Is online competition the problem for these stores or is it their product line? I understand that model railroading items ship well, and can be returned by the customer with little inconvenience, but home goods or clothing?
Sears was having problems way before internet sales phenomenon.
As far as clubs, I’m a lone wolfer anyway so I wouldn’t notice if they’re losing acceptance or not.
Online stores have not hurt brick and morter as much as they like to say. People just got sick and tired of bad attatudes, lack of selection and poor (I am being nice here) customer service. Even price only did so much to criple stores. I worked for Woolworths for a time as the chain shut down and had a front row seat to their mistakes that led to their downfall, major among them was not planning for the future. It seems most hobby shops do not own their own building and never seen one yet with a ten year plan plus bad attitude, just in my neck of the woods most shop owners had a bad attatude and many would rather talk to a friend rather than wait on a customer. I saw one piss off hundreds of people at one decision. If you run a store you have to keep people coming in, rairly do hobby stores work at that. The one that did had a small consignment case, people would come in weekly to see new stuff, just in case and many times buy something while there. He always sold major peices like engines and cars at a discount but sold stuff to go with at about retail, he sold alot of stuff to go with.
Well, a brick and mortar store has two disadvantages:
higher costs to maintain a physical store.
less “reach”.
Online vendors are visible to the nation and even overseas customers and costs are lower. MB Klein is a prime example and during the past year repurposed 2/3rds of their show room over to the online dept.
You’d think thats the case but thats an outdated notion. My wife orders cloths online and so do many others. She also ordered our livingroom TV stand, coffee table and book shelf for our living room in our new home online and it was delivered to our door. Same with other items. THIS is why Amazon is kicking the pants off of the brick and mortar stores of many stripes.
Maybe, but it has accelerated exponentially since online sales have taken over in the past 4 years. Kmart, Macy’s, Toys R Us, and a hole host of other physical stores. Read the news. It’s pretty clear what is going on and model train shops are being swept up along with them.
A few thoughts:
Status has a
For those of us who keep score, is this hobby shops/clubs are dying thread considered the last hobby shops/clubs are dying thread for 2017…or the first hobby shops/clubs are dying thread for 2018?
Or does each year get half a credit?
Hobby shops have been dying way before the internet arrived. First one I remember was over 30 years ago. Saw two new ones appear but neither one had a clue on how to run a buisness, in fact one hired the worst of a still thriving store, just because he talked a good game, they didn’t last and they tried multiple locations.
Our friends at the Napa Valley Railroad Historical Society are continuing to keep up the good fight.
If you’d like to help them out, go here and sign their petition. So far they have well over 5,000 signatures.
Not exactly the correct story as the real reason is they have a new master plan for the whole grounds, but no funding and proubly will never have funding. Their is a California law that could save the building (they have been informed of that by me) but that law would not save the club, only the building.
Yes, true. They were dying before online sales for the same reasons as after (owner retiring or badly managed) but now with online, brick and mortor has a bigger challenge than before.
One store out competing or killing another stores business has been happening for a long time. But any chance of Sears had of pulling out of that earlier decline has been totally obliterated due to the pervasive trend to online buying. You seem to discount the effect of online buying vs. the large brick and mortar stores, but all you have to do pay attention to the news over the past few years and the message is loud and clear.
Malls are dying by the score because people aren’t shopping at them in numbers anywhere near what they used to. Amazon and a whole host of online vending has everything to do with the demise of malls. It’s plainly obvious.
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If you read comments here closely, most people who use online stores do so because a B&M store is nowhere near them.&
Your link is worthless…
It shows up with the texts redacted for those of us who do not subscribe.
Guess what, I’m not subscribing or signing. I live on the other side of the country and have no dog in this fight.
I’ve seen too many clubs loose their space - property ownship is the only answer.
The community at large, who pays for public facilities, is not obligated to provide us with a place for our hobby.
And personally, if I was interested in being in a club, I would not want to be in one that was “obligated” to some government agency to be open to the puiblic.
Sheldon
I recently was asked to sit in on a meeting of a dog club that has gone from a membership that usually ran well in excess of 500 members to less than a hundred with only about 40 active participants.
Dog clubs use to run local, regional and national shows and the members would take on the challenge to put these shows on. A five day show could be attended by hundreds of people and their dogs from all over the world if it was a large show. If dog clubs didn’t put on the shows, there weren’t shows.
Then the professionals started taking over with big money sponsors like big pet food companies and other dog/pet related corporations. The dog club(s) got pushed out of the dog show business, though not completely (yet) they still run some very small local events.
The result is the socialization still goes on at the shows, however, participation in all other events has collapsed, both social and educational events have dwindled because the money raised to fund these events came from the club putting on dog shows.
The club will likely fold within the next few years and has about $75,000.00 in the bank that will be distributed to charity as the constitution states.
Train shows over the years seem to be fewer but larger. I don’t mind this as I prefer going to a couple of large shows over several small ones through the year. Are the professional show people taking over the MRR show scene to the point that a club has no reason or ability to put on an event? If so input into the hobby from everyday modelers may be in jeopardy. NMRA may even become less relevant when it comes to giving us the standards that makes things work so much better. Did train clubs that put on shows use the revenue from these shows to help fund its existence?
