I have two Fast Track turnouts but I did not build them myself, I purchased them to replace 36" radius curved turnouts that were originally Peco brand. The Fast Track turnouts are far superior and if I could afford to I would buy all my turnouts made on their fixtures. I don’t have the ambition to build them myself at age 70. Just my opinion.
-Bob
I realize that while spikes are an option, Fast Tracks are designed to have the rail assembly glued to the ties.
Is anyone who uses Fast Tracks bothered by the absence of spikes?
Is it obvious?
Rich
“So, anyone that has no experience with Fasttracks in NOT allowed to voice ANY opinion about their products…none. If you do, your word means nothing.”
Well said.
Appearance of model track has traditionally fallen way behind locomotives and cars in terms of visual fidelity to prototype and realism. Weathering has often been used to cover up for the sins of omission and commission, as well as the argument that solid operation was higher priority than appearance (there is some truth there if you want an operating layout and not a display). And the 87ft viewing rule is cited (but it applies to your locomotives and rolling stock, too).
There are a few model railroaders who do pursue the same level of realism in their track that many take pride in seeing in their locomotives. Proto87 Stores is the best source of supplies for these folks - and yes, Andy generally makes his parts available in both NMRA-spec and Proto87 spec. Andy also has his own turnout kits that make into highly detailed, excellent performing turnouts.
Once you start looking at track in prototype photos, you begin to realize how much prototype track varies in appearance by usage, region, railroad, and especially era. This variation is not generally well captured in any of the model track systems.
Traditional spiked handlaid track on stained wood ties - especially when only spiked every 4th or 5th tie as was the custom - is not all that accurate, either. The spikes are usually considerably oversize, and if you model after 1920 or so, tie plate detail is missing. Glued construction on wood ties has the same appearance sans the oversize spike heads. Soldered construction on PC board ties has the same appearance as glued, with the added burden of getting the PC board ties to match the other ties in terms of appearance.
Ther
Color and texture are most important. At normal viewing distance (two or more feet), spike detail is irrelevant.
If you follow that point to its logical conclusion, then there should be precious little posting on this forum. Those of you who have never actually built a layout using Homasote roadbed are forbidden from commenting on Homasote. Those who don’t model 1900 are forbidden from commenting in any way on any photos of my layout I submit. Those who use Digitrax can’t answer any questions on MRC or NCE. And certainly are not allowed to tell a DC user he should use DCC.
Just because I have hand laid track without Fast Tracks jigs doesn’t mean I don’t understand them or haven’t investigated them.
Fred W
DrBob,
I am using the Fast Tracks system to assemble the turnouts for my layout. Here’s my take on it:
If you haven’t already purchased it yet, I would recommend buying the “crossover” jig in the # size of your choice. This will allow you to make left and right turnouts, single crossovers, double crossovers, and a diamond crossing all from one jig, so its a little more cost effective.
As far as using the system for the layout build and not needing it after completion, I disagree. There may be expansion opportunities later, or complete new layout. You never know what the future will bring.
Anyway, these are my findings and opinions, your mileage may vary.
Pete
Seriously, if you don’t have any physical experience with a product, keep your “expertise” to yourself. No need to push your inexperienced opinions on a product you have ZERO experience with.
I, on the other hand, have LOTS of experience with the OP’s product and I am able to answer his question to the fullest, and I already have.
David B
PS. In terms of detail, you can take hand-laying as far as you wish. As mentioned before, the Proto87 store has some great stuff. In my situation, my hand-layed CD40 N scale track will accept deep N scale flanges that my friends seen reluctant to replace with more practical flanges. My track will NOT stand up to spike detail scrutiny at 3 inches, but I looks great at 1 foot. CD55 and CD40 commercially available flex will not allow for deep flanges.
Gotta keep the friends happy.
Finally, someone sane comes forward. Thank you. I agree fully.
On the contrary, to provide complete and full analysis, one must be familiar with and a user of both the product in question, and its competitors. But I see this is going the same road as the NCE vs Digitrax. Without experience and expertise with both products - which very few have - there is no valid product comparison, only anecdotal experience.
And yet you arbitrarily write off my anecdotal experience without even knowing what it is. You know I haven’t used Fast Tracks jigs to build turnouts (because I said so in my posts). But you don’t know which Fast Tracks tools and products I have found useful, and which I haven’t. You don’t know which Fast Tracks products I have studied and decided not to buy. You don’t know how many Fast Tracks videos I have watched, and which I found useful for understanding and constructing hand laid track.
I presented the OP with a drawback (he asked for drawbacks) that is not always apparent to those whose only experience is commercial and Fast Tracks turnouts. And that is by not using specialized jigs, one can easily construct custom geometries and sizes not available in the Fast Tracks line.
And I could correctly answer another poster’s question about lack of turnout details with Fast Tracks because I had studied the results of some friends who have built turnouts from Fast Tracks kits, and the small turnout manufacturers that use Fast Tracks jigs
Hi,
I have read many answer about this post and I agree whith the most.
However before killing Fastrack because of the price, Tim Warris has open the way about handlay turnouts and i’ts amazing to see how much great operating layout use their devices; a few weeks ago question on the MR forum was asking were to find custom made Fastrack turnouts.
Don’t forget a turnout in HO or Nscale turn around 20$; a medium sized layout need quickly 25 turnouts so a jig is an around three turnout…whith a full NMRA and fine scale turnout.
You can buy crossover jig so You have the cross and the turnout in one jig.
Tools except may be the frog tools are not really necessary; good file do the job.
And forget the laser ties; they are great but to much expensive; lay Your own.
