Thanks again Chad, I will take your advice. When I removed the worm drive and drive shaft and saw how fast the motor spun I was surprised. But then the wheels also moves freely without the worm drive installed too. This is a new loco and has had only a couple of runs an
Anytime!
Please PM me if you ever find the root cause of the issue.
I’m going to go do a little de greasing on mine & then re-assemble it.
Kinda glad we opened her up! Ha hah.
Yeah, I’d like to hear more, too. Bachmann’s CVs are baffling. If anyone finds anything better than the weak factory documentation, that would be helpful.
Oh, another tip. A dab of contact cleaner - I use CRC 2-26 - on the wheel-contact interface at the bearing/sideframe helps some, too.
Now that I’m thinking about it, they blacken that metal truck sideframe. I suppose it’s conductive? It still may be worth disassembly to clean that area up, then apply CRC 2-26?
Paul
It sounds like you have electrical experience, so soldering isn’t a big deal to you. I have several 44 tonners, even after installing a better decoder the operation was erratic. So what I did was trash the board and hard wire the decoder directly. The capacitors that Rich spoke of earlier are still on that board, but they aren’t as obvious as they used to be. Operations smoothed out and it runs perfectly.
My experience is on the website below,
[quote user=“Geared Steam”]
Paul
It sounds like you have electrical experience, so soldering isn’t a big deal to you. I have several 44 tonners, even after installing a better decoder the operation was erratic. So what I did was trash the board and hard wire the decoder directly. The capacitors that Rich spoke of earlier are still on that board, but they aren’t as obvious as they used to be. Operations smoothed out and it runs perfectly.
My experience is on the website below,
Geared Steam,
So I was right in suspecting the caps are on the board in the new 44-tonners. Even a stopped clock is right twice a day…[:o)]
Your blog write-up says they’re yellow. Can you give any other guidance to locating them? I’d just as soon give clipping them off a try before giving up totally on the Bachmann decoder and having to install another decoder.
Yeah, count me in! Are the yellow caps ON the decoder? I used a razor knife and made a small slice in the heat shrink on the decoder and I saw a yellowish/orangish square that MIGHT be a cap but I wasn’t sure. This is the original decoder that came factory installed by Bachman.
Paul,
I’m pretty sure they’re on the separate “light” board from the decoder. This Bachmann is a weird hybrid of big old-style board and teensy decoder.
Hmm. I looked and looked last night and all I saw were two green resistors. I posted a photo of it. Could it be on the bottom of the board underneath the resistors somewhere? It’s all back together again and it runs so poorly I was gonna toss it in the trash. Well, maybe throw it against a brick wall at a VERY high velocity.
I mean it won’t even BUDGE until I get to 8 on the CAB. I ruled out anything mechanical because last night when I removed the worm gears the motor spun very fast, I rotated the wheels and they were all smooth with no binding or crud in the gears, it had fresh grease in the gears as well, AND this is a new loco. So my conclusion is it has to be electronic.
While removing the filter capacitors on the Bachmann locos can improve the performance, it is no substute for a higher quality decoder.
About 2 years ago Bachmann started putting the RF chokes (2 capacitors and 2 resistors and 2 coils in some cases) in all their worldwide production They are required in many countries, but not in north America. As they are Radio Frequency chokes and the DCC signal is an Rf signal (broadcast through the tracks) the choke can and does interfer with the NMRA DCC signal and can corrupt the digital packets going to the decoders. The solution is simple, remove the filters (the capacitors) but can be a PIA now that Bachman is including them on their decoder boards. The caps can be yellow, yellow/orange and I’ve even seen yellow/green. Once the caps have been removed, you don’t have to bother with the associated resistors or if present, coils as they will then be inert.
On the four and six axle units, they’re an even bigger pain, as they are attached to the motor power lugs and require loosening/removal of the chassis weight to get to (you may have to temporaily disconect the truck wires). Once there though, just clip all the bare wires (don’t cut the black or red wires), remove the resistors and caps and then reassemble the weight to the frame. Some of the newer releases now may also have them on the decoder boards.
To the OP, the only difference between a flywheel drive and the wormgear drive is the lack of flywheels, both have wormgears. In a drive as small as the 44 tonner, the effect of flywheels on the performance would be negligable. As to the wormgears themselves, the “plastic” ones are made of a tough engineering plastic like Delrin, Celcon or Nylon and are self-lubricating. They are in part also used because they are quieter. I have been custom building and servicing locomotives for 30 years and have yet to come across a bad worm gear in a plastic locomotive. So while they may look “cheesy”, they a
[quote user=“modelmaker51”]
While removing the filter capacitors on the Bachmann locos can improve the performance, it is no substute for a higher quality decoder.
