I was reading the Ed Eliss Pullman story and they mentioned Ross Rowland and his Greenbrier Presidential Express and the story told us that CSX said no and left us hanging and or failed to follow up as to why…Could the editors call up Mike Ward CEO of CSX and ask him whats going on here?
My observation over time - CSX is not friendly to passenger rail. You’ll notice that you rarely, if ever, see any news about any excursions of any kind over CSX.
I suspect they handle the old Clinchfield Christmas train only because they’d seem like the Grinch if they pulled it.
Steam seems to get special attention - ie, not only no, but heck no!
My impression and recollection is that there were differences between ACE Coal and Ross Rowland and the people at CSX. Private and political.
Concur that this is private, but Mike Ward is certainly not the person to consult. Ask Jim Justice at the hotel, or Ross himself. The issue of CSX involvement applies much less, if at all, to the operating model that had the Greenbrier consist attached to the Cardinal.
This subject was done to death over on RyPN, and probably should not be done to death here.
Posted by tree68
on Wed, May 8 2013 8:24 AM
My observation over time - CSX is not friendly to passenger rail. You’ll notice that you rarely, if ever, see any news about any excursions of any kind over CSX.
I suspect they handle the old Clinchfield Christmas train only because they’d seem like the Grinch if they pulled it.
Steam seems to get special attention - ie, not only no, but heck no!
Larry
(Somehow, I failed to pick up Larry’s original post and comment. So went back in and added it above my response.)[:^)]
Perhaps you are very correct, Larry (tree68). My recollection of the stories drifting aroun
What is RPny Oh Railway Preservation News so where in this obscure publication is the debate?
Seems to me another case of self hating railfans not supporting there own
As I mentioned, it appears CSX is not receptive to excursions, etc. I suspect that this runs pretty deep in CSX management and all the pleading in the world would not change their minds. The railfans have nothing to do with it. If a railfan group showed up in JAX requesting permission to run an excursion, they’d probably get the bums rush.
I am tempted to post this gem on RyPN, but I myself would consider that to be trolling… ;-}
Those people aren’t the usual sort of railfans – they are in the business of historic preservation, and probably devote far more timethan the usual member of this forum to the specific kind of actual passenger-hauling operations that the Greenbrier Presidential Express project involved. Dismissing them as foamers is … well, I’d start with ‘inappropriate’. More descriptions would apply.
And if you can’t find debate over the Greenbrier Presidential Express in the RyPN Interchange, I’d have to suspect you either can’t read very well or need to learn to use search on a computer a bit better…
… Or he’s just trolling for reactions. [xx(] Maybe he could go hide under a bridge on the BNSF? [:-,]
Basing opinion on his prior posting, I haven’t had the impression he’s a troll. This is just a special case.
Yeah, very very special….
It seems to me that someone who seemingly has just become interested in railroad operations and is puzzled by a comment such as the one that CSX refuses to operate a special passenger movement or couple someone else’s cars to a scheduled train, he should not attempt to jump down the throat of whoever he thinks should have explained the situation fully, but should ask, politely, for more information. I appreciate the brief explanations given by those of us who have been familiar with the situation. I do not fault the writer of the comment for not going into the history of CSX’s position on operating passenger trains.
Granted, not all of us have been subscribing to Trains for sixty-one years and so have followed the development of freight railroads’ attitude towards passenger trains, but the majority of us are familiar with the current situation and are able to give a reasoned explanation.
I had no trouble finding articles on the Greenbrier Presidential Express. I did find an error in Wickipedia’s article–the Cardinal described as a daily train.
There’s that phrase again- self-hating railfans. Maybe you don’t mean to come off like this, but you come off as someone not interested in trains, but as someone interested in starting a fight. Can I suggest, that if you want to learn, ask questions and be respectful. If you just want to fight, go somewhere else? [:-^]
“Self -hating railfans?” Jeez, I don’t remember drinking any “Hater-Rade” lately.
Look me old son, here’s the thing, and I know it’s been discussed before but I’ll say a few things again.
There’s battles you can win, and there’s battles you’re better off not fighting. The fact is CSX doesn’t like passenger trains. They’d dump Amtrak if they could. They don’t want excursions, special runs, or things like the “Greenbriar Express.” They’re not in the business of entertaining railfans or the general public for that matter. They’re in business to move, ahem, “stuff” from Point A to Point B in the most efficient and profitable manner possible, and that’s all. Getting them to want to do otherwise is a battle you can’t win.
And you know what? That’s their right. It’s THEIR 'road. They call the shots. That’s how it should be. Mind you I’m not a CSX apologist, I’m not on the payroll to explain things for them. But I am a realist who sees the world as it is, not how I would like it to be. Maybe one day the CSX attitude will change, but that day’s not coming anytime soon. I can live with it.
I wondered about what you say, Wayne. CSX does not post here so I have no direct statements from them about Amtrak. I went to their website. They have a “Corporate Social Responsibility Report.” In their own words,
“CSX is fully committed to being a responsible corporate citizen and recognizes that safety, communitiy involvement and environmental stewardship help us to better serve our customers, shareholders and neighboring communities.”
I read the summary. They talk about health benefits for employees, a variety of environmental concerns, what they are doing for charity and other good things. But I did not see one single word about Amtrak.
As you so clearly point out CSX sets its own agenda. And as far as I can see Amtrak has no place on that agenda. I don’t want to diminish the good things or the community that CSX does but I find it hard to undersand how a railroad that makes an affirmative effort to be a responsible citizen could dismiss our national rail passenger system.
So until I learn otherwise I’ll have to assume you are correct about your assessment of CSX.
John
Hello John! What I’ve gotten about CSX and Amtrak I’ve gotten from various sources over the years, from “Trains” to various railfan publications to the business section of the local newspaper. Don’t ask me to quote “chapter and verse” because I can’t, but the word I’ve gotten is CSX tolerates Amtrak because they don’t have much of a choice. It’s that simple.
Wayne
I won’t ask you for a reference, Wayne. Actually I think I’ve seen it for myself. CSX claims they want community involvement; yet they reject involvement in the railroad community. But you are right; they have no choice about Amtrak.
John
“Its There Road” “They can do whatever they want”
WRONG! All Railroads in the USA are franshises granted by persmision of the Federal Goverment. Thats why they need PERMISSION to start or abandon there operations. Futhermore the railroad would not exist in the first place if not local towns put up there own money to buy stock and bonds in the railroad. As far as CSX goes the Ohio State Teachers Pension Fund is one of there largest stockholders and after that its the New York State Pension Fund.
And the other ruby slipper falls……