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Classic Trains General Discussion
481

Hi Tom -

Thanks for posting the British DMU images. They have made considerable strides since the days of the Leyland railbuses in comfort, safety and performance levels for DMUs. As usual, we are light-years behind them in this technology.

Metra has had an interest in in the past in acquiring FRA-compliant DMUs for their proposed “STAR” project (O’Hare-Hoffman Estates-Joliet; about 55 miles one-way, including 35 or so on or along the EJ&E). Will be interesting to see if it remains DMU or reverts to loco-hauled, and from that if both European and Asian vendors propose in response to the solicitation.

Have another question, completely unrelated to DMUs, and that is can anyone tell me the number series SSW used on their “American Flyer” style coaches? Have a slide of one on the back of a train in Dallas in 1953, but even when projected on the wall can’t absolutely convince myself if the car is the 2701 or whatever. Appreciate whatever help any of you can offer!

482

Hello artpeterson

Glad you like the BR Pix![tup]

My limited knowledge of the SSW and their American Flyer coaches reveals that “200” was the number series for their “chair cars.” Perhaps passengerfan Al will be along in a bit with some amplifying info …

Check us out over a “Our” Place - you’ll find it much more interactive and fun![tup]

Later!

Tom[4:-)][oX)]

483

Hello artperson, Saw your inquiry about the so called American Flyer Coaches of the SSW hope this helps.

The Southern Pacific and its subsidiaries would purchase large numbers of streamlined cars for service in certain trains and at the same time other streamlined car purchases would be to make up entire streamlined trains. The year 1937 would mark the year that the Southern Pacific and both of its major subsidiaries Texas & Pacific and Cotton Belt would receive their first streamlined cars. The Southern Pacific and Texas & New Orleans would introduce complete streamlined trains that year while the Cotton Belt would receive 10 lightweight semi streamlined 76 revenue seat Coaches 400 - 409 from Pullman Standards old Osgood Bradley plant that were referred to as American Flyer cars.
These were the only so called American Flyer Coaches to ever be purchased by the Southern Pacific or any of its subsidiaries. The only named train these cars ever operated in was the overnight LONE STAR LIMITED between Dallas and St. Louis. These were the only lightweight cars ever assigned to the LONE STAR LIMITED. The Cotton Belt renumbered the cars 200 – 209 in June 1940. These cars were eventually transferred to the parent Southern Pacific who renumbered them for operation in Peninsula commuter trains between San Francisco and San Jose as well as several other assignments. The transfer to Southern Pacific took place as passenger services on the Cotton Belt ended in 1952. The cars were transferred to SP Pacific lines in June 1952 and assigned four digit SP numbers at that time.

76-REVENUE SEAT COACHES Pullman/Bradley November 1937 (Built for and assigned to General Service)

400 – 409

Renumbered June 1940

200 – 209

Southern Pacific renumbering of these cars after transfer to Pacific Lines
June 1952

2350 ex SL-SW 200 originally 400

2351 ex SL-SW 203 originally 403

July 1956

2203 ex SL-SW 2

484

Hi Al -

As always, thanks much for the info!

485

Hi Tom

You were absolutely correct - my back IS aching today![swg] And I’m spending this day indoors - not quite what the grandkids wanted, but . . . .

As you know, we’ve had a whopper here in the NYC area. But now we are headed for a warm up, so the mess will just change in appearance. Hope that basement work we had done a few years ago holds up!!

Here’s something just for you, Tom in two parts:

Domes - BY NAME

[quote]
QUOTE: “Astra Domes” - General Motors
“Astra Domes” - UP

“Big Domes” - ATSF full domes
“Big Domes” - Auto Train ex ATSF cars

“Colorados” - Holland America Colorado Railcar “ultradomes”

“Dome Cars” - Amtrak
“Dome Cars” - N&W
“Dome Cars” - Southern
“Domeliners” - UP trains with dome cars(generic)
“Domes” - Holland America (generic to differentiate from ‘colorados’)

“Goldleaf Domes” - Rocky Mountaineer (honorary)
“Great Domes” - GN

“Hi-Level” or “High-Level” - ATSF “El Cap” lounges(honorary)
“Hi-Level” or “High-Level” - Amtrak ex-ATSF lounges(honorary)