Just thinking out loud.[^o)]
First off, how much do you all know about the real numbers. Lets use Amazon’s online shopping buisness. Did you know that they have only made a profit in one buisness quarter. It is said they can turn on the faucet of profits at any time, but can they. E-retail can make money or lose money depending on many factors but if you take into account all the things that make up the sale, the numbers are not as great as you would expect when you consider the only thing that maters is the $ that go into your pocket in the end. Model railroading accually has a better chance of making a profit on e-retail than clothing when you relize 30% of those sales are returned, not able to be resold as new, shipping including return shipping paid by vender, advertizing, insurance etc. etc.
I was at the Scale Rails of Southwest Florida train show the past weekend, and I am glad to see my old club is still going strong, even stronger than before.
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They have reliable members, own their own building, and have a beautiful layout.
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I also found out the Sarasota Model Railroad Club, which I thought died, is still going stong as well. They changed their name to “Real Rail”, and became a public charity, and had to restructure, but it is still the same group.
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All good news.
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-Kevin
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It is likely they are doing this to protect the club from theft. As much as I hate saying it, I have known clubs where theivery was a serious issue. When you have serious brass equipment, historic collectables, and money sitting out, it could cost the club a lot.
A few had to prosecute.
That said, even with a super large basement, people may not have the time or money to build a layout. So a club makes sense.
Older clubs face a delima: There’s some serious expense with tearing out layouts and redoing them to run DCC with enough cabs for everyone. So to attract newer members, do you go through the time and money of DCC and risk alienating your older members?
I have noticed more than a few articles also citing denail of lease as land holders wish to move on to new ventures. This is especially true of fairground properties.
Paul,I looked at the photos of your club and if that big old yard is more then stagging I would gladly pay $32.00 a month to switch that yard.
I can’t remember but,isn’t your club DCC?
Even my 1’x12’ ISL its DCC just for more realistic locomotive performance and sound.
I belong to a club that requires fingerprints and a background check. The building that houses our layout is a retired Southern Pacific depot that is owned by a regional recreation and parks department. We pay no rent, however we are required to be open to the public as a condition of occupancy. Our members are also volunteers with the Recreation and Parks Department so technically we are “employees” and covered by their workman’s comp. insurance. Since children visit our layout when we are open to the public, the background check and fingerprinting are required by the Recreation and Parks Deptpartment make a lot of sense.
Brakie,
The large yard area called Cedar Hill is actually 5 yards; 2 passenger and 3 freight. The passenger yards are the terminal itself (8 stub tracks and 2 through tracks; max stub is 16’) and the coach yard (5 tracks; max 12’). We also have a 6 track REA facility (3 express cars long each).
On the freight side, we have the A/D yard (5 tracks; max 20’), a double-ended yard (8 tracks; max 10’) and a stub yard (6 tracks; max 13’). Plus the engine terminal (15 turntable tracks), car shop, and steam & diesel shop (with a transfer table).
We have 3 business sidings and 8 railroad sidings (coal, ash, sand, auction house, diesel, machine shop, roundhouse stores, engine shop stores). Also, there is an ice rack, 2-track TOFC ramp, RIP track, and 2 team tracks.
It’s a good place to switch. [tup]
And yep, we’re DCC. Have been since 1999.
As probably one of the younger guys on here (24), I think I can throw out a few ideas of what makes the traditional club scene not quite that appealing to my generation.
Yes, we do spend a lot on “screen time.” But a large portion of that can be “hobby time” too. We have a local railfan group that is very active in communicating via Facebook. We message each other a lot, and hold somewhat regular meet ups in the real world. Our last trip in November a large group of us went out to Milford, UT for an overnighter to railfan the old LASL. This Saturday we are heading up to Echo Canyon to watch the Evanston Subdivision. In person, we talk face to face; a lot! (Probably very loudly too! [:P]) We wouldn’t have gotten together as a social group if it weren’t for social media, and our online time does eventually lead into real world face to face interaction. I was a very lone wolf railfan convinved I was doing the hobby alone in my area, before Facebook started to connect me to other local railfans. Mind you this “club” of ours is very informal, very relaxed, and free spirited. Not a cent of membership dues, no list of pledges or club rules. Just a group of guys getting together to have fun. This social group has got me into operating sessions, railfanning local sites, visiting train shows together, helping on small restoration projects, etc.
Now what does a formal club offer? Well, it’s fees would take from my wallet; taking away money I could be spending on other parts of the hobby. Older members probably wouldn’t be active on social media, so outside club events it might be a bit harder to get a hold of them if I didn’t know their phone number, and even then phone calls rely on calling at a moment their schedule is open or a good answering machine to record what I wanted to say (I do phone calls as part of my job, and know very well just how many people in this world do not answer their phone these days). Not to mention, a lot
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I am twice your age, but I can tell you that social media is very important to another group of hobbiests… Wargamers & Boardgamers.
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We are all older guys, but without social media we would not have as great a hobby.
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So why does social media not help model railroaders and clubs? Well my theory is that wargaming is a required social hobby. You simply cannot do it alone. You need an opponent, so you must meet other people. We find each other on social media now. You are correct. Social media does lead to face to face interactions in the real world.
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Model Railroading can easily be enjoyed alone. This is how I like it, and why I am not a part of the local club.
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-Kevin
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