Hi, I want to introduce myself first with a little background before asking questions, and i’ve a lot [:D]
I’m from the dominican republic, 35 years old…since a small boy i was fascinated by trains but sadly here in my country we dont have many trains [:'(], most are in the country side hauling sugar cane but they are rarely seen this days and those as you can imagine are not moderm trains. Recently a subway was build and we got to see real train…not top of the line but they’re trains :).
Anyway, I allways wanted to build a model train/town but life got on the way…my 2 daugthers are not into trains :(, but a year a go we got a baby boy [:D]. That is my excuse to finally build one.
The plan will be to build the model with a main track for me but i will include secondary track where thomas the train (toy) will be most of the time when playing with him. Of couse he’s too small now jejeje but i know he will enjoy watching. I’m reading like crazy this past week about this hobby but we’re taking it slow.
I’m planning the layout with my wife but we still dont have a place to put it or the size of the space. I’ll meassure next saturday. We want a HO scale but an N scale is plan B in case we cannot have enough space.
Now my question.
on HO scale the recomended is 4’x8’? why?
we want to use DCC, most of the info i’ve found it’s too technical, I understand most of it but there is some graphical/easy way to know how to wire and what equipment we need?
what is best buying a set? or everything separate?
do you have link of online store on the USA where we can shop?
As Byron has already stated, the 4 by 8 is not a recommendation, but has turned into a “standard” size due to the fact, that this size is the standard size for a sheet of plywood.
A 4 by 8 is actually a space eater. You need to have access to a minimum of three sides of it, thus enlarging the required foot print to 6 by 12. That´s an awful lot of real estate, which certainly could find a better use.
My recommendation to you is to prepare a drawing of the room you intend to use as your layout room. Make that drawing as precise as possible, and don´t forget to include doors and windows and any other item you need to have there. It´ll help us to evaluate what your actual space for a layout is, which certainly also determines the scale which is best for you.
There are lots of friendly folks in here, so don´t hesitate to ask your questions!
4x8 is often a starter layout because that is the standard size of a sheet of plywood.
As for online store… Try Modeltrainstuff.com. Not sure about cost of shipping but if you can buy at one time that would save you over shipping piece by piece.
And for DCC. Wiring is not hard. Run one wire for one side of the track, another for the other side of track under your layout and then about every 3 feet or so, use a smaller wire to hook up to the track (called a feeder) .
Far as 4 X 8 layout’s in my opinion one of the worst sizes to work with.
My self, if I have to go to a smaller layout I would do something like this.
Or this one I browned from the site here.
Reason I like this style? You can have much larger turns (called radius) and larger train, well all trains run better on a bigger turn. On a 4 X 8 about the biggest radius you can fit is 22 inch. Radius is measured by half the distances it takes to turn 180 degrees. So a 22 inch radius takes 44 inches to turn around. Really eats up a 4 X 8 Fast.
As a starter in the hobby much of the information will be very technical (bear with them) 4x8 is really not a bad place to start, this will give you an idea of what you will face in the future and you can always expand from the original 4x8 sheet, Also remember, a larger sheet of wood will not allow you to reach across to access anything in the middle. ( how far can you reach?) keep reading and let people know you are just starting out in the hobby.
I like this layout, which is in N scale. It fits on a 4’x8’ table. N scale has become a popular scale for those with limited space. The amount and diversity of available rolling stock and structures has increased tremendously. Bob Hahn
N scale may not work for you if you want to run Thomas trains with your son. I did a search of Walthers which is the largest model train distributor in North America and nothing came up under ‘Thomas’ in N scale. In HO, there was a ton of stuff.
Be aware that while Walthers has a broad selection most of their stuff can be found on line at cheaper prices. When Walthers puts stuff on sale their prices tend to be quite good.
One other website that you might find useful is the National Model Railroad Association (NMRA).
The NMRA has put a lot of effort into defining what works and what doesn’t work in model railroading. Don’t bog yourself down by trying to read all the rules and recommendations in detail, but I do suggest a quick run through to see what information is available if you need it. The NMRA also has a list of retailers which might help you find good sources on line.
You sound a bit reluctant to get into DCC. Don’t be! Modern DCC systems are easy to install and easy to operate. DCC can be quite complicated if you get into the finer details of programming decoders but that won’t happen until you have some experience with DCC, and you may never need to get to that level anyhow. Basic DCC operation is very simple. You should also take into account that your son will be growing up in a very electronic world. I would suggest that he might be much happier using a DCC controller than a DC throttle and the attendant switches etc. DCC will be a natural experience for him, unlike some of us dinosaurs.
DCC also offers the opportunity to have sound! In my humble opinion that adds enormously to the enjoyment of the hobby, and I think your son would get a kick out of it too.
If you are crowded for space, N may be the better bet. Since you seem to mention a rr for you and your wife (N) and a seperate one for Thomas (HO). Thomas doesn’t require much scenery, all toys become props on a childs layout, scale to them doesn’t seem to matter.
