I am new to model railroading and new to this forum. I have recently purchase an MTH O gauge train for my son and upgraded it with some additional track and turnouts. I have been amazed at the poor quality of some of the pieces being sold. i.e. the firs piece of uncoupling track did not work, the replacement piece stopped working after a few weeks, and on the third piece the uncoupling feature works but the unload feature does not work. Additionally they did not offer any instructions on how to connect two loops together. After several hours of fooling with it I was able to get it to run correctly. I had to use a piece of paper to isolate the third rail on the mating switches. I have personally not seen this kind of junk sold in the other hobbies I was involved in. The LHS tells me that Lionel is even less reliable than MTH. At this point I don’t have the time to be wasting money and fiddling with garbage. Can someone steer me to any quality manufacturers in any gauge? Blowing off some steam Niko
Is this 3-rail track? There should no shorting problems with a three rail track plan turning back on itself through a turnout. That was one of Lionel’s big selling points with the three rail system. No complicated wiring for things like reverse loops. Did MTH change something?
It is the realtrax 3 rail track. I am no wiring wizard but I can tell you depending on how you connect things they might not work. I appears to me that the turnouts are only supply power to the middle and only one of the side rails. If you connect them improperly either the entire track is dead or the switches do not operate properly i.e. they spring back to their original position when you try to change them. I have ended up supplying power to both loops being careful as to which of the outside rails is getting power. After 3 hours of playing with it I have finally gotten it to work.
Niko,
Welcome to the forums. Sorry to hear you got some unacceptable goods, from whoever.
You might want to go to the Classic Toy Trains forums, by clicking on the CTT icon at the top of these pages. They deal with more O scale materials. This one is mostly N and HO. Maybe someone over there can give you some suggestions that will help you.
I remember my Lionel of the 50’s had to have insulating pins on the switches. Surprised they didn’t have some sort of instructions.
Hope you can find some answers, because this is a wonderful hobby, regardless of scale. Nice to work with the next generation (or two), while enjoying it yourself.
Good luck,
Cowman Thanks for the nice words. Right now I am thinking that O gauge probably has inferior products as its mosty viewed as “Toy” trains and that I need to switch to a different gauge. I might be wrong as I don’t know much about model railroading. I am trying to find out if there are some quality manufacturers in this hobby in any scale. Niko
[#welcome]
I am sorry you are disappointed with your train set. Most train sets sold contain lower quality equipment than the hobby /collecting part. If you are looking for quality and reliability in O three rail then it will cost you. I remember the old Lionel stuff I had as a child and it was all quality except for the accessories. My dad built a layout with super O track and all the locos had magnatraction and ran very well. Most of the accessories had the little buzzing solenoid to work the functions and they were hit or miss in reliability. The only thing that worked right was the sawmill and the aquarium car.
You may want to post your questions on the Classic toy train forum. There are more O scalers there.
Pete
Back again!
Don’t know about realtrax switches, but the one thing you do want to be sure is that the same post of your transformer is connected to the center rail. Should be able to go to either outside rail with the other post.
My old Lionel switches had one wire that had to go to a specific terminal on the switch. The other two, if reversed only made a difference in which way the turnout faced when you moved the control handle in one direction.
As I said above, hope someone over at CTT can give you a hand.
Good luck,
My question is not on how to get my layout running as I have figured that out. Its about the low quality of equipment. As locol1sa said " The only thing that worked right was the sawmill and the aquarium car". This is not acceptable to me. It doesn’t take rocket science to make some of these simple accessories work dependably. I am wondering if this is true in HO and N gauges or is the quality of products better in HO? Personally I won’t be spending any more money on products that don’t work or work intermittently.
I can’t speak for O scale, but most manufacturers of H0 and N scale equipment produce high quality products in general. It is better to buyindividual components rather than train “sets”
Niko, I have next to no experience in the larger guages/scales, but there is a difference between the quality engines and track between manufacturers in all of them, including HO, N, S, TT, and Z. Even some brass engines costing people $1000 15 years ago in HO scale needed work…sometimes a lot of work, to work right. Track is generally track, but a lot of the commercial turnouts have problems of one kind or another. Some of us hand lay track and turnouts to get the best performance. Peco turnouts are excellent in HO, and many are happy with Atlas turnouts, too…the newer Customline ones for sure. However, the snap together track in HO doesn’t win many converts, or doesn’t retain them for long. The Bachmann EZ-Track turnouts are rather poor, but they cost plenty. I just read on another forum where a person said all his Kato Unitrack fake plastic ballast had begun to turn yellow!