About 2 years ago Bachmann started putting the RF chokes (2 capacitors and 2 resistors and 2 coils in some cases) in all their worldwide production They are required in many countries, but not in north America. As they are Radio Frequency chokes and the DCC signal is an Rf signal (broadcast through the tracks) the choke can and does interfer with the NMRA DCC signal and can corrupt the digital packets going to the decoders. The solution is simple, remove the filters (the capacitors) but can be a PIA now that Bachman is including them on their decoder boards. The caps can be yellow, yellow/orange and I’ve even seen yellow/green. Once the caps have been removed, you don’t have to bother with the associated resistors or if present, coils as they will then be inert.
On the four and six axle units, they’re an even bigger pain, as they are attached to the motor power lugs and require loosening/removal of the chassis weight to get to (you may have to temporaily disconect the truck wires). Once there though, just clip all the bare wires (don’t cut the black or red wires), remove the resistors and caps and then reassemble the weight to the frame. Some of the newer releases now may also have them on the decoder boards.
To the OP, the only difference between a flywheel drive and the wormgear drive is the lack of flywheels, both have wormgears. In a drive as small as the 44 tonner, the effect of flywheels on the performance would be negligable. As to the wormgears themselves, the “plastic” ones are made of a tough engineering plastic like Delrin, Celcon or Nylon and are self-lubricating. They are in part also used because they are quieter. I have been custom building and servicing locomotives for 30 years and have yet to come across a bad worm gear in a plastic locomotive. So w
Your going to have to learn to figure some things out yourself in this hobby. If you remove the shell, there are 2 wires from the motor, two from front, and two from rear truck, these are power pickups. 4 other wires are lights. It/s a case of unhooking the light board (the wires are not soldered to the board, but held on by black clips. Its as simple as tracing where the wires go to. The decoder you decide to purchase will have a wiring diagram, you just need to know what wire is which.
Perhaps you should just return the loco to Bachmann under warranty. Even with the Bachmann decoder and light board, I did not need to full power to get it going, my low speed was jerky.
Good luck
EDIT
Thanks for the photos. This is exactly what I have. You’re right, I am going to have to figure things out.
By the way, what do you use to strip those wires? My aircraft quality strippers have teeth ranging from 18G to 26G but these wires are even smaller. How do you strip them?
Actually, I would agree with GEARED STEAM, this was a new purchase, take advantage of Bachmann’s warranty, call them up, tell them the engine won’t move untill you turn it up all the way (this is not normal even with the cheap decoder), they will have you send yours in and they will send you a new one by return mail. Bachmann is usually pretty quick, however they are located somewhere in New Jersey, so you might want to ask them if they are ok or should you expect a delay because of Sandy. I would also ask if the replacement will be in the same roadname, if not should you remove and keep your shell.
I might as well give it a try. It’s no good the way it is.
Again, the two green resistor like devices are Ferrite Inductors. Do a Google search for ferrite inductor color code and read the value.
My two 44 ton DCC ready had two wire wound inductors which were easy to see. They also had the label, L1 and L2.
The PC boards usually have a C prefix for Caps. L for inductors. D for diodes. R for resistor.
The inside of the shrink wrapped decoder is not the place to look for the caps.
Some had the yellow blob caps. Some SMD caps on the PC board. Those would be small black square items with, you guessed it, C prefix for each one.
Some might have had the yellow blobs right on the motor leads. My Spectrum 70 ton had three yellow blob caps right on the motor leads.
Bachmann has had a wide variety of cap placements. Some locos have one cap, some two, some three.
Yes, Bachmann is consistently, inconsistent.
Rich
Most here are not aware that Bachmann has a site with a couple reps there. All the info is at the below site. Take some time and look around.
http://www.bachmanntrains.com/home-usa/board/index.php
Rich
Hi there. I’m over in the UK and i recently got one these beasts s/h. Its DCC, standard decoder and does run well except for a growl. I’ll strip and clean it and I intend to fit a Loksound chip to it. Don’t know yet where the speaker will go. I also use an NCE controller.
Just got back rom a train show. Took the 44 tonner with me to find a speaker for it. Result. I came away with one that measures 1/2x3/8x1/8 inches. It’ll work well with the intended Loksound chip and will fit under the roof or, possibly, under the light board under the bonnet. Have to see what happens when it’s fitted. I don’t know the make of it unfortunately.