Rails could be found at many store which make slow prices.
Not convinced, handlay Your turnout from scratch i’ts the cheapest approach but it take time.
You need also consider the scale You use; the smaller one like N are tiny to work whith.
I am a user of the Fastrack Jig system but in Nscale; I use n°6, n°8 and curved n°8 whith additionnal custom jig for curved one.
Why, because in Nscale You need to be very accurate when building a turnout; I would say the Fastrack are somewhere to much accurate for steam loco and the wing rails at the frog need to be open like Mister Lance Midenheim explained in the january Mr issue.
You can produce a lot of turnouts , in fine scale and accurate, in a quick time, important if You are, like me, working on a large layout.
I build my turnout in serials, so I have some in stock; building them in batch allow me to know exactly whath to do for each one; building only one at a time and You forget some tips.
I also now handlay some directly in place were I need special turnout.
Yes expensive but take a look at this system it’s great anyway and helpful for the small scale to hanlay super turnout.
Marc
As the owner/user of a #8 crossover jig, I am very happy with the FT system.
I’ve built individual turnouts, ladders, and multiple crossovers and have been very pleased with my results.
Still have lots of commercial (Atlas and Walthers Shinohara C83) turnouts on the layout, but anything in the yard is FT jig built, as will anything on the upper level, and I am seriously considering ripping out a set of crossovers built with Atlas #8s, as they have started to have performance issues.
If you take a look at a blog post I put up here while I was building the ladder, you can get an idea of what can be done with the jig.
Can all this be done by hand sans a jig? Absolutely.
Could I do that? Nope.
You have to take honest stock of your skillset and resources then figure out what you can reasonably accomplish in the hobby time you have. As a “middle-aged working stiff” with 2 kids, wife, house, job, etc, my train time is limited, so I went with the jig versus spending the dollars on commercial stuff that I would have to mess with anyway.
I know there are greybeards (to use a computing term) here on this forum and a few in the local area that I operate with who can do this stuff quickly, efficiently and beautifully, but they aren’t building my railroad, I am. (Which isn’t to say that I haven’t had some help on my layout either…)
I’d like to think that eventually, I will get the skills necessary to hand lay all kinds of cool and exotic track, but I’m not holding my breath.
I’ve purchased commercial turnouts, own fast tracks jigs, and have hand laid turnouts.
David has some excellent points, concerning the cost issue folks raise, and the fact that quite often on this forum, the signal to noise ratio is often weakened due to seemingly mandatory inclusion by folks who don’t have experience with the product but are determined to have their say. I’ve come to realize that is just the way it works here. I don’t necessarily mean you Fred, as often your comments are balanced, and I think you’ll understand my point.
The downside of the Fast Tracks system is the prototypical appearance (as noted). I still haven’t considered if that’s enough of an issue for me yet. I spike my skeleton to wooden ties, so the lack of spike detail is also not a big deal.
I don’t consider the price a negative. I’ve made more than enough turnouts to cover my costs as compared to a commercial product. I also consider them a live educational seminar; certainly not much different than paying for a hands on workshop at a convention. Not all of us have immediate access to skilled hobbyists.
The products work well, as advertised, and are a lot of fun. I went from commercial turnouts and flex, to hand laid track (using FT jigs), to hand laid track using FT jigs and hand laid turnouts. I don’t think that would have happened with out the Fast Tracks system.
It’s often marked that you are “stuck” in a template. That’s not necessarily a problem, or true. I say it’s not a problem, as often we don"t (I haven’t) needed a ton of non-standard turnouts. No. 5 and 6 seem to fit just fine in 95% of my applications. And when you do, again, the jig system has provided me with the skills to move forward and build the one-off.
I also say it’s not true; if you buy a cross over (as sagely recommended), you now can make a double or single crossover, and a normal turnout. If you’re HO, you can also build code 70 and 83 in the same jig (as the rail web for the ME rail) is the same siz
I’ve just built two FT turnouts and thoroughly enjoyed the experience. Yes the initial template costs are high, although one gets enough material to build 5 turnouts with the template and the how-to videos on their website are truly professional—some of the best I’ve ever seen. As another poster mentioned, I considered this something like going to a hands on seminar but in the comfort of my own home/workbench. I learned a great deal about turnouts in general plus the confidence and pride involved in making my own. Other posters have mentioned the lack of detail with the final product; however, once painted and at a viewing distance of a couple of feet this lack of detail becomes a moot point.
I also use FT’s Bullfrog manual turnout controls and have found them to be very useful and problem free. FT is a product and company that comes highly recommended.
Wayne
I’m mostly encouraged by these posts. Someone wanting to build something!! As opposed to RTR.
The FastTracks system is well thought out and the support good. As you get more experience you may find you need less help and can find other ways. Also, hard to buy code 100 60R/40R curved turnouts.
Richard
http://www.flickr.com/photos/22287360@N04/7671819924/in/photostream/
Here are some photos of my Central Valley track and turnouts. This is a work in progress and more weathering and detailing is to be done. I have modified the throw bars to look more prototypical. All the switch stand targets are driven by the switch machines. The rail is Code 55.60, and 70.
Photos are a great idea!
Here the last set of FT turnouts that went in (started and completed since this post was started in February). Note that there is only one set of rail connectors between each all of those turnouts - they were built as two large “sets” - including the one in the foreground.
Here’s another shot during construction
and I finally sorted out a way to minimize through layout feeders, but still provide power to all segments, through the natural conductivity of the PC ties.
and while I don’t have any really good shots, this one kinda shows off the crossover. I don’t know about you, but the lack of ties plates just doesn’t bother me.
