It’s been 40 below along the BNSF in North Dakota recently. I just learned that diesel fuel (#2) gels quite a bit above this temperature. Does anyone know how railroads compensate for the cold to keep the engines running? Fuel heaters? Fuel thinners? Different fuels? Thanks.
I am not an expert but I believe that in winter most diesel fuel becomes a mixture of #1 and #2. This make it less likely to gel. I know here in Milwaukee where it has only -10 degrees most gas stations will advertise “winter blend” diesel fuel.
Just my best guess
Keith Schmidt
www.geocities.com/kaschmidt626/index.html
I’m not an expert either,but i know that around here in Wv in cold weather they use a product called Power Service in equipment powered by diesel engines.It helps to keep the fuel fluid,thus keeping the filters from waxing up.
Some diesels also “recycle” the excess fuel pumped by the fuel pumps (the pump can pump more fuel than the diesel burns) back into the fuel tank, making the pass thru the fuel pump heats it slightly so it heats the fuel in the tank.
Dave H.
OK, Here is the scoop. #2 is for summer, #1 is for winter. When it is lower than ten degrees below 0, i add a anti gel fluid in my diesel pickup. I use a block heater when it gets around 20 or below for faster starts, and the use of the defroster right away
Adrianspeeder
[quote]
Originally posted by adrianspeeder
OK, Here is the scoop. #2 is for summer, #1 is for winter. When it is lower than ten degrees below 0, i add a anti gel fluid in my diesel pickup. I use a block heater when it gets around 20 or below for faster starts, and the use of the defroster right away
This is exactly how I had to do,when I had my diesel pickups.
However there was one small problem; remembering to UNPLUG
before emergancy runs. Had to btake a little extra time to do this.
Back in the old days, oil fired steam locomotives used fuel oil grades which were thicker (but cheaper) than #2 diesel (i.e. Bunker C grade.) To get them to flow, a steam line was run through the fuel oil bunker to heat it and to get it to flow.
The return fuel will warm the fuel. but if a unit is in extreme cold, RR’s will put fuel heaters that are hooked to the engine cooling system water going to the radiators
For the most part, the RRs use fuel preheaters. Even if you blend #1 with #2 diesel, you can’t get the cloud point and pour points of the fuels low enough to get you through the worst days.
The fuel pump sucks the fuel though a preheater which is warmed with engine coolant, the fuel then flows to the engine, which takes what it needs, and the rest returns to the fuel tank. This keeps the fuel tank warm and toasty!
The real scoop. We fuel locomotives in the Chicago area. The railroad orders a 60-40 blend. That is 60% #2 oil and 40% #1 oil. This keeps the cloud point around minus 20 degrees. Dan
Thanks for the insights, fans! I know a lot more now than I did a couple of weeks ago!
Here’s a new twist on fuel,
There is a new law taking effect in MN, though I don’t know if it will include RRs.
After you cross our borders you will fill your diesel “what ever” with a diesel/soybean mixture.
One of my friends is the spokesman for the oil distributors in MN. He also owns a distribution co. He told me that soybean oil gels at a higher temp then diesel does and that means that soy oil has to be kept unmixed with diesel and kept heated, below 32 deg.
The headache is the need for a duplicate set of storage tanks and heaters for the soy oil. Then the consumer has their own problems after the oils are mixed and in your tank. [banghead]
Soybean oil is mandated in MN.
I’m not sure when the law takes effect since I drive a gasser [;)]
Sooblue
Is that Soybean oil the same idea as the Bio-Diesel (made from deep fryer fat I believe) that people are starting to put in their cars and trucks that burn diesel, or are those two different things?
same overall idea, anyway, yeah. With the same problems[:(] (and apparent advantages)[8)]: if you can keep the stuff from gelling, it burns a little cleaner and its better for the eco types. The ‘if you can keep the stuff from gelling’ is the ringer in the deck, however. Even mixed with #1 I have heard that there may be problems. Sounds like a good idea, though – as these things often do.
Anyone know if the MN law applies to railroads as well? If so… I hope those diesels running through the state have big enough tanks to get through without refueling![:D]
They tried that at a university here in Cal… When the trucks and busses went by, they smelled like chinese food. It made me go eat. [:D]
Oh Marty! [:D]
The guy down the street got ahold of some biodiesel somewhere and showed me what it smelled like in his diesel. It made me hungry. I would burn it in the summer, but i have enough headaches in the cold to worry about biodiesel gelling.
Adrianspeeder
tank heaters for everyone!
Buy a tank of soybean oil and we’ll throw in a tank heater (extention cord xtra)
Sooblue
Ok. You pay the freght??? LOL