I run HO in D.C., and make no apology for that. Many of my locomotives are from the 1960’s and '70’s, and with a small shelf layout there aren’t that many blocks to keep track of. I just don’t want to deal with finding compatable DCC decoders and then rewiring about two dozen old - but still well-liked locomotives.
I recently purchased one of the new Bachmann HO 2-6-0s, which has sound on-board. In that my DC power pack is a “pulse power” type (a very good one at the time purchased), the headlight of the locomotive flashes and there is an audible “tick” as one ups the power before the locomotive starts and the sound engages. Many of the reviews I’ve read about DCC locomotives describe how one has to adjust the configuration variables to “thus and so” in order to operate the engine on DC - which mandates having the full DCC operating system (and understanding it).
SO, HOW HARD COULD IT BE for manufacturers to have some sort of basic toggle or slide switch on their product to allow the locomotive to operate on DC or DCC at the customer’s choice? I’m understand that the market is certainly changing, and am willing to pay the price for electronic DCC “stuff” in there that I might not use in return for getting a nice locomotive.
Perhaps those who understand both the electronics and the perspective of the producers can explain to me why we can’t just have a little switch hidden under the locomotive or tender to allow customers to select the operating nature of the locomotive. It could expand the sales of the locomotive. How hard could it be?
It would cost more, add complexity, and it just wouldn’t be worth the cost to do it. It also adds just one more thing to go wrong and that means unnecessary returns and/or repairs.
If you buy a DCC loco, especially one with sound to run DC you’re pretty much stuck with the shortcomings of the two. The DCC loco is made to run on just that, DCC. It will run on DC but the performance will likely be unsatisfactory at best. From your description of your other locos, if they still have their original type motors could be a real job to convert in any event. I have some old 70’s era locos myself. Some had DCC compatible motors in them from the factory and others had to be updated but all are now DCC and can run on DC without a problem. None are sound equipped. I find the sound to be annoying and easily live without it.
If you still have your DC power pack, do what I have done. Use a DPDT toggle switch to switch the layout between the the DC & DCC power supplies. Simple to wire, the leads to the layout go to the center terminals. Then the power supples to the outside terminal (one on each side)
Setting a CV is just like a toggle switch, except that it’s done electronically rather than physically. This is more reliable and also cheaper. This is a very nice engine for an extremely reasonable price, after all.
Since it’s a CV, it’s something that can be changed on any DCC system, and doesn’t require a proprietary module like sound downloads. A friend with a DCC system or a good LHS will be happy to do this.
For non-sound, it’s not really much of an issue. FOr sound - well, if they put in a switch to bypass the DCC aprt, then i twould just be a plain non-sound loco - so buy the non-sound version. I wish more manufacturers would do it liek Atlas does - their Silver Series DC versions of their Gold Series sound and DCC locos have the ame frame - including the speaker mounts - so if you buy a DC version you can easily insatll a sound decoder and speakers. Others use a compeltely different chassis so you end up having to resort to various tricks to make room for a speaker if you alter decide to convert.
There is something to aware of about old power packs with pulse power and newer locos. Pulse power can destroy some coreless motors. So it’s not as simple as there being a switch from DC to DCC in some cases.
No mainstream locos come with coreless motors, and pulse DC power would damage a coreless motor with or without a decoder in it, if run on said pulsed DC.
Our layout has 18 DC blocks to 3 cabs, the main thing is all blocks can switch to one cab, say A. Unplug the controller to cab A and we plug in my DCC Prodigy and we have a basic DCC layout. When we are done the DIN plug is pulled and we go back to the DC controller. If you can borrow a DCC unit to try, you can give it a go.
Some of the manufacturers do offer a little “black” box for accessing DCC controls on a DC layout. Atlas is one of them, MRC is another, I believe. These can be had for about $40.
Btw, most modern (last 5 years) locos automaticly detect whether there is DC or DCC on the track and switch to the appropriate system.
I know this isn’t about DC vs DCC, but I had to comment: Switching to DCC is not that big of a chore, After the initial expense of the of the system (beginning at less than $180), you can buy decoders for as little as $15 and just do a few locos a month. You don’t have to convert all your locos at once, I had over 60 locos to do, at 3-4 locos a month, at that rate, the expense was easy to absorb and after the first 2-4 conversions, it was pretty easy to do and took about 10 months for my 60 locos. This did include some Athearns from the 70s. I haven’t comke across anything I couldn’t put a decoder in, although there were some I decided weren’t worth it. I put off the switch for many years, but once I swtched there were no regrets, the difference in operation, being able to tune up each loco and control over the lights was heavenly and made it all worthwhile.
Thanks to all who replied. MY take-away of key points would be:
Yes, such a switch can be installed by manufacturers without creating excessive cost or problems. MTH does it and has a pretty good reputation for reliability. I recognize that it is unlikely that more companies will take this approach, as they get more “involved” in the DCC capabilities they tend to lose sight of folks with the traditional operating system.
The suggestion to “buy the non-sound version” doesn’t apply too well when the Bachmann 2-6-0 is offered in only one form. I did get mine at the Timonium train show for $100 even, and that seems to be a pretty good price for this locomotive, which is still in high demand.
Thanks to Larry (“Brakie”) for the suggestion of the MRC Tech 6. That looks like it might be the solution that would work for me. I operate two “cabs”, and could replace one of those with this MRC Tech 6 and use that one when operating the DCC-wired locomotive. It’s not overly expensive either. It has been added to my shopping list.
MTH does NOT have a physical switch, it automatically detects DC, DCS, or DCC on the track - same as EVERY current DCC motor and sound decoder, although naturally the non-MTH ones are DCC/DC, no DCS.
My layout is currently wired as such. No special equipment. I simply wire my DCC system like I would an additional DC cab for the operation of multiple trains and since it sounds like your blocks are in place, you can run both your DC and DCC trains simultaneously provided that they operate on their respective isolated blocks.
Just make sure that if you do decide to run DC and DCC trains simultaneously that your switches are thrown so that you keep the DC and DCC trains separate. Should you need to crossover be conscious of the position of your selector switches.
Even when I’ve made that goof, I haven’t caused any damage to equipment or the system. It would cause a short like anything else. I would even suppose that the same would happen if you had two DC cabs operating simultaneously with opposite polarity for bidirectional traffic and decided to cross one train in front of the other. The result of a four axle, 8-wheel pickup loco bridging the gaps would cause a short all the same.
I use atlas’ three-position selector switch. One position powers the track with DCC, one turns power off completely and the other Powers the track with DC.
I got blasted on the DCC forum for this but I think that it was more so because folks didn’t read my post thoroughly as if what they were saying was applicable to my layout, I’d be on my 500th Powerhouse Pro system by now, lol.
For a wiring diagram, look at any wiring book that shows how to wire multiple cabs. I would only suggest that you don’t directly connect the power backs (i.e. terminal to terminal connection with one wire). Have a wire coming from one of the terminals from each cab and join it with a single feeder wire to the track. Wires from the other terminals would connect with the 3-position selectors and a single wire will run from each selector terminal to feed
A lot of DCC decoders, especially those that are factory installed, are “dual-mode” so they should run on DC or DCC. You won’t have access to advanced features (which you wouldn’t be able to control on a straight-DC engine either anyway) and the electronics might cause it to start moving at a higher voltage, so it might not speed match perfectly with non-decodered engines.
Other than that, an engine with a “dual-mode” decoder should work just fine - either automatically, or by changing the position of a jumper plug on the decoder.