We don’t have basements in CA and I need my garage to park my car. I thought, “Ah-Ha, I have a back yard!!!” Has anyone heard of someone building an HO garden railroad or similar type project? How feasable is it? Any thoughts?
Take care,
Sean
Hey Sean, I don’t know about an outdoor HO layout, but when I went to the lockesaints website to see where in CA you lived, I got treated to some great music! Does “brothaslide” have anything to do with a trombone?
Anyway, since you live in relatively dry LA, I don’t see any reason you couldn’t build outside. You’d have to stick to hydrocal or plastic structures, but why not give it a shot? Build a test layout and see how it weathers next winter’s rains.
That would be a nice idea but not sure if it would work
DOGGY
Even with a cover like a roof it seems that heat expansion and sun fading would be an issue
Here’s a link to a VERY SMALL garden railroad in a planter box–in HOn30!
http://www.carendt.com/microplans/pages/venues/boxes/index.html#1
Here’s another–intended for Gn15 but would be suitable for HO:
http://www.carendt.com/microplans/pages/multiples/index.html#1
On30 is, supposedly, suitable for garden railroads. I suppose you might be able to do so, either On30 or fairly heavy-duty HO, but you’d have to have very rugged trackwork. I wouldn’t try such a thing in Sacramento, because summers here are too hot and winters too rainy–but maybe you’re in San Diego or something. Of course, in downtown Sacramento some houses have basements…mine doesn’t, but that can be rectified in a slightly less intense housing market…hmmm…
I don’t use my garage to store my car (partially because mine is a “zero-car garage”–it’s too small to hold my car) so my layout is in there, but there are ways to put both a layout and a car in a garage–around-the-wall shelf layouts, a high-level layout where the hood of the car sits under the layout, or an elevated layout that can be dropped down when the car isn’t in the garage.
The British use OO all the time for their garden railways, considering they have no basements and the other rooms in the house are usually full of family, etc. One of their “back yards” (gardens) is only about the size of a usual American basement, so it sort of makes sense. And most of the UK has weather only slightly worse than California.
I’d say go for it! Do a internet search for British modeling to find some inspiration, and start building.
Sean,
Got patio? My first layout, '87, I built outside on the patio as the house I lived in was way to small for even my family. BTW at that time I was living in Riverside, CA.
Only caveats I’m aware of are that the plastic used for the ties isn’t UV-resistant and will decompose after prolonged exposure to direct sunlight. Also, many large-scale garden railroaders use on-board battery power and radio control to eliminate the various issues associated with corrosion, conductivity, etc.when trying to power locomotives via the rails. Might be difficult (but not impossible) to do that in HO.
Brett,
Good technical info - this appeals to the mechanical engineer in me. I’m becoming more intrigued by the challenge of doing it. I also like the OO post regarding British garden OO railroads. While I was out and about today I was already trying to consider the enviromental challenges and how to overcome them.
HO Garden model railroad - Yeah, it’s a challenge, but not imposible.
Sean
I remember seeing one in a magazine years ago, so it has been done. As I remember , it had benchwork around 3-4 feet high and ran along a fence from the back of the garage. I think it had storage tracks on a shelf along one wall in the garage with a hole to connect to the outside track. If it’s your only choice go for it. Personnaly I’d consider a larger scale with better operating characteristics.
Enjoy
Paul
this idea appeals to me greatly, also to my friend Gilbert, a large friendly Tom Cat.
I can just see him getting good exercise chasing after an Athern Hustler around the 133 foot leg of the backyard, then down the 110 foot leg and around the 65 feet to the back door.
Seriously though it is a wonderful idea.
- anti UV paint for the track such exists. Try a paint store.
- think of an around the yard layout at the 40 inch level with an openable cover or an uv blocking greenhouse clear plastic cover.
- the RC-battery combination is a super idea perhaps with yards or sidings to recharge the rechargable batteries that power it.
- for low outdoor HO layouts the selection of ground cover plants can look amazingly like desert or forest
foliage. - Imagine what a fully lighted heavyweight full length passenger train, rushing through the night would look like with LONG runs and the mental image of a train full of interesting people going inter esting places.
Doug, in Utah
Not to mention the melting of plastic shells in that heat.
best to go to O or G and do it in brass.
