as followers of my rambling misadventers may know, I had been planning to build a model railroad layout that featured a rather elaborate lake scene complete with sunken locomotive. The locomotive of which was so thoughtfully provided by Jeffery Whimbley.However,I have decided that due to horrible access issiues with the plan. and the fact that the sunken locomtive scene could not be used to full effect because it would be at the back edge of the layout I have decided to follow a different course of action.
I have decided to scrap my current layout in favore of one built along the lines of Woodland Scenics Module scenes standards. The layout will be a branch of the fictional Wyoming Idaho Oregon and Pacific which is half owned by the GN and the CB&Q. The branch will run North from the WIOP’s eastern terminal in Casper WY 35 miles to Midwest Wyoming and service the sprawling oil fields in the vicinity of the famouse “Teapot Dome”
I decided that to make use of Mr. Whimbley’s generous gift, that I would model a derailed locomotive slowly sinking into a “Salt Bog” The inspiration for this scene came a story I heard while I was living in Shoshoni. Perportedly a CB@Q locomotive derailed in the vinicity of Bonniville WY. It fell off of the right of way and into the very soft ground of what locals call a “Salt Bog”. Due to the extreamly soft soil conditions recovery of the locomotive was not possible and over the years the locomotive has slowly sunken into the ground to the point where it is now completely buried. I was shown a picture of what is purported to be this locomotive taken in the early 1950s and it does show a heavily rusted 2-8-0 laying on its side 2/3-3-4 buried in the ground with the smoke box end more sunken than the cab. There is no evidence of the tender and if this photograph truely is this locomotive I hypothosice that the tender was more accassable and was recovered.
Very intersting story and I have no idea what a salt bog is, but I want to guess before someone who knows responds. I would guess that a salt bog is an area where water from seasonal streams or rain showers seaps into but there is no outlet. The water only evaporates out of the area. Since only the water and not the minerals it contains evaporate, the salts concentrate making any water that is there to be salt water. Sort of like the Great Salt lake and the Dead Sea in minature. ??!??
If my guess is correct the combinations of salt and water over even a few short years would make a locomotive into a pile of worthless rust very quickly. I would say zero chance of recovering anything that would be worth looking at for a display.
Would that sinking loco still need it’s drive shaft?[:D] There was a peat bog in Northern Ohio that sucked down a steamer and a passenger train a long time ago.
Its a good hypothosis. Its just I have never heard the term used before. One of the problems with this story is the vaugness about just exatly where this locomotive is supposed to be. Your comment about the saltiness and evaporation makes sense. and there are two streams in the area that go by the names “poison creek” and “bad water creek” possibly indicating about the quality of water from those sources?
James, what a fascinating story and cool idea for modeling. I would really enjoy seeing photos of your project from start to finish if you would be so kind. Neat concept.
That is my kind of scene. Weathering the loco ought to be a blast. It would be the most rusted thing in histroy. The surrounding area will also be a great opportunity. I await the first pics.
Art, enjoyed viewing your online RR photos. Quick question, where did you photograph that insane road along the purple-ish mountainside? Passing trucks on that road would surely be an adventure and what a view!
What you are referring to as a ‘Salt Bog’ in other areas - Southern Idaho, Southeastern Oregon, and Northern Nevada these are referred to as an ‘Alkali Bog’ or ‘Alkali Flat’. Basically these form in an area where a heavily alkali-impregnated stream flows into a low area without any drainage. A crust of alkali will form over the top of, what is essentially ‘quicksand’ and, for all intents and purposes, this looks like solid ground - until you break through that crust. Horses raised in the wild - mustangs if you want - living in the above cited areas have learned to avoid these areas. Cowmen in Northern Nevada have learned to fence-in these places; I have heard of horses - and cows too, for that matter - wandering out onto this crust and sinking up to their belly before you can snap your fingers. These are seldom deep enough to drown an animal but more than one has starved to death by being unable to extricate themselves. When you work in the cow business every early morning and every late afternoon there are hands who do what are called ‘bog rides’ - their job is to help stock free themselves from boggy areas.
I have done my share of pulling cows out of soft ground at streamside but never worked in an area where there were these ‘alkali bogs’. I did encounter one one time though; I was with another fellow north of Winnemucca, Nevada and we were out to pick up some horses. We had concluded that we had taken the wrong fork in the road about ten miles back and needed to turn around. Ground looked solid to me! but when I went to pull off onto this flat to execute a U-turn the guy I was with yelled, “STAY ON THE ROAD!!! STAY ON THE ROAD!!!” We stopped and he walked out about twenty yards onto this flat area and went through the crust and about six inches into the mud underneath. If I had dri
Don’t worry. I will write it up. I intend to submit it to Model Railroader or Railroad Model Craftsman. I figure a scene this cool should be shared with as much of the model rairlaoding community as possible.
[quote user=“R. T. POTEET”]
What you are referring to as a ‘Salt Bog’ in other areas - Southern Idaho, Southeastern Oregon, and Northern Nevada these are referred to as an ‘Alkali Bog’ or ‘Alkali Flat’. Basically these form in an area where a heavily alkali-impregnated stream flows into a low area without any drainage. A crust of alkali will form over the top of, what is essentially ‘quicksand’ and, for all intents and purposes, this looks like solid ground - until you break through that crust. Horses raised in the wild - mustangs if you want - living in the above cited areas have learned to avoid these areas. Cowmen in Northern Nevada have learned to fence-in these places; I have heard of horses - and cows too, for that matter - wandering out onto this crust and sinking up to their belly before you can snap your fingers. These are seldom deep enough to drown an animal but more than one has starved to death by being unable to extricate themselves. When you work in the cow business every early morning and every late afternoon there are hands who do what are called ‘bog rides’ - their job is to help stock free themselves from boggy areas.
I have done my share of pulling cows out of soft ground at streamside but never worked in an area where there were these ‘alkali bogs’. I did encounter one one time though; I was with another fellow north of Winnemucca, Nevada and we were out to pic
I’m guessing that a salt bog would be similar to a salt marsh.
A salt marsh is a type of marsh that is a transitional zone between land and salty or brackish water.
A bog is a wetland type that accumulates acidic peat, a deposit of dead plant material. It would be more proper to call these sphagnum bogs if the peat is composed mostly of acidophilic moss.
And please get the spelling of my last name correct. It’s Wimberly.[:)]
From what I understand about these things it is highly possible; what is likely to happen is that unless something happens to restrict how far down the locomotive could eventually sink - i.e. the frame is too long to fit the bog - over the course of time the water flow into the hole will eventually eat away the area under the locomotive frame and it’ll just sink out of sight. Central Europe, surprisingly, has quite a few quicksand bogs which have digested whole two and a half-ton trucks - as several Americans discovered to their chagrin in 1945.
After I made my initial response on your topic I thought of one thing to be added: this individual I was traveling with out on the Nevada desert gave me a botany lesson in alkali grasses; these are substantially the same, I believe, as the salt grasses which grow adjacent to tidal pools at seaside.