Have you concidered a shelf layout? They are becoming quite popular and can go above furniture, using space that in unusable for much else. You can have a lot of N on not too much shelf.
Another type would be one to store under a bed, popular with college students. The one problem would be keeping the Thomas operator from getting it out on his own and modifying it in ways you have not planned. It does store in a space that is often unused.
hon30critter thanks for all the recomendation, and everyone else too. I’m reading at nmra.org this pass days. I’ll use dcc, will starting browsing for dcc system or train kit with dcc. For the scale decision i will wait to see the space i can use but i feel more confortable with 4x8 but who knows? As soon as i measure i will let you guys knows
Thanks. I am glad it gave you some food for thought…
One small point I should mention regarding Bachmann E-Z Track. Apparently the early stuff was made with steel track. That is not a good thing. It will require a lot of cleaning to keep operation reliable. Make sure if you are going the E-Z Track route that it has nickel-silver rail.
There is a large database of track designs available right here. Click on ‘HOW TO’ in the black bar above and select ‘Track Plan Database’. It allows you to filter layout plans by size and scale.
Atlas also offers suggested track plans using either their sectional track or flex track which might give you some ideas for your layout:
If you are designing on your own, there is a book by John Armstrong called ‘Track Planning for Realistic Operation’ which can help you avoid newbie mistakes. I had what I thought was a great track plan, that is until I read John’s book. It showed me that much of what I had planned was quite dysfunctional and my naive design would have been bad from the start.
Ok this is a draft of the room. Our general idea is (but i accept suggestions of course) is to use 2 tables (how are they called at this hobby? benchwork?), one 31" x 84", and the other 65" x 35", joined by a small one with 29" x ?? (dont know what size is best). This table join will be removable this way the bathroom on the back can remain accesible (can this be done safely?).
I have access to power on both long walls…
due to the size constraint a N scale will be best? or a HO can run like this?
Over the weekend my wife and I talked and what we have as a general idea for the layout is a fictional setting :
one coal and gravel mine, along side of a montain and a river (with waterfall near), also a timber yard (dont know the correct name) near a small forest…I know removing gravel near a river is against the law, on most countries, on mine is BUT some people do it [:(!] anyway and we want to reflex that on the layout. There will be a couple (or just one) tunel. One big town nearby and another one, more smaller, mainly for the Thomas train (for our son). All this on one table.
On the other table the outside of a big city with several factories recieving the cargo from the mines and wood.
including the thomas train, we want to run at least 4 locomotives (one of them steam), all DCC with light, sound and all the high tech etcs our pocket can pay :).
All this is a dream? are we going beyond of what can be done on that small space?
Well, looks like you have a good start by making a draft of the room. The first thing most of us will say is that a reach beyond 30 inches is a stretch, and for some of us, even that is a bit much. You can make a nice layout either in HO or N scale with the size shown. I believe I read elsewhere in the forum about a lack of N scale Thomas equipment, so that’s a consideration.
If you have a mountain scene on one side, I see no reason you couldn’t have a mine and logging area or sawmill and possibly even a quarry. It might be a squeeze in HO scale, but it can be done. The same goes for a city scene on the other side. If you want continuous running (and with Thomas, I suspect you might), then 30" width will leave some fairly tight curves in HO scale. You could add another section to make a loop around the room if needed. There’s nothing wrong with a lift out section … or swing down, or swinging gate arrangement, as long as it’s built rock-solid. You’ll want some way of preventing trains from taking The Big Dive.
There should be plenty of room for 4 locomotives, assuming you aren’t planning on running large ones. As you can expect, tight curves will preclude this (at least in HO scale).
Great to see you’re getting a lot of good advise, I just hope that you’re not getting overwhelmed by it.
You will see under your “Manage Profile/ Community Settiings” in the right hand column the “Search Community” box. I find that it can be rather frustrating to use but if I get lucky and use the correct wording it does contain good information.
" This table join will be removable this way the bathroom on the back can remain accesible (can this be done safely?)."
Here’s a link to a previous thread related to that particular question,
we’re currently deciding HO or N…as you may know we dont have seen personally a model train we can imagine using the scale size on some docs, a HO loco is 7" and a N is like 3.5", right?..so the decision is somewhat complicated, we want lots of details but also it could be nice to have good size of train.
That’s another point, what we’re doing i think is unique here, aside from arquitectual model, here there are no clubs or model train comunity I’ve looked around but no. So we count of you guys for advice [:D]. Most of the stuff we cant build or find locally we will buy them from internet shops or ebay, i think this will be limited to the trains, dcc equipment, tracks, buildings and some other stuff.
while we dicide what scale to use i’m reading some PDF book i’ve orderer from mr shop link, along with others i’ve found online. later i’ll order some based on scenery building and stuff.
I like this layout, which is in N scale. It fits on a 4’x8’ table. N scale has become a popular scale for those with limited space. The amount and diversity of available rolling stock and structures has increased tremendously. Bob Hahn