When I was at Edelstein the other day, I saw that the tracks have been laid up to about a 1000 yard from the BNSF mainline. What I saw was the racks sitting on top of cement ties. This is cominf form a novice, but how much more do they have to do. Do they they put the rock and ballast down after they set the rails? When do they put the switches down? Just curious. Thanks for your info
From what I recall from a friend at UP, they want to be operational in April. That would allow UP trains out of Chicago to turn South at Nelson, then get on BNSFtoward KC and through to the UP route to Tucumcari and the Sunset Route to LA or vice versa eastbound. They should be able to make a pretty solid 4th PM / 5th AM run w/ intermodal trains. This set up allows trains from G1, G2, G3, and Canal St. too all use this routing.
So what takes so long to build such a little bit of track. My guess is finallizing some of the agreements between UP and BNSF moreso than the actual engineering / construction work.
Would the weather have a factor in not finishing it? Perhaps they do not want to lay down the ballast etc until there is a thaw.
ed
Just as a note: In 1975 the CNW-UP delivered early 3rd morning on Chicago to L.A. freight with the regularity of a clock. We could pick up LTL on Monday afternoon, cross-dock it in our freighthouse where we consolidated it into trailers for L.A., deliver the trailers to the “Falcon’s Nest” on Wood Street in Chicago, and make the evening’s Flacon for L.A.
The train would arrive early enough on Thursday morning to allow another cross-dock of the freight where it was sorted into Thursday morning delivery routes for the local trucks. We were fully time competitive with any over the road trucker and we were using CNW-UP (or the ATSF, which was actually the “Go To” route.)
Tuesday’s origins were delivered Friday morining, Wednesday and Thursday were “cold” days, because almost nobody received freight on the weekends. But Friday night the Falcon really flew. Friday was a heavy shipping day, and that Friday freight from Chicago was delivered Monday morning in L.A. That’s 3rd morning on a 2,200 mile run. By rail.
Now it’s 4th afternoon/5th morning?
March is the date I heard for getting the connection operational. I believe the rest of the ties and rails are BNSF’s responsibility. Mudchicken may be able to provide a better answer, but I believe it makes more sense to put the ballast down from railcars after the track is laid, then bring it up to the proper height, cross level, etc.
Trains magazine said in this months issue that it will be operational in April 07
BNSF still does run a 3rd day train, but its pricey - mostly just LTL and Parcel riding that one. Truckload trains run 4-5 days. UP is 4-5 days. Unfortunately, the reliability for all of them has dimished as attributed to the congestion in the terminals and line-of-road. Albeit, UP has come back somewhat from the slump 2 years ago.
Could finishing the connection be delayed because of other improvments being made to the Nelson Sub getting it ready for the stack trains?
CC
Greyhound
That Friday - Monday was essentially an “overnight” delivery. The shippers must have just loved that!
No doubt the congestion of the coal traffic on the UP has slowed that service down. Also, in the 70’s the railroads has just finished off running passenger trains. Essentially, the Falcon (or Super C) was a passenger schedule. They had quite a bit more capacity to run those trains.
I think UP found out a few years ago when they ran the UPS train that it disrupted other schedules.
UP will have difficultly running this on a faster schedule because of the Sunset Route west of El Paso and also into and out of Chicago.
Any idea of how many trains they are looking at turning north at Edelstein per day? Are they limited on their trackage rights agreement to the number of trains they can push thru on the BNSF?
ed
In the 70s I was a intermodal manager for a large steamship line. I used to route our MLB traffic UP (Fre) CNW (Chic) NW (Bflo) & DH to Oak Island Newark. By using the UPRR/CNWRR Falcon & NWRR/DHRR Apollo service we used to obtain a 48 hour coast to coast transit time with most days we are able to offer our custmers 4th day delivery
spbed:
Did you really mean 48 hour service from coast to coast? That doesnt seem right. Perhaps 48 hours to Chicago, but even that would be pushing it.