“Lounge in the Sky” - NP rebuilt sleepers
“Luxury Domes” - Transcisco

“Maxi Domes” - Ferrovias Mexicanas ex US baggage cars cars
“Maxi Domes” - Auto Train ex UP cars
“Mini Domes” - Auto Train ex WP cars

“Park” cars - CP Rail observation domes
“Park” cars - VIA Rail observation domes
“Planetarium” dome - IGN
“Planetarium” domes - MP
“Planetarium” dome - T&P
“Pleasure Domes” - ATSF short domes
“Princess Domes” - Amtrak ex Princess Tours cars
“Princess Domes” - Princess Tours ex-MILW cars

“Scenadomes” - Holland America Westours
“Sceneramic Domes” - CN
“Scenic Domes” - CP Rail (all)
“Sightseer Lounges” - Amtrak Superliner lounges(honorary)
“Skyline” cars - CP Rail ‘midtrain’ do

486

Hey Lars

Good to hear from you and I’m glad to know that you’ve survived the storm!![swg]

Thanx for the Dome listing and Part deux is looked forward to . . .

I really enjoyed those MoPac and IC Pix you Posted over at the bar, very nice and very much appreciated![tup]

Catch ya later!

Tom[4:-)][oX)]

487

G’day!

A few more Brit Rail Pix . . .

BR Class 156 Northern Rail (from: public domain)

BR Class 375 Electrostar (from: public domain)

BR Class 171 Southern (from: public domain)

That’s it - Enjoy!

Tom[4:-)] [oX)]

488

Good Morning!

All this talk of British Rail - time for a map!

Later!

Tom[4:-)] [oX)]

489

G’day,

Final installment of Brit Trains for awhile . . .

BR Class 460 Gatwick Express (from: public domain)

BR Class 323 Central Trains (from: public domain)

BR Class 390 Virgin Valiant (from: public domain)

Enjoy!

Tom[4:-)] [oX)]

490

Hi tTom

Just popped in from the bar to see what’s going on. I see it’s just YOU! Back to that stage again, huh[?]

Between the Brit stuff over here and the Santa Fe over at the bar, I can’t tell heads from tails![swg] You’ve got me hopping all over the place.

So, here’s what I’m going to do - I think I’ll just enjoy your pix and take a bye until the next time. Fair enough[?]

Until the next time!

Lars

491

Hi Tom and all.

I have a few notes on the British pics Tom as posted I hope that they will add to the great photos.
On page 24
The first three are of the 170 class of Diesel Multiple Units.
The first in the new Scotrail livery looks to be in Edinburgh Waverley station.

The second in Central colours,the location as got me puzzled I think it is on the line between Wolverhampton and Birmingham and it is maybe a grade crossing in the background it so it could be at Dudley Port . Can any one help [?].

The third is a One( formerly Anglia) 170 at Cambridge. Possibly on a working to Norwich in the background is a class 317 EMU.

On page 25.
#1 is a Metro-Cammell class 156 DMU at Lancaster. it is on a Morcambe working probably reversing here having arrived over the lightly used line from Leeds through Skipton and Carnforth.

#2 A 375 third rail EMU at I, believe, at London Victoria on a Kent Coast working.
These are fairly new units having replaced the 1950s & 60s slam door stock

#3 A Southern class 171 DMU ,for working on the non electricfied lines south of London. These units replacing the Diesel-Electric Multiple Units which have worked since the late 50s. The 171 is at the 2004 Railfest held at York Railway Museum.

#4 One of the new EMUs for the London (Victoria)- Gatwick Airport service. These units replaced the class 73 Electro- diesels which previously worked the service.

#5 A class 323 EMU unit in use by Central Trains. These work services in the West Midlands of England. This unit is at Coseley station, I believe.

#6 A Virgin Pendelino tilting train at Carlise. These trains work on the 25kv overhead electric system on the West Coast Main Line. They have recently set the fastest regular passenger schedule between London and Glasgow of 4 hours 24min. for the 401 miles.
I hope these notes are of interest
Oh well back to Our Place well worth a visit. Pet

492

Greetings Lars & Pete!!

