I was on Ebay and saw this cool model for sale - it was a dead steam engine loaded on a heavily weathered flat car. Again I was impressed with this person’s handy work, but two things bothered me - one, the engine still had the drivers on and two, the engine looked like it was in a car accident, the side rods were bent and the drivers were skewed - if the engine was in that kind of wreck I would have thought the boiler would have exploded. But it did get me to thinking, how were dead steam engines sent to the scrap yard?
Seeing PRR 1361 on four flat cars would indicate that putting a steam loco on a flat car is a for a preservation effort. But seeing pictures of the Luria Bros. scrap line, the Reading engines appeared to be rolled to their final destination more or less intact (minus side rods), possible in a special train. If this is indeed the case, that is what I would like to do with my dead engines.
I have this old Tyco 0-8-0 that is a perfect candidate for scrap yard and it still rolls. I was thinking of putting Kadees on the front and finding a more appropriate tender. Weathering heavily and removing the appliances and removing the main rods, but leaving the cross heads in place.
I would love to hear you thoughts on this project, and if you have any ideas of what to leave on the engine and what to remove…
I am a little excited at the prospects of this project and the price is right. The dead loco can be pulled in a consist to the scrap yard. Or if I add a flat or gondola of parts to the consist, it could be on its way to restoration.
How a locomotive is sent or shipped dead-in-tow (to scrap or anywhere for that matter) would depend on the condition of the running gear. If it had broken or skewed drivers for some reason, usually an accident, it may be loaded on one or more flat or gondola cars to ship it. If it could be moved on its own wheels, the main rods would be disconnected and it would be towed in a train, usually near the front, and always at a restricted speed.
In model form, the other thing to consider if you decide to load it on a flat or gon, is the vertical clearance. Many locomotives are already near the max height, and lifting them up to the floor level of a car may make it too high for tunnels, bridges, etc.
The reason you saw K4 1361 shipped to Scranton that way is that it had already been disassembled in Altoona in a prior attempt to restore it.
Agree that in most cases (conditions permitting, that is) the engines were shipped dead-in-transit to whatever facility would handle the scrapping. Depending on the time period, the road might’ve done the scrapping itself. Certainly with C&NW in the 1930s (as documented by AW Johnson and others) this was the case at 40th Street in Chicago. Art
When a steam locomotive was sent to the scrapper on its own wheels the main rods would always be removed. Occasionally the side rods would also be removed but that was much less common.
The main rods were sometimes ‘removed’ with a torch, leaving short lengths dangling from the crossheads and main pins. OTOH, the only reason for removing the side rods would be if they had been bent in some mishap.
Steam loco drivers had counterbalancing weights to compensate for the rotating weight of the side rods (and the big end of the main rod,) so complete rod removal would put the mechanism seriously out of balance. Wheel hop severe enough to damage rails could occur at remarkably low speed. OTOH, only the N&W ever operated a seriously damaged locomotive at anything like track speed - and that was under its own (half) power (a J threw an eccentric rod and mangled the motion on one side. The other cylinder was still working. After detaching and chaining up the main rod on the bad side the loco was run back to Roanoke, at speeds up to 85mph!)
From January of 1957, for several years, I witnessed hundreds of dead steamers on the rails arriving from the West on the Sante Fe to La Grange, ILL.
There was a giant scrap yard adjacent to the EMD plant. I was told by a relative who worked there that they were traded in for scrap value against EMD diesels. I tried to get a bell, but they were all spoken for.
Funny story. Two gyus heard of a dead engine somewhere in northern Indiana and went on a mission to “salvage” some parts, especially the bell. One guy was on top of the smokebox unbolting it and the other was standing under it to receive it. He almost got killed.
What would be necessary to move any steam engine for scrapping would be to cut out a length of the piston rod at least as long as the engine’s piston stroke on both sides . This would eliminate the pistons’ acting as air compressors and the problem of what to do w/ the main rod and would not affect the counterbalancing. Engines would typically be spaced throughout a train to avoid concentrating excess wieght in one spot (although lighter engines would sometimes be run in a solid “funeral train”). Some RRs (GN comes to mind) that had other uses for the tenders would couple two engines cab to cab w/ a temporary drawbar.
Why would you think that? Boiler exposions due to plain structural failure or damage were rare - although not unknown. In the 19th century, common practice was to to use lap seams in the barrel, and to punch the rivet holes in the edge of the sheet, both of which could lead to grooving, star cracks, and premature failure. The use of butt seams and drilled/reamed holes pretty much cured that problem. The leading cause of boiler explosions has always been crown sheet failure due to low water, a depressingly common occurence on US railroads right up until the end of regular steam operations, and even into the preservation/tourist era. How anyone could ignore their gauge glasses and low-water alarms is beyond me.
It’s pretty common if you look at pics or movies of trains in the fifties to see a freight train with one or two dead locomotives in tow going to the scrapyard. Great Northern sent many of their engines to Duluth MN to be scrapped, so often GN freights heading east would have a couple of dead engines (IIRC usually right ahead of the caboose). I have seen pics of 7-8 engines being moved dead in tow together to the scrapper.
I broke out my copy of Reading Steam In Color and turned to pages 50-51. There were dead camels on the line awaiting the torch. It looked like their running gear was intact but the front covers of the cylinders were removed.
I suspect that different roads did different things - cut/remove the main rods or removing the covers of the cylinders - whatever would expedite the process of making the former locomotives free rolling. It is all good as long as there is some evidence on my models that these locomotives were “de-enginized.”
On a different note I started work on my “scrap” tyco 0-8-0 - shortend the frame and put a foot board pilot and Kadees on the front. It has a severe wobble - even at low speeds - I will take this issue to the General Board.
Sorry about that - but I did not want to run afoul of the no advertising policy. If you select toys and hobbies as the catagory and “weathered flat” as the search term - it will come up, at least for the next 3 days…
If that doesn’t work for you, I will post a direct link or try to get permission to post the pix.
I tracked down the wobble and it was that the number 1 drivers were out of quarter. It is actually rolling pretty nicely. It is ready for the “funeral train.”
I also drilled out the cylinder covers to simulate their removal, that is the rust colored circle down low. To Do: Since I am missing the firebox front, I need to simulate the fire tubes - I don’t feel like drilling a zillion tiny holes. I also have to detail the pilot and find an appropriate light tender - The Bowser in the pic is on loan. I also have to add some running boards. Anything else? I’m sure that I will think of something…
On the SP it was common to move dead in tow steam locomotives with the cylinder heads removed, typically the removed parts were stored in the cab for safe keeping, but, many SP locomotives went directly to the dead lines located nearby after recieving major repairs, thus house steam was all that was needed for the short trip. It may seem odd to do so, but many a freshly overhauled engine occupied the dead llines at Bayshore, Los Angeles, Sacramento and Houston which were the primary scrapping points for power awaiting final disposition. Thousands of locomotives which had million of hours of boiler time remaining where cast aside as so much scrap.
