time. ‘Analog’ refers to the waveform of the DC electrical signal and is an accepted word of description in the electrical trade. ‘Old’ and ‘straight’ arent as they have nothing to actually do with DC power. Matter of fact ‘straight’ would be a better description of the DCC waveform, not the ADC waveform. Power isnt measured in ‘old style’ or ‘straight’, its measured or viewed by its waveform. ADC is rolling waves (no straightness) while DCC looks like a cityscape (lots of straightness). But BOTH are DC.

In the case of Model Railroading we pretty much use a form of DC power. But which kind? There are many forms. For the sake of discussion among old and new alike, and for clarity, ADC or ‘Analog DC’ has been used for many decades that i can recall. Ever since i was taught to read scopes. As hobbyists, not electricians, we just call it ‘old’ or ‘straight’ dc and leave it at that being the “accepted” descriptive terms. And when an old term like ADC comes up - we question it.

Lest yee not forget, power is power no matter what form it takes. Analog power is natural. Man makes AC, and also… DCC. Never assume when in the Model RR realm when talking about power that if someone says DC

19

There, we have it! A definitive answer to the question! ADC is real and been in use for a long while. I can see the acronym ADC as being applicable and maybe even necessary, if there is such a thing as Digital Direct Current (DDC).

Since I am firmly a Digital Command Control user and look upon all control systems as simply a means of operating trains, the realm of DC operation is out of my jurisdiction and holds little interest for me. Good luck and best wishes to all you ADC and DDC users!

Mark

20

Mark,

Which DCC system do you use?

Do you use wireless throttles?

Do you have any detection, CTC or signaling?

What about your turnouts, how do you control them?

Do you do much speed matching or consisting?

I have operated a lot of DCC layouts, some are better than others. But for me personally, signaling, CTC and prototype interlockings are very important. These things are equally complex with or without DCC, and with or without computerization.

My control system also includes ATC, or Automatic Train Control, just like the prototype had on many CTC controlled lines. If a train runs a red signal, it just stops.

My signaling, CTC and turnout controls work with DC or DCC and does not use computers.

Tell me about your controls.

Sheldon