Great to see ya and appreciate the visits![tup]

Thanx very much Pete for the elaborations and I hope there’s someone “out there” to pick up on your question. Doubt it, as this thread is verrrrrrrrrrrrrry quiet![tdn]

See ya at the bar . . .

Tom[4:-)] [oX)]

493

Good Morning Tom thought I would add this piece for fans of the B&O.

BALTIMORE
&
OHIO Streamlined Headend Cars
by Al

The B&O received two identical eight car streamlined trains in 1935 from American Car & Foundry. The only difference in the two trains was the materials used in their construction. The train delivered to the B&O to operate as the ROYAL BLUE between Washington and Jersey City was constructed of Aluminum with only the car center sills of steel. The new ROYAL BLUE entered service June 24, 1935 round trip daily.
The second train made of lightweight mild steel called Cor-Ten entered service July 1, 1935 on B&O subsidiary Chicago and Alton between Chicago and St. Louis round trip daily as the ABRAHAM LINCOLN. Each consist was identical and the first car in each train was a Baggage 30’Railway Post Office Car. Car 5750 was the Aluminum car operating in the ROYAL BLUE and 5751 was the steel car operating in the ABRAHAM LINCOLN.
Both Baggage 30’ Railway Post Office cars 5750 and 5751 were rebuilt in 1936 in B&O Mt. Clare shops with no change of numbers. The 5750 being rebuilt to a Baggage 44-Revenue seat Coach in July 1936. The 5751 being rebuilt to a Baggage Buffet 24-Revenue seat Coach in November of that year.
Beginning July 26, 1937 the ROYAL BLUE consist began operating round trip daily on the Chicago & Alton as the ABRAHAM LINCOLN between Chicago and St. Louis. The original ABRAHAM LINCOLN was renamed the ANN RUTLEDGE on that same date. The C&A became the first railroad in the lucrative Chicago – St. Louis market to offer twice-daily round trip streamliner service.
During April 1942 the C&A rebuilt the 5750 into a straight 60-revenue seat coach and renumbered the car 5807.

BAGGAGE 30’ RAILWAY POST OFFICE CARS American Car & Foundry June 1935 (Built for and assigned to ROYAL BLUE and ABRAHAM LINCOLN)

B&O
ROYAL BLUE

5750

C&A
ABRAHAM LINCOLN

5751

494

Morning!

A little something to supplement Al’s B&O “Theme” - a map!

Baltimore & Ohio (B&O) (1876) [Wikimedia Commons]

Enjoy!

Tom[4:-)][oX)]

495

G’day!

[quote]
QUOTE: History of the B&O Railroad from: www:http://meyersdale.org/rr_history/borailhistory.html

1827 – The Baltimore & Ohio Railroad (B&O), our nation’s first common carrier railroad, was chartered on Feb. 28 in Baltimore.

1828 – Construction of the B&O begins July 4, 1828.

1833 – President Andrew Jackson boards a B&O passenger coach at Relay, Maryland, in June and travels to Mt. Clare Depot in Baltimore, becoming the first U.S. President to ride a railroad.

1844 – The B&O Railroad signs its first commercial contract in February to haul large quantities of coal from Western Maryland coalfields from Mt. Savage, Md., to Mt. Clare, Md.

1844 – On May 24, Samuel F.B. Morse sends the first telegraph message from the basement of the Supreme Court Building on Washington, D.C. to the Mt. Clare Depot. The message “What God hath wrought” was transmitted across overhead wires following the B&O’s Washington Branch. The message was received by Alfred Vail and Ezra Cornell in the little passenger depot at Mt. Clare. For the first time in the history of mankind, two persons communicated out of sight and 40 miles apart.

1902 – President William McKinley passed through Meyersdale enroute to the Baer-McKinley wedding in September. A large number of people were at the station.

1948 – The B&O’s last steam locomotive #5594, Class T-3C rolls out of Mt. Clare’s erecting shop in Baltimore on October 16.

1952 – President Harry S. Truman stopped at the Meyersdale station on a “whistle stop” campaign on behalf of Democratic candidates running in the November election. More than 5,000 people were estimated to be on hand to see him.

