I purchased a Rivarossi UP 844 engine about two years ago before my layout was complete. It was brand new when I bought it and recently I have began to run it around the layout and I have become so frustrated with it I am tempted to sell it or just put it on the shelf. Here is my problem: whenever the engine goes around a turn the drivers and/or the tender wheels come off the track. My track radius is 30in. It also comes off the track when it goes over a small hump in the plywood. All of my other engines and rolling stock run flawlessly on the layout. If anyone has had similar problems or have solutions please let me know.
I say sell it. Then save up the money to buy either the upcoming Athearn Genesis FEF or the super improved version Rivarossi.
When are the Athearn FEF’s coming out? I have not heard of them.
Its announced on this site in the news. I guess Athearn has a thing for UP steam. I’m curious why they didn’t at least go with a 2-10-2 or Harriman 2-8-2 if they were picking somthing UP.
Sounds to me the problem may be that the drawbar between loco and tender is not free to swivel or move freely or the tender is too close to the loco and the cab is hanging up on the front of the tender, or if it has a “sill” that has droped down and has the tender and loco in a bind. Something is preventing movement between the tender and loco I’ll just betcha. Ken
my thoughts exactly.The last run, (Walthers version) has an adjustable drawbar, which slides in and out with a catch lock. I would also get out my wheel gauge and check the drivers, if the’re too wide the loco will climb over the rails if they even slightly bind.
This is a solvable problem, and if you can stand me sounding like I am lecturing (I’m not, really…) a learning opportunity. Let me explain.
If you had a PRR J1 2-10-4 advertised by BLI as needing 24" mins for curves, and a BLI Niagara 4-8-4 good down to 22" curves, which locomotive do you think would be the real test for your track work? Why the much longer wheel-based J1, right?
Nope.
It will be the 4-8-4 every time. Trust me on this, the 4-8-4 is the one item in my stable that gives me fits. I can careen a Lionel Challenger, my J1 (favorite engine…sigh), and anything else I run throughout my layout, but if Murphy wants to put his boot on my tracks, guess which loco will trip over it?
So, in order:
Gauge, many places on the track, turnout points, curves, any joins, and every wheel set.
Secondly, press pairs of axles to one side of their trucks, with the loco inverted, and see if the wheel flanges are in line. Drivers too. You might be surprised.
Check clearance between the tender (anywhere even close to the cab or rear truck) around every curve. Pay attention to that drawbar mentioned in the earlier post. I didn’t know about the Riv drawbar… What is it doing?
Put a straight edge, preferrably with a bubble, across the tracks if there is a particular trouble spot. Get down and peer between the rails and the bottom of the straight edge. Do you see any dips or humps? Bet you do. Maybe inconsequential, maybe not. Maybe the FEF is trying to tell you something. My stubborn locos complained mostly about kinky tracks that I had not noticed before.
Finally, what are the two trucks doing? Are they able to pivot freely? If they don’t pivot freely, there is the problem. On the other hand, if the front one, especially , is a bit light, it might like to climb up on the rails on curves. You
I have one of these Riv FEF-3’s also. Don’t know if this will make you feel any better:
I have about 27 steam locos, half BLI’s, but also P2K, Bachmann, Athearn, Trix and Lionel. My track system is Peco code 75 with 36" min radius curves and turnouts which I tried to keep flat and kink-free. Without a doubt, the FEF-3 is the most troublesome. It doesn’t back up well into frogs, and it easily pops one driver set off track. I have looked at the driver gauge and freedom of the driver axles to adjust to curves, but havn’t pinned down the problem. The tender rear truck design seems not to work well in reverse.
My Riv Allegheny seems to work quite well. I heard a rumour that it actually was designed by the old Proto 2000 bunch. Certainly not the same designers as the FEF-3.
Hal
All of the above are good suggestions. You need to decide if you are going to shelve or sell every problem you encounter, or solve it. If you solve it, down the road it will serve you in good stead and greatly enhance your problem solving skills. My first engine was a brass N&W J, and she was and still is VERY picky about trackwork. I had a heck of a time getting my first trackwork so the loco would even run, but the side benefit was that once that baby ran, everything else I ever got ran great too, unless it was an engine issue, and then I knew that’s what it was.
A SMALL HUMP IN THE PLYWOOD says it all, trackwork problems and the more scale the loco ( flanges ect.) the more you will have problems .
I just receved a 2-8-4 and it was derailing quite a bit I added a strip of styreen to keep the trucks from picking and it works awsome
I did try to add weight to the trucks and that did not work
but that strip made the world of difference
heck I’ll buy it from ya
K
Not to beat the J1 drum too much, but it is my favorite engine.
Unfortunately I have a rigid wheelbase with no independant suspension on that engine. It will find any problems with the track.
I have seen a FEF run on the layout at Pine Bluff in the train show there and I gotta tell ya, it was a rough rider. Im not sure if I still have the video but if I do will process it and upload to youtube and post the link here.
Just last night I was putting my Spectrum 4-6-0 thru a new switch and it stalled past the frog. I found the problem to be a too tight gaurd rail on the diverging route pinching the flange against the track. The J1 went bump over that offending rail gaurd.
If only manufacters install a credible suspension system that allows each drive axle of a steam engine to “Follow” irregularity in the track…
How do you tell if you have an old or new version of the Rivarossi FEF-3, UP #844…
I have a new one in a box that I’ve never tried to run.
The Flanges are probably going to be pretty deep on the old one, I honestly dont know.
The new ones are in the 5471 series. The old ones are in the 1500 and something series. The old ones are good for shelfs.
Thanks CAZEPHYR
Mine says 5429 on the box.
The new ones are also DCC ready and come in a much nicer box.
Mine is the newer version of the FEF’s. I haven’t very much trouble with the pilot truck but rather the first driver wheel is the one that comes off. It only occurs when it goes around the corner which has no hump at all and is perfectly smooth.
Glad I saw this. My Bachmann Spectrum Mountain 4-8-2 is bad at doing this. So I think I’ll give your solution a try.
I’m surprised that your problem is with the new version, as Rviarossi put more lateral driver travel in the updated versions, tho RP25 flanges can make it more likely to derail than the old pizza cutters. Does it always derail in the same spot? That would suggest a problem in the track alignment, even if only slight. Do the drivers show any signs of binding? Is something restricting the lateral movement of the axles? On the older models the spring pin pickups would sometimes push the drivers too hard to one side, which is the reason my old version FEF3 derails on curves, but only in one direction.
And as was said before, check the wheel gauge, and make sure you’re using the last drawbar hole for the tender. Not as critical on large radius, but the cab and tender might still collide.
Nelson