I personally don’t recommend Digitrax because it seems to be the most difficult system to understand from my experience and what others tell me. The manual is very difficult to understand and nothing seems clearly defined or easy to find when you need it.
The SEB doesn’t read back CV’s but you can write them down and save the info should you need it in the future.If you want to install Tsunami’s you also need a power booster. I have had no problems with my Digitrax decoders.
If I didn’t already have the Digitrax I would definitely use another system.
Some important factors are how big is your layout, and how many locos do you expect to run at a time. ANd how many peopel do you expect to be runnignt rains at the same time? The “kindergarten” power of the Zephyr is plenty to run modern HO locos - I’ve had as many as 8 running, including 4 with sound! Since buying a DT400 throttle I no longer use the console and have access to all functions. My father in law still prefers operating from the console. But you know, even with a sound loco I never missed the extra functions. The stuff you REALLY use, whistle, bell, maybe the coupler crash, and the dynamic brake (that relaly brakes in the latest QSI decoders) is all accessible in the first 8 functions.
I would not recommend a Super EMpire Builder other than ass an add-on to up the power of a Zephyr or a Super CHief - if you want a DT400 and need an extra 5 amps of poer, it’s ceaper to buy the SEB instead of individual components. As the ony DCC system though, Digitrax really needs to alter the lineup. No CV readback and no dedicated programmign track IMO make things MORE confusing to a newcomer. Especially the program track - it’s just too easy to accidently program all locos when the main becomes your program track.
When I purchaed my Digitrax Chief five years ago all programing and operation was done with a DT-100 throttle. It took some learning to figure out all of the bells and whistles. Using a computer with Decoder Pro makes programing very easy. On my previous layout I had several open houses and visitors operated my Digitrax wireless throttles with ease. I had to dial up their locomotive and hand them the throttle and they operated with no problems. On my considerations for purchasing Digitrax in the first place is several of my MRR friends already had a Digitrax system which helped significantly with the learning curve.
The new Digitrax UR-4 throttles make operation very easy and user friendly for layout visitors. (You can not program decoders with a UR-4, but since you can only program one locomotive at a time you only need one programing throttle or a computer.) In the past five years I believe that Digitrax has listened to its custiomers and made their products more user friendly. The nice thing is my old DT-100 are still fully functional so my old equipment is not obslete.
Difficult isn’t anything new to me… try reading through about 500 lines of (bad) Java code… now thats difficult!
In response to the locos/operators
RIGHT NOW: I will be the only operator, maybe there will be a second on occasion… but mostly just me. I will also have 1 or 2 locos running concurrently. Points to a Zephyr, I know…
FUTURE: (hopefully within 5 years) I’ll still likely be the only operator (with an occasional second), BUT I hope to be able to expand my layout so that I can have a continuous running (double track) main with 4-6 locos running (two double or triple-headed trains) on it at any given time, along with 1 or 2 more doing yard duty, and as many other DCC goodies as I can cram into the layout…
I’ll admit I haven’t read the whole doc yet (only the first 3 pages) but there is a wealth of info there.
The main reason I was asking about the Digitrax systems in particular is that, after looking at raw numbers, the digitrax systems fit my bill. ai like all of the features the systems have, and the fact that I can buy any of the systems and expand/upgrade as necessary.
… I just priced out the layout earlier today, i might just have to hold off on DCC for a few months after getting it up and running on DC…
Get a Zephyr, you won’t regret it. If you are in a budget crunch you can get started with it and have a lot of fun. You can get reverse modules that just plug into the Loconet and run with the Zephyr. You can get stationary controllers for your Tortoises that are Loconet compatible so you can control the turnouts from the Zephyr console. I have had 10 sound locos running at once on my Zephyr, it handled it no problem. I did it as an experiment to see if it was possible. Totally impractical on my layout with just me controlling them, but it did it. I started with the Zephyr and then picked up an SEB cheap off e-Bay. The SEB is the oldest and least desirable model and often there are deals on them. This got me a booster and the DT400 throttle. Total cost of my system less than the Chief and I have far more capability as a result.
You’ve been given some good advice so far. And the link to Joe’s “Picking the Best DCC System” is also good and well worth reading. Take your time and save your pennies for your DCC system when you can afford it. In the meantime, your MRC 220 will provide you with plenty of enjoyment.
