Is there any data out there comparing the EE CSVT prime mover against the ALCO 251 and the GE FDL I assume that the CSVT was close to the ALCO 251 in specific fuel economy in V12 form but had more interesting maintenance procedures and the CSVT using timing chains over the timing gears that made it a more expensive engine to maintain than the ALCO and the GE. I know the later RK’s are well thought of in marine service but when used in the BR 56/58 they were less than stellar. I wonder were the issues more to do with the loco than the prime mover itself.
On a side note, I was watching a youtube stating that Sulzer were contracted to fix the issues with the GE FDL I find that hard to believe seeing that Sulzer were developing the LVA series engines.
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Timing chains on a large diesel engine sounds like a recipe for disaster.
I suspect the CSVT’s reliability was sufficient as QR,TGR and WAGR in Australia and on the the EAR, RR in Africa and CP in Europe who also had them and they worked ok From looking at the prime movers going by what I have seen on YT the CSVT looks more complex than the Alco 251 which was a NSWGR favorite. It was interesting that the former South Australian railways started dieselisation with English Electric and then went ALCO pretty quickly once the 251 was proven so I suspect there must have been some serious economics in the ALCO’s favor and in the NSWGR case they were always of the belief that pre-super series EMD, ALCO with GE/AEI electricals offered more efficiency over EMD and EE’s control systems for loco’s under 2000hp.
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Can you post a link?
A number of Western railroads attempted replacement of 7FDL engines with Sulzer engines, but that could only remotely be considered “fixing” the 7FDL engine concerns. There was an interesting laundry list of reported problems with the replacement engines, including the expected problems with both intake and exhaust valves (especially, probably, on SP – compare the experience with the K-M diesel-hydraulics).
To my knowledge none of the Sulzer repowers in this country were successful beyond testing. It may be indicative that the four TE-70 4S rebuilds sat many years after the Sulzer engines were removed (iirc for marine use) but no further effort was made to repower or rebuild them. I confess I was surprised that the M-K rebuild of an EMD using a 6-cylinder Sulzer during the ‘fuel crisis’ years failed to thrive.
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This might be of interest for those unfamiliar with the design:
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I’m no pro at prime movers but I had an AI overview to explain it to me and this might help:
The English Electric CSVL and ALCO 251 were both very popular in their day, but the GE FDL generally had the edge in terms of horsepower and reliability, especially in the later models. The ALCO 251 was a robust engine, known for its reliability and ease of maintenance, while the CSVL, while initially competitive, had maintenance issues, particularly with its timing chains. The GE FDL was a stronger engine, and with advancements in its design, it offered even greater horsepower and reliability, making it a dominant force in the locomotive industry.
Here’s a more detailed comparison:
English Electric CSVL:
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Initially a strong competitor to the ALCO 251, it had some maintenance issues, especially with its timing chains, making it potentially more expensive to maintain. The later RK models, while well-regarded in marine service, had mixed results in locomotive applications.
ALCO 251:
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A reliable and robust engine known for its performance and ease of maintenance. It was used in a wide variety of applications, including locomotives, marine power plants, and stationary power generators.
GE FDL:
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The GE FDL engine, particularly in its later iterations, offered greater horsepower and reliability than the ALCO 251. With advancements in design, it became a dominant force in the locomotive industry.
Be very careful with AI. It tried to tell me yesterday that Sulzer had their own “FDL” engine.
I am careful and I will be, and What…
Here is that youtube that mentions how GE went to a “swiss lab” which most likely Sulzer to fix the FDL’s water leaks in the 50’s. How true this is I will defer to the experts.
