Williams' Erie Lackawanna ALCO FB-1 Units:

Classic Toy Trains Forum
1

Please, can anyone inform me if Williams, (when just Williams), ever made a second ‘B’ unit, at any time, for their item # 1003-E.L. RR., in addition to the ONE ‘B’-Dummy unit road # 725B?

I have found out, like Erie RR. before the 1960 merger, that E.L. RR. classified their
ALCO FA-1 and FB-1 units as an ‘A-B-B-A’ four set ‘LOCOMOTIVE’ and any reference made to a LOCOMOTIVE meant only the four unit set. If, referring to one of the individual diesels, in the set, (LOCOMOTIVE), then it’s road number designation would be used.

Since, I want to keep within prototypical operation, I want to have the correct number of units and if Williams never specifically made a second ‘B’ unit, with a different road number, then I will have to buy another ‘B’ unit road #725B and renumber it.

Thank you,

Ralph

2

Besides being an F unit diesel was it an F-3 or F-7? There is a size differance even in model trains between the two number designations, being F-3 or F-7.

As to Williams making an F unit set with four engines, very unlikely it was ever made. You would be better off to buy another B unit and re-number it or buy another A-B unit and add it to the engine consist. When I have more than two diesel units together, like an A-B-A, I like for two of them to be powered as I find that the unpowered units add a lot of weight to a train.

What color is the Erie Lackawanna paint job? Is it near the Pennsy Brunswick Green?

Lee F.

3

Lee F.,

Thank You, for your offer.

I E-Mailed you, with a reply to your offer.

The color-paint-scheme of the Williams # 3001 E.L. RR. ALCO two FA-1 ‘A’s’ and one FB-1 ‘B’ is; Black roof; Gray bodies, with a wide horizontal maroon stripe and two thin horizontal yellow stripes.

I, agree with you, for me to buy another FB-1 Dummy and renumber it, as from the research I’ve done of Williams’ products, only A-B-A units were made, where as, the prototypical E.L. RR. had as one of their designated ‘LOCOMOTIVES’ a four set consist: A-B-B-A. As, you point out, with all of the weight involved of three dummies and other freight, or passenger cars, another motorized unit would help, even though my one power unit has two momentum-flywheel powerful motors.

My, Williams FA-1’s 7252/3 and the FB-1 725B, therefore the second FB-1 will be 725C, similar to the E.L. RR. numbering system.

Take Care and Thank you,

Ralph

4

F3s and F7s are EMD locomotives and are the same size. FA-1s and FB-1s are Alco locomotives.

5

Thank you, Lee F. and Bob N.,

For your helpful information.

I am not too familiar with Williams’ products and thought that at some other time, in their existence, that they came out with a second ALCO FB-1 dummy unit, with a different number, other than 725B, because the E.L. RR. used a four unit set in their prototypical operations and numbering system, having a, two ‘FA-1’ and two FB-1, four set unit, classified as a ‘LOCOMOTIVE’, arrangement of ‘A-B-B-A’ and each having a different number, than the other.

Though, the only Williams’ catalogs that I have, 2006/7, P. 5, show just one FB-1 #725B dummy unit and I thought that Williams, some time in their existence, came out with a second ‘FB-1’ dummy unit and it having a different number, than the other, in being more prototypical, as the E.L. RR.

I, received two ALCO FA-1units, one powered and the other a dummy, for this Christmas past, then I find out that there is a ‘FB-1’ dummy unit.
I, finally find a place that has the ‘FB-1’ dummy unit #725B, which I ordered.
I, then, research the E.L. RR. web page to find out that their ‘LOCOMOTIVE’ set consisted of a four unit set, all having different numbers, with a consist arrangement, as aforementioned.

To complete my set, I must order a second ‘FB-1’ dummy unit and renumber it, differently than #725B.
I, just wanted to be sure that Williams made only one ‘FB-1’ dummy unit #725B and no other, with a different number, that’s why I asked the members of this forum, as most are familiar with Williams’ products.

Again, thank you gentlemen,

Ralph

6

Also not sure of exact dates but back in either late 80’s or early 90’s I think they did 2 different B-units for some of the trains I know for sure they did for sharknose units you could get one with a form of engine sound and as you first took off it would say something like engine 786 clear to go and then you would hear engine 786 departing.

Also had a B-unit that had no sound not sure if they were same number or not but seems they were and then had a A-unit that was just dummy as I use to have this set up in A-B-B-A in B&O. and believe lioneroar88 still does but not sure if his are williams but believe they are

7

Ralph,

I find it very useful to run two powered F-7 diesels with my Williams Santa Fe ‘el Capitan’ set of six passenger cars, otherwise I have to give the one engine almost full throttle to pull all six passenger cars. My F-7 Santa Fe has two motors in it, also I removed the reverse board and installed a bridge rectifier and gained a small amount of power.

Lee F.

8

RT,

Thank you for your concern and information.

I will keep searching

Ralph

9

Lee F.,

I know what you are talking about, needing two power units for freight cars and especially the metal passenger cars with it’s added weight, even if they are made of aluminum.

Thank you,

Ralph