Hi,
Do any of you have a Athearn C44-9W. I’m thinking of getting one and was wondering what the deatil on these models is. I know some of you have some, just curious if you would be kind enough to get some close ups of the detail.
Also what is the speed comparasin between one of these and an Atlas/P2K unit?
Thanks
-dekruif
I assume you are talking about the RTR one not the blue box.
I have one of the RTRs. Right out of the box I had to do some modifications to make it fit for use on the layout. Whenever it would go around a curve less than a 32" radius it would just tip over. Not just derail but actually flop over on its side. This wasnt a track issue, any curve less than 32" would do this. So I took it apart and ran it without the shell and discovered that the front truck was actually getting up under the frame of the loco, it would lock there causing a derailment and a flop. It turns out the trucks have rediculous play in them, you can move them back and forth about 1/4" each direction. If you back up the loco and then take off forward you can actually see the trucks move before the rest of the engine follows. So I had to get out the dremel and cut away at the frame until the trucks had room to go wherever they pleased. It now tracks fine.
The next problem I encountered when i tried to plug a decoder into the quick plug, 3 of the wires were broken off from the board, had to replace those and redo a power pickup where for some reason they hadnt shaved off the paint where the pickup contacts the frame.
After getting it running well, i started, well, running it. It is light and doesnt pull well, so I added weight. But then I started breaking driveshafts left and right, so i took weight out.
Now I am left with an engine that runs reasonably well, doesnt pull worth a darn and still has that typical athearn noise.
The problem with these engines is that athearn has focused on looks far more than improving the quality of the driveline. The engine does look very nice, and while it is slightly quieter than a BB it is much less reliable. A P2K or Atlas will look about the same but run much better for you.
As far as the speed I cant really tell you since I speed matched all my locos. If you are using DCC it wont be an issue.
I keep seeing folks mention Atlas Dash 9s but I don’t ever recall seeing one and Atlas doesn’t mention any on their website. But their website only goes back to around 2000.
If you took the speed comparison question to be a Atlas Dash 9 that’s not what I was referring to. I was referring to a Atlas loco in general.
To my knowledge Atlas does not make a dash 9 .
-dekruif
Oh, my mistake, Atlas locos are great. They do make a dash 8 which is beautiful and the optional sound is very good too. I would have bought one but I already have the BLI AC6000 so i really couldnt justify it[:)]
If you are buying one for running be careful of what you buy, My athearn dash 9 was junk, wouldn’t run, and seriously was extremely loud for the half hour it did run! When I asked others on the forum about it, many reported the same problem with theirs. I would have bought six of them , but when I found it wouldn’t run that nixed my purchase.
I thought that we had this conversation before, but Nothing is as good as an Atlas when it comes to running (in my mind). The RTR Dash 9 is an excellent engine but they aren’t an upscale model. If you really want it to run well, you might spend the $30 and upgrade the engine and buy a Kato motor. I’ve bought 4 of them and it helps a lot.
I’ve got an old blue box and a new RTR model, first in CSX second in CN. Both do very well on my layout but needed some weight added, but that was all. I’ve also got two of the very simmilar AC4400 Athearn RTRs and I prefer my two Katos much better, less noise, better pulling power and better looks, however the Athearn models are far far cheaper. Cheers! ~METRO
Now for those that don’t want their “junk” Athearn send them to me…I’ll even pay the postage and after I get them I’ll turn them into smooth runners in about 30 minutes-thats allowing extra time since I have only 1 good hand to work with…[;)][:O]
Sorry Brakie, junk products I do not resell, or hand off. My Dash 9 made an excellent target for my son and his pellet gun. Even the shop that sold it to me couldn’t get that one to run, and the owner is highly qualified to do so. However rebuilding Athearn’s with another motor manufacturer is something I expect to do in the future. If Atlas currently had the engines I wanted in their line, I would not buy an Athearn.
Now tell me this David will your son when he gets older go and shoot at the real thing.
Well thats your lost and everybody’s else’s gain…I see Athearn RTR locos including the C44-9W running smoothly at the club every operation night…
Yes you can make them run smoothly (i did) but still, they are not even in the same bracket as Atlas, P2K or Kato. The athearn is still noisy after many hours of time to allow it to break in. And like i said they dont pull well without breaking shafts and you have to work on them to make them run. So they really arent ready to run at all. Now, its not a BAD engine, its decent. But for not much more money you can get a GREAT Kato, Atlas or P2K, and you can count on those to run well.
Joe, it sounds like maybe your loco had some rough handling before you bought, that caused your problems. Just a guess, because the trucks on them don’t normally have that much play and the wires shouldn’t snap by themselves. Maybe it got dropped or tossed causing the truck and wiring to get hosed?