I got one photo of Apollo back in 1976 on the NW. What was their scheduled time from Chciago to NJ?
ed
The plan I’ve read about was one pair of daily stack trains to start then as track capacity is added (double track from connection two miles north to Speer and a long passing track at Normandy) additional trains will be diverted to the new route. I’ve read/heard 8-12 at some point, including some automotive trains. Rumors are that UP will emphasize its Villa Grove Sub for intermodal and priority manifests and so they might shift another pair of merchandise trains to the Peoria Sub. Just rumors for now.
If trains will come off of the Villa Grove sub, does that mean these are trains from the Kansas City area which are going thru St. Louis and up to Chicago?
I guess it could be St. Louis - Chicago freight which could route up the old GMO to Springfield and then up to Nelson, although that would not go via the connector. Once they increase capacity on the line, they will have options for routing freight from several cities.
ed
[quote user=“greyhounds”]
Just as a note: In 1975 the CNW-UP delivered early 3rd morning on Chicago to L.A. freight with the regularity of a clock. We could pick up LTL on Monday afternoon, cross-dock it in our freighthouse where we consolidated it into trailers for L.A., deliver the trailers to the “Falcon’s Nest” on Wood Street in Chicago, and make the evening’s Flacon for L.A.
The train would arrive early enough on Thursday morning to allow another cross-dock of the freight where it was sorted into Thursday morning delivery routes for the local trucks. We were fully time competitive with any over the road trucker and we were using CNW-UP (or the ATSF, which was actually the “Go To” route.)
Tuesday’s origins were delivered Friday morining, Wednesday and Thursday were “cold” days, because almost nobody received freight on the weekends. But Friday night the Falcon really flew. Friday was a heavy shipping day, and that Friday freight from Chicago was delivered Monday morning in L.A. That’s 3rd morning on a 2,200 mile run. By rail.
Now it’s 4th afternoon/5th morning?
If BNSF has no problem letting UP hook onto the So
Traffic moving on the Villa Grove Sub has nothing to do with the Edelstein Connection. Union Pacific intermodal trains that use the Villa Grove Sub operate between Chicago (Yard Center), IL and Little Rock, AR, and Dallas (Mesquite), Houston, Laredo and San Antonio, TX. Manifest traffic moves between Chicago area customers and connections and points in Arkansas, Louisiana, Texas and Mexico (KCSM), especially petrochemical products. One pair of manifests, MNLPR and MPRAS could be shifted to the Peoria Sub/IMRR/SPCSL route as congestion worsens on the single-track Villa Grove Sub.
Possibly, the Conrail Transaction and the shift of traffic to run-through trains with CSXT via Salem and with NS via Sidney in 1999 eliminated the remaining merchandise trains over the SPCSL. Other traffic would have been shifted to the Villa Grove Sub if the Chicago Switching District was the origin and destination and interchange with connections other than CSXT and NS. By October 1996, the UP shifted the old C&NW manifests off the old S. I. in favor of the Villa Grove Sub. Congestion likely led UP to shift one pair of trains (MASPR and MPRAS) to the Peoria Sub/IMRR/SPCSL route in August 2000. MPRAS again runs on the Villa Grove Sub but MPRPB has replaced it on the old C&NW route.
UP has the right to run intermodal and automotive trains over the BNSF Transcon so those are the only train types you’ll see use the connection. The intermodal trains that will be shifted to the new route when the Edelstein Con
From LA 4th morning in NYC so that would be 96 hours. Seattle also via UP/CNW was 5th morning in NYC
bn:
Thanks for the detailed report of traffic movements on the two subs. I was not very clear in my explanation of the use of the Springfield - Nelson routing. It would not use the Edelstein Connection. I am aware of that. But, if there is increased capacity on that line, it could shift traffic from the Villa Grove sub to that routing, if necessary.
I really dont know much about the current operations on any of the three UP north - south lines in Illinois, but I would think the Villa Grove sub north of Woodlawn Jct would get a bit congested at times.
Thanks,
ed
After the new connection is completed, does it mean that UP trains will be running on the BNSF line through Rochelle, as well as on their own??
al
No, Al, not at all. The BNSF line at the “other” end of the connection is the former ATSF main line between Chicago and Galesburg (via Joliet). The BNSF line through Rochelle runs from Aurora to the Twin Cities. A whole “nuther” thing.
Thanks for the routing reply!
al-in-chgo