As Simon pointed out, if you end up going with the Zephyr, you can add on stationary controllers, reverse modules, and other items (e.g. boosters, upgrades, etc.) gradually. The Zephyr’s 2.5 amps of max. output should give you plenty of power for your switching layout. The DT400 would give you both the ability to access functions greater than 8, the freedom to move around your layout more than with the Zephyr console, and give you yet another extra throttle. (Since you can technically hook in your MRC 220 power pack to the Zephyr and use that, too, you’d have a total of 3.)
I completely forgot that the Zephyr had the ability to connect to DC throttles. I just don’t like the idea of buying one system for ~$200 or so, and then having to spend another $x00 on upgrading because of limitations imposed by buying the cheaper set…although, from what I understand , I could use the Zephyr as a reversing loop booster… perhaps then having the cheaper system wouldn’t be too bad then, as it can be relegated to another duty (after some time) that it won’t have any trouble with…
Hence the reason I bit the bullet and bought the Radio Super Chief up front. I looked at it as an investment and not an expense. Once I did that I was able to justify the extra money or worry about not having things I need/want. I’ve had no problems with BLI programming, consisting (other than operator error), running lots of sound locomotives etc… I still have the PC interface in the box. I just haven’t had time to set it up (and I don’t have a computer with USB support in the basement yet). I thought of this in terms of the difference was the cost of 1 or 2 locomotives and whether I just needed to delay the purchase of a couple in order to stay within my railroad budget.
I know. I just haven’t made the time to do it yet. I have a Windwos 2000 box I can use. I’ve been more focused on layout building. Computer interface can come later.
OK. I’ve found some nice bargain bin computers that way (that have since gone to sibs) - people generally dont know they can expand the capabilities (USB, RAM, whatever) rather easily…
I bought the little UT throttles for the gkids and they love it, after the settle who gets the radio and who is stuck with the tethered. It is fool proof and they cannot hit the wrong buttons and change the CVs. I do have to upgrade the tethered.
I did look at the Zephyer because it did have a jump port to add a DC throttle. I became concerned and emailed MRC asking about my Tech 4’s Ampheres capacity and was told my model 220 is worth 1.6 amps.
Im going to strain something in my head and hurt myself with this question:
Does that mean the DC throttle only gets 1.6 amps to the track via the jump? Or will the Zephyer add it’s 2.5 amps to the total of about 4 amps availible to the track?
It is moot in my home as I got the Chief but that is one question I gotta wonder.
Or you can just build one of Hans Deloof’s versions of the Locobuffer which still uses a serial port, not USB. I built mine, and also did one for another forum member. Not to take away from Dick Bronson’s excellent product (and he’s a class gentleman, as well. Spent at least 2 hours sitting with him at his booth at the Timonium show a couple years ago talking about various railroad electronic things), but the DIY version is about half the cost, if you can handle a little soldering.
The Zephyr only takes the varying voltage to control te jump throttle, it does not use or add to the power pack’s cacapity. With a 1.6 amp MRC pack conntect, or a little DIY device liek I made that puts out maybe 100ma, it is the Zephyr’s 2.5 amps that provides all train running power.
Do NOT sell it short - 4 sound locos plus some non-sound all at the same time and my Zephyr handled it just fine. Somewhere peopel have got it int heir head that an HO sound loco must draw somewhere north of 2 amps, acting more liek a G scale loco than HO scale. I don’t know where such things get started. I will gladly demonstrate again runnign all these locos on a piddly little Zephyr - you just have to help me keep them from bashing into one another, or bring some throttles - between the DT400 and the Zephyr console I could only actually control 3, and on my layout I needed a lot of 0-5-0 action to keep them seperated. Also, I deliberately shorted the track with all these locos to see if I had any issues with ‘start up surges’ in the sound locos - nope, when I removed the screwdriver from across the rails everything started right back up as it was.
I am pretty sure that having “jumped” throttle does not increase the output of the zephyr. Im not absolutely sure, but since DCC uses modulated AC and power packs put out DC it would make sense to me that the zephyr just reads the voltage coming in while not actually using it to power anything.
I will just toss in that I routinely use my zephyr to program QSI, Loksound and soundtraxx (tsunami and LC) sound decoders with no issues whatsoever. This is on the programming track and with no progamming booster, so power to the program track is not an issue.
Also if you start with a zephyr and eventually trade up to a higher-end digitrax system, the zephyr can act as a 2.5amp booster and another throttle with your new system.