Jay
Why? As I posted before, the British build OO layouts in their backyards all the time, without any real ill effects. And the UK has a similar climate to the Midwest (well, they don’t have our extremes, but the middle is about the same). A plastic train body isn’t an M&M left out in the sun; it’s not going to be a puddle before your eyes. Admittedly, O or G is great for outdoor use (that’s what G was designed for), but HO/OO will work just as well. And why bother with brass except for a special model? Using your logic for not using plastic bodies, a brass body will act as a giant heatsink, frying any electronics and the motor windings.
He’s not in the midwest, he’s in southern california where it’s always sunny with relitively low humidity. try this test, take your favorite plastic shelled loco, put it in your cal on the seat in 60 degree weather in the midwest, watch as it melts in 80-90 degree interior tempeture and you have witnessed west coast weather in it’s glory.
And England (having been there), i can say isn’t anywhere near Midewest climate, it’s usually averaging 40-60 degrees year round, and probably cloudly 70% of the time. making it well suited for HO/OO scale layouts outside in plastic bodies. Thier only downfall is the salt in the air when it’s humid or when it rains.
as for the brass and metal bodies, they are usually painted with paints that help reflect the light and thus keep the interal tempetures down.
Jay
80-90 degrees? Ahh, that’s a cool spring day here in the Central Valley. In deep summer it hits about 110 or so for a couple of weeks a year, and that car interior can get up to 140+ degrees. Then, in winter, it can drop to 30 degrees or so. An 80-degree variance in temperature can do a real number on one’s plastic things… The lotus-eaters on the southern California coast have it much easier (it’s pretty much 50-80 degrees most of the year) and the northcoast gets so much rain things would short out. In the southeastern California desert they’d shiver with cold and want to put on a sweater when someone mentions 110 degree temperatures…
“California climate” is kind of difficult to pin down–the state is big enough to have several types of climate, from desert to mountain to coastal wetlands.
I had about 300’ or so of HO rail in my backyard in NW Florida. Only problem I had from time to time was the rail running or sun kinks but this plays true even in a real railroad. As for keeping the TOR clean, I had to fab a grinding type unit fitted with a fine sanding wheel that I would run over the rails ever so often to get the TOR cleaned off.
Wow 16 months resurectedfrom the dead zone…
OK guys a few things about HO outdoors, it CAN be done but its not recommended…why?
A. Track non UV resistant-the ties will breakdown and deteriorate if not coated in UV resistant paint. non UV plastic car bodies will follow suit.
B. HO switches foul far easier and are not designed for exposure to weather. Their insides will rot away in nothing flat. So now your going to have to install custom throws that can accomodate the extremes of weather.
C. Non-sealed drives on HO locomotives. Large Scale lokies had sealed motor blocks that keep out water, dust, grit, and critters. HO lokies will require constant cleaning to keep the crud out or from building up.
D. Super easy to derail, any twig, leaf, bug, or not very light breeze will knock or blow the train right off the tracks.
E. Need perfect track inside? well same outside especially in HO where doing well done track inside in hard, outside its a downright pain. Most OO setups tracks are set into cast concrete to keep the track secure and stable. Large scale trains have big flanges and alot of wiggle room that forgives alot of bad track placement. HO is never forgiving.
F. Heat, will warp track causing kinks, warp plastic body shells, and shorten the lives of your engines motors. All wheels have to be metal, plastics will melt on the hot track on a hot day.
G. Weather; cant run when its remotely damp, rainy or drizzley, or windy.
H. Power. Large scale powerpacks are designed for exterior use, some even in wet conditions, often including an automatic breaker that resets itself if there is a cross circuit. HO powerpacks are patently NOT designed for use in damp or wet conditions.
Large scale trains and tracks were designed for exterior usage with UV resistant track, designed for the inevitable wet conditions and can even be left out in the elements for an extended period of time.
It would work. Talk to the the Garden RR’s at the Garden RR forum, I hang over there myself. Perfect place to ask questions. Also be sure to look at Rene’s guide for beginners! It’s at the top of the General Discussion.
Hi all
This has been mentioned on the GRR forum
several times.
The general concensus is forget it for the reasons vsmith has mentioned
If you must go small scale outside then use “O” you can get UV stable track
it will stand up to marauding snails a lot better too.
Do be aware that out doors a lot of the fiddely bits that break get left off models for just that reason.
Better still go 10mm = 1 foot on gauge one then you can have real steam power that you have to drive.
Or may be one of the varieties of “G” scale on 45mm
regards John
I thought about this option once also but I had a small HO layout stored in a shed for a couple of years, some years back, the shed wasnt completly weather proofed and when I went to pull it out the (nickel silver) track needed alot of work and the points were stuffed.
This convinced me to forget HO outdoors…