1952 – A steam engine and twin-engine diesel engine sideswiped in a violent cra***hat tore up track just east of the Keystone Crossing near Sand Patc

496

Hello Tom

What ho! Another “Theme!” Good golly Miss Molly!! Okay - here’s something to add:

Name trains of the Baltimore and Ohio (B&O)

These may not be all inclusive, but should provide a sufficient number to jog some memories out there![swg][tup]

Until the next time!

Lars

497

G’day!

Nice to see ya again, Lars! Looks like between you and Al this has become a “threesome” Thread.[swg]

An ENCORE! of a previously Posted pix:

B&O #5551 Sky Dome (courtesy: www.trainweb.com)

Later!

Tom[4:-)][oX)]

498

I think I placed this in the forum before. Anyway enjoy Lars and Tom.

Baltimore
&
Ohio
(B&O)
Dome Cars
by AL

The B&O purchased a pair of Pullman Standard 8-car coach streamliners following WWII for Baltimore-Chicago service. The two trains were delivered to the B&O in May 1949 and entered service as the COLUMBIANS May 5, 1949. The fourth car in each consist of the COLUMBIAN was a Strata-dome coach.
All cars in the COLUMBIAN trains were numbered and named the two Strata-dome coaches were 5550 HIGH DOME and 5551 SKY DOME. These cars seated 42 on the main level of the cars 18 forward of the dome and 24 aft of the dome. Beneath the dome was a pair of comfortable lounges for passengers to relax in; one of these lounges seated 6 the other 11. The domes were only 15’ 3” above the rails giving these two Strata-domes the distinction of being the lowest height short domes operated in North America. Upstairs in the dome of the two Pullman Standard built Strata-domes were 24 seats arranged in six pairs on either side of the center aisle. The backs of the seats were lower than those found in any other dome cars. One feature found on the B&O Strata-Domes not found on others was on the forward bulkhead of the car above the aisle was located a speedometer, clock, altimeter and barometer.
In December 1950 the B&O purchased three Strata-dome sleeping cars from the C&O and after updating these virtually new cars that had never entered service for their original owner assigned them to the CAPITOL LIMITED and SHENANDOAH. These Budd built cars dated to August 1956. After purchase by the B&O before entering scheduled service the cars made a brief visit to Pullman for upgrading for sleeping car service. At the short end of the car forward of the dome on the main level was 5 roomettes. On the main level to the rear of the dome were 3 drawing rooms. Beneath the dome was a single bedroom, car attendants quarters and conductors office Upstairs the dome

499

Hi Al

I KNOW this was Posted either here or at the bar - or maybe BOTH! Nevertheless, always good reading![tup]

By the by - you can always do a “search” on this Thread - use the “advanced” feature - to ascertain whether you’ve previously Posted something.

Looks like YOU are the “theme setter” for this Thread - so what’ s in store for the 'morrow[?][swg]

Later!

Tom[4:-)] [oX)]

500

And finally (for me) tonight . . . something previously Posted on this Thread, but a “good fit” with what we’ve been talking about:

More on the Baltimore & Ohio Railroad (B&O) of the Fallen Flags from The Official Guide of the Railways - Aug 1956

Thrilled travelers tell us “There’s nothing like the view from B&O’s STRATA-DOME” …… Route your passengers via B&O and they’ll sing your praises too

Passengers traveling in a B&O Strata-Dome marvel at the thrilling panorama and natural beauty of the ever-changing scenery.

FLOODLIGHTS AT NIGHT

Powerful floodlight beams provide a novel view of the landscape after dark.

This exclusive B&O service between Washington and Chicago is offered at no charge!

Strata-Dome Dieseliners between

CHICAGO – AKRON – PITTSBURGH – WASHINGTON

The Capitol Limited (All Pullman) – The Columbia (Deluxe-Coach) – The Shenandoah* (Pullman and Coach)

THROUGH SERVICE TO AND FROM BALTIMORE, WILMINGTON, PHILADELPHIA AND NEW YORK.

*On the Shenandoah, Strata-Dome is operated on alternate dates. Available only to Pullman passengers on the Shenandoah.

BALTIMORE & OHIO RAILROAD

Enjoy! [tup]

Tom [4:-)] [oX)]