The Athearn RTR’s are normally fine locos in my experience. I had (and still have) a Kato UP AC4400 when I later bought an Athearn RTR UP Flag unit (AC) thinking there’ no way I’ll like it better than that Kato. When I got it home and put them next to each other, I found out I was wrong. Details wise the RTR wins, paint wise I love them both. Next came the operations - again a slam dunk for the Kato, right? Well not exactly. The Kato drive train is better and likely always will be. But, the Athearn drive train is not shabby at all. Get this - it’s more powerful than the Kato or at least it’s heavier. Case in point - the RTR is geared slightly faster than the the Kato so when I consist the two together (without DCC adjusting speed tables) the RTR pulls the Kato when it’s in the lead, and it pushes the Kato when the Kato’s in the lead. It couldn’t do that if it weren’t heavier or even stronger. Further I don’t have any noise issues with it. It’s not swiss watch smooth and quiet like a Kato, but it’s still pretty smooth and quiet. I also have a Kato BNSF AC and a RTR BNSF wedgie. Same story.
Now, don’t mistake this as a trashing of the Kato’s. Far from it - I really love the ones I have. No they are not for sale and I would certainly buy them again if I had to do it over and would recommend them to others. But, my point is that I personally don’t think the Athearns are garbage either. I like them about as much as the Kato’s.
PS - I’ve also got several of the Atlas dash 8’s (B’s and C’s std and wide cabs) and they are fine locos too. I do have some operational
I am going to really restrain my reply here because you are a fellow NSer. I played with blocks when I was little, I didn’t grow up to be a mason. I played with cars and didn’t grow up to be a mechanic. Now I play with model railroad locomotives, that doesn’t make me an engineer. I just enjoy myself and have a few less dollars in my pocket.
Breaking driveshafts are indicative of a geardrive problem. If the geardrive is in normal working order, the wheels should simply slip on the rails and spin in place if the train is too heavy for the loco to pull. If the gears are locking up because of improper lubrication, excessive play, bad maintenance, unusual wear, or manufacturing defects, that’s when a motor’s torque will cause a driveshaft to break (can’t turn a frozen geartrain).
I don’t know if the Athearn RTR C44-9W is fundamentally different, but the Blue Box C44-9W I got was built like a tank. Heavy cast zinc frame, the tried-and-true Athearn BB mechanism with the brass worms in the trucks (never broke a driveshaft yet), no wierd/excessive play in the trucks. I could add more weight inside the shell to further increase the tractive effort, but it can pull 20-car-long trains as it is so I left it alone.
It doesn’t have good detail nor is it quiet (has that famous Athearn growl, which quieted down some after I did the toothpaste gear-polishing breaking-in procedure and a proper lube job), but it pulls quite well and holds up good in extended operating sessions, and has been reliable for the past 2 years I’ve owned it.
It’s perfect for those who want to kitbash/detail/paint their own, and cheap too… Picked up mine for $25.
I guess it depends on what you want. If you don’t want to spend the time to detail/paint, by all means grab a Kato.
You are right that the driveshafts shouldnt break, and they didnt until i added weight to the loco. With more weight the wheels have more traction on the rails and therefore are harder to spin. After I removed the weight the shafts stopped breaking but the loco wont pull very well at the stock weight.
In any case I have always found the athearn hex-drive shafts flimsy. I broke probably a dozen among the 3 genesis SD70s that I used to have. Most likely it wont be a problem for most people, but i like to run long trains, occasionally over 150 cars. Kato and P2K use basically the same type of driveshafts as the athearns, but either the manufacturing or the plastic is better, I havent broken any P2K shafts and have only had one Kato break. Now the old athearn sectional shafts are nearly indestructable, however they do make a little noise.
Speaking of drive shafts I snap one in a Atlas/Kato RS11…It was MY FAULT…I was showboating and trying to pull 70 cars while working the yard…The engine stalled by slipping the wheels and I reverse the engine to shove some cars back into the yard…I heard a faith “SNAP!” and that was all she wrote…The RS11 rear wheels was still spending though…
Joe,With respect…I no longer own any P2Ks and have no plans on buying another P2K anything…I still have a bitter taste after replacing gears in ALL of my P2K Geeps.I am still reading and hearing about P2K locomotives having problems mostly different speeds cause by their many different gear ratios that LL used.I even heard of crack gears in the GP38-2 and GP60…I don’t know first hand but,heard reports of such on line,at the club and while railfaning.
I have two Blue Box Dash 9’s and one RTR. The detail on the RTR is much better, the handrails are quite nice and the paint job is one of the best. The RTR is quieter and seems to pull adequately (though I haven’t tried to pull 150 cars with it) and have not broken any drive shafts. The BB’s required more work to convert to DCC although calling the RTR DCC ready is a bit misleading since they use a 9 pin socket which isn’t really standard. If you use a Digitrax decoder there’s no problem since they are a direct plug-in. I have experienced that paint over the electrical pick-up problem unit mentioned in another post but not on the Dash 9 RTR unit. I would say buy the RTR particularily if you can get them on sale.