I thought I knew brass and brass values…well apparently not so. Yesterday on ebay with 28 minutes on left a factory painted Overland RS3 with raised hood and antennae, the price hit $6310 and I have no idea what the final selling price was. What am I missing here? I could have had an excellent brass builder and repair person build the extended hood to exact standards, and I could have easily painted it as well as the OMI model for under $500 on a basic $350 RS3. There were two guys in a bidding war which always drives prices up over current street value…but over $6300 for an HO single unit diesel??
Didn’t John Glaab, or was it Dan Glasure, in the most recent Brown Book, say or hope for the day when brass, relatively “under-appreciated” by serious collectors relative to other items that require significantly less labor to produce finally begins to be appreciated for what it really is?
Perhaps the glimmer of hope is indeed there, after the depressed prices on some brass the last several years. Perhaps this is a beginning of sorts–and brass will one day be appreciated for all the fine arts involved.
Perhaps I should have kept some of the brass I once had…but I had to have stuff that ran well, etc. etc.
Maybe this is just another step forward after that high-fallutin’ Sotheby’s brass auction so many years ago that realized serious dollars for pristine older brass.
I have found some pretty decent deals for brass on ebay but maybe I was just lucky OR no one else wanted what I was looking for…
A New York Central S-3 electric by Custom Brass, painted, lettered and a sweet runner $130.00!
A Precision Scale NYC Empire State Express set with Streamlined Hudson and six cars $700.00.
And a Westside Models B&O Q4b Mikado with Vanderbuilt tender and aux. water tender $225.00 another smooth runner with can motor. (unpainted)
I guess it all depends on the market at the time… set your own limits and bid within that range, then smile when the bidding gets out of hand and be glad you aren’t that crazy! I looked at that auction! There must be some Pennsy modelers out there with deep pockets! Bidding began at $685 and ended at $6310! There were three bidders above the 3K mark…
I don’t get into bidding wars. I set the price I’m willing to pay and let Ebay bid up to that price. If someone is willing to pay more than I think something is worth, I let them have it! I might be wrong about what something is worth and I guess I don’t care. All I can do, is figure out what I’m willing to pay for an item by doing due diligence and investigating what similar items are for sale for and stay true to that value. I really try to keep from allowing a purchase to become too emotional. I also keep in mind that there is nothing I really need on Ebay, only things I want.
The above has helped me keep from paying to much for anything I have ever bought on Ebay.
IIRC, someone makes a raised hood kit to take a standard RS3 and turn it into a “Hammerhead” RS3. Building it on one’s one can be cheaper than buying it.
This discussion brings up an issue with much ambiguity…pricing of brass. I see and know many who refer to ebay sales records as the most accurate barometer for pricing. This is completely wrong thinking as in the above exampe of the $450 OMI diesel selling for $6300+. When I was a seller on ebay I could go on for hours relating tales of some of the extremely hgh prices i received for not so great or rare models. All were due to two idiots in a bidding war with more bucks than common sense or most importantly…knowledge of the model they were doing cyber battle over. And then without an alternative plan on how to find such a model at a realistic and fair price, put fire on the mess.
Hey, if they are happy with shelling out big dollars, so be it. Just don’t think that the next RS-3 high hood or whatever is worth as much.
I was a brass dealer and professional appraiser for amost 20 years and sure most of the time for establishig a price I had to shoot from the hip. I would use records (if available of previous sales…mostly from dealer sales and at shows) Then I would use information such as knowing how many were imported and the original retail price, reputation of builder and importer, rarity scale, desirability of model and where it is to be marketed, condition of model and box, custom features such as paint and electronics, and still more. I have found that the three editions of the Brown Book, and Dan Glasure’s guide a help…but only in supplying the aforementioned information. I have found that the peak of brass sales can be traced back to early 1997, and then due to many reasons sales and interests began dwinding.
I sort of retired in 2005 from brass sales, and appraisng, but still follow the market, as my interest and appreciated of brass models never died. There does seem to be a slight comeback and interest now and prices are creeping up a bit…but still nowhere near the peak in 1997.
I think you covered it in the initial post - two knuckleheads got caught up in a bidding war, each just determined that they WILL own it, cost be damned. Be curious to follow that item and see if it comes up, because there’s a good chance that after they cool off and realize they just paid 10x what it probbaly is worth, they may try to back out. Third highest bidder may end up with it as the two overethusiastic ones both back out of the deal.
That kind of money might be able to buy a REAL RS3 off a scrap line somewhere.
Howard, I agree with your thoughts. It’s what a willing buyer, Blah, Blah, Blah… as the phrase goes. I haven’t bought and sold much on Ebay since it went to Pay pal. When I was active, I thought it was fun to determine a selling; or, buying price for items I was selling or interested in buying. I have also been involved in doing appraisals and it taught me a lot about how stupid buyers can be and ruthless sellers will be, so it truly is Caveat emptor!
This discussion brings up an issue with much ambiguity…pricing of brass. I see and know many who refer to ebay sales records as the most accurate barometer for pricing. This is completely wrong thinking as in the above exampe of the $450 OMI diesel selling for $6300+. When I was a seller on ebay I could go on for hours relating tales of some of the extremely hgh prices i received for not so great or rare models. All were due to two idiots in a bidding war with more bucks than common sense or most importantly…knowledge of the model they were doing cyber battle over. And then without an alternative plan on how to find such a model at a realistic and fair price, put fire on the mess.
Hey, if they are happy with shelling out big dollars, so be it. Just don’t think that the next RS-3 high hood or whatever is worth as much.
I was a brass dealer and professional appraiser for amost 20 years and sure most of the time for establishig a price I had to shoot from the hip. I would use records (if available of previous sales…mostly from dealer sales and at shows) Then I would use information such as knowing how many were imported and the original retail price, reputation of builder and importer, rarity scale, desirability of model and where it is to be marketed, condition of model and box, custom features such as paint and electronics, and still more. I have found that the three editions of the Brown Book, and Dan Glasure’s guide a help…but only in supplying the aforementioned information. I have found that the peak of brass sales can be traced back to early 1997, and then due to many reasons sales and interests began dwinding.
I sort of retired in 2005 from brass sales, and appraisng, but still follow the market, as my interest and appreciated of brass models never died. There does seem to be a slight comeback and interest now and prices are creeping up a bit…but still nowhere near the peak in 1997.
Well, it might have been worth $5995, but he took it out of the box and unwrapped it to take the photo. Since he let the “factory air” out of the box, it’s gotta be worth at least $1,000 less, now.
…or have I been hanging around tinplate collectors too long?
Well, to be sure that second RS-3 is not going to worth anywhere near $5995 simply because one of the two people looking for one got his. The second guy is not going pay that much and likely won’t have to get in a bidding war. I also think when the buyer of the first one comes back to earth or the wife sees his credit card bill he’ll be backing out of the deal anyway.
There are some people out there to whom money is no object, and if they “have” to have something, they will spend whatever it costs.
I collect Doctor Who hardback novels. Since the show has come back on, the few remaining books that I need regularly go for over £100 and up to £500 each. 10 years ago when I bought most of my collection, I rarely paid more than £10 for a book. I don’t feel that I absolutely need those last few books so I accept that my collection will always be incomplete.
The PRR collector who bought the hammerhead RS3 evidently feels differently.