If you are spending something like $500/engine, for example, you are not getting the best that is available for the ‘gauge’. A scale engine that would run on your gauge would probably be twice as costly, easily. However, for the 3-rail tracks, I just don’t know enough.
The HO brands have, in many cases, their lower quality lines, and most of us who post here agree that you do get what you pay for. Trains sets, for example, and with some notable exceptions, are generally a source of frustration. But the higher priced lines with more finely detailed engines, the premier lines, get much better reviews and please more of their owners for a longer time before they begin to experience wear or engineering defects. A $300 HO engine should last 500 hours of pulling if it isn’t worked hard with maximum loads, is kept clean, and inspected and lubed every 40 hours or so. Brass engines in HO go for years and years, but they cost mucho moolah.
Several companies make turnouts in H
Crandell, Can you recommend some brands of locomotives and track/ switches that are trouble free. They don’t have to have the most detail on them they just have to work reliably. Thanks for your reply Niko
Hi Niko.
I model both in O gauge and in HO. Concerning O gauge, I really only have experience in buying the scale engines released by Lionel in the past decade, they are all scale sized and TMCC equipped, they run reliably for the most part, but are extremely expensive.
About track, I would go for Lionel Fastrack, you shouldn’t have any problems, I’ve used it for over a year now I swear by the stuff. Its easy to hook up, dismantle, its reliable, and their switches are simply amazing. Its great for kids, but realistic enough for adult 3 railers to enjoy also. Lionel Fastrack accessories haven’t given me any problems either, there is a lot of great stuff out there like crossing gates with flashers, uncoupling tracks, and so on. They all work fine for me.
I have heard some real horror stories about MTH’s track systems, reliability issues, etc. particuarly with their switches. I’ve also heard of issues with their customer service and repairs department.
I’m sorry to hear you are having problems in O gauge.
If you consider going to a smaller scale, perhaps N scale, I would recommend Kato. Their track is extremely high quality, and they are coming out with some amazing passenger sets as well.
If you are thinking about starting out in some HO, brands like Athearn and Atlas are certaintly worth a look.
The reality is there is no such thing as trouble free anywhere in any product line or endeavor. Even the highest quality products in the world will produce a lemon now and then.
How much maintenance work are you willing to do and how handy are you?. The reality of model railroading is that the larger the scale the more forgiving it will be of issues.
O scale trains will coast over a dead spot that is big enough tostall and HO scale. HO scale will ride over bumps that will toss your N off the tracks.
Track cleaning (important in any scale) becomes more important the smaller you go, etc, etc etc.
My suggestion (besides going over to the O boards) is to stick with the larger scale but maybe go over to the old three rail Lionel type track. The wiring is really very simple, the magnets etal very robust and quite honestly I’ve got 60 year old Lionel models that sat in a box for a couple of decades (they were my uncles and he hasn’t used them since I was in college) and fired right up the first time I put them on the tracks. On a table outside on the porch.
I’m kind of surprised about the MTH track. I only have a limited amount of the Realtrax (no switches), but what I have is reasonably well made. Most of the O gaugers I know think pretty highly of the MTH equipment. However, like almost all mass-produced toy and model train products, production was moved to Korea (then China) or China in the 1990s.
Quality control processes similar to automotive manufacturing don’t exist for Chinese production of toy and model trains. The US importer and the Chinese manufacturer design a product. Prototype samples are shipped to the importer for evaluation. Changes are agreed to for production. The Chinese manufacturer buys some components locally, produces the rest, and assembles the item - all at the cheapest rates that can be contracted for. Fully assembling things does provide a crude quality control - it’s obvious if a major part is missing. Other than that, the item goes into the box, packed into a container, and put on a ship for the US. The production lot is broken down by the importer and shipped to distributors and hobby shops. Meanwhile, the manufacturer has gone on to produce for another contract (and often different importer). Notice that there is no testing, and there is a focus on keeping costs under control.
If you buy from a good hobby shop, they may let you take the item out of the box and test it before buyin
Fred, Your post does offer an explanation why we end up with poor quality products, however, it doesn’t make me want to run out and buy them. I would rather pay a bit more, have a smaller layout, and quality products which I don’t have to spend hours to get running properly which is the reason for my original question. Who if any makes quality products, not junk I have to troubleshoot and fix? As far as MTH goes my experience is as follows: Locomotive - working fine, no major complaints ( this is a low end steam engine from a ready to run set) Realtrax track - A bit difficult to assemble and disassemble but workable. Sturdy on the carpet. Switches - Finicky. Don’t always work the way they should. Don’t know why. Remote activation switches do not have a good feel to them. Uncoupling/ Unloading Track - Not satisfactory. There appears to be a high defect rate in these. Activation switches are poor. Track should have been considerably longer than the length of a car so that its easy to align the car on the track.
MTH makes some quality products. Their engines are some of the best you can buy. I have a Realtrax layout and its been trouble free for years. The uncoupling tracks have always been a problem from the old Lionels up to the present offerings. And operating accessories have always been finnicky. No matter how much you spend there are always problems in any scale trains. Its just part of the hobby. Solving the problems and getting your layout to its best operable condition is the fun of it all. What would be the point if everything worked perfect right out of the box?[;)]
Niko, to get back wrt your question to me:
Atlas markets good track in Codes 100, 83, 70, and maybe 50…not sure about the 50. You can check on their site. Code 100 is bullet proof, and people swear by the other two larger ones. You must use packaged of thin metal joiners between each length. The track is flexible…one rail slides in its spikes while the other is fixed, but both bend to fashion curves. The sliding rail must be nipped (you’ll need a special cutting tool from Xuron, called a Rail Nipper…flush cutter.)
Peco makes flex track, and so does Micro Engineering. The latter is stiff and requires some learning to fashion consistent curves, and their weathered track is even worse because the painted rail feet get stuck in the spike head details. But, both companies make good track. Code 100 is klunky and well oversized in scale, so there is interest in Code 83 especially. Looks better, images better.
Turnouts…the best are the ones you make yourself (sizeable investment ($240ish) early if you want jigs and tools and rail stock, but if you make 15 turnouts, your costs come way down/unit. I use Peco Streamline Code 83 insulfrog turnouts because they are 'DCC friendly" (isolated/dead frog) and conform to N. American turnout configuration and geometry. Micro Engineering makes good ones, and so does Walthers/Shinohara. Central Valley sells kits, and they yield very nice turnouts. I don’t have any experience with the newest Customline Code 83 from Atlas, but my guess is they are quite good.
If you really are going to jump to another scale, there is much more learning for you yet, but maybe this helps you to move forward. Personally, unless your fire really is out for O, I would take some of the advice and invest in some other track. Auto couplers…sorry, they are the stuff of dreams except for MTH’s HO offer
You are putting the train on carpet???
This is abuse, right up there with driving your car under salt water…and wondering why the engine blows up.
Nigel, Let me see now. MTH 2009 RTR catalog says regarding Realtrax “Rugged. Because most toy trains empires begin on a carpet or floor, RealTrax is designed to hold up to the rigors of childhood play.” and also shows a picture of a person stepping on the track. And you think that a month of running RealTrax on carpet is abuse. MTH is advertising their track as though enough for this “abuse” of toy trains. Crandell, Thanks for the information. It’s what I was looking for. I am a bit confused regarding your statement on auto couplers. Are you saying that there are couplers that work much better than the ones the MTH trains come with. Can you please elaborate? Thanks Niko Niko
Niko,
Welcome to the forum sorry for the first time out of the box bad experience but I know some will disagree with me get used to it. Your LHS is right you purchased a more top of the line product in some respects with MTH but they are strangers to problems form what I understand. I have several of their HO steam locomotives which have had some issues that have been corrected by MTH. Sorry to say but model railroading has fallen in to the mass of products that have poor quality control. It seems to hold true that the higher the price the better the QC is on the product. Well that used to hold true with automobiles but look at Toyota need I say more. One thing I can tell you is that as fun and enjoyable model railroading is it can be as equally frustrating. If you don’t have patients you will either learn them or trash your trains and throw them in the garbage.It a sad thing to say but for what the manufacture lacks in quality control and pre-delivery inspection is expected to be picked up by us the consumer.
I wish I could say go buy brand X model trains and you’ll have a trouble free time but that just ain’t gonna happen. The only intelligent recommendation I can offer is do your research before you purchase anything in the future. This website has a good practical knowledge base form its members and the staff so take advantage of it and I hope your future in model railroading is brighter and more enjoyable then your start.