Hi, my layout has a bunch of Atlas snapswitches. They have plastic frogs. Is there anyway to power them?
ex. Are there any replacement frogs? Could I add some metal strips on the frogs to power them?
Thanks,
Charles
No, not if they are plastic.
Rich
Well you can.
You have to cut/file a thin piece of metal to almost match the frog leaving it a little short at the ends so it doesn’t make contact with the rails.
Shave off the plastic frog to allow for the thickness of the metal.
Glue the metal to the frog.
Solder a wire to the metal piece being careful to not touch the rails or intefere with the wheels.
Paul
Nope… Plastic will not conduct power.
And replacement frogs are not an option, unless you can make your own from scratch, as snap switches are not a sstandard frog number. So, unless you can scratchbuild and handlay your own turnouts from loose ties and rail, not an option.
Are they giving you issues? Many use plastic frogs to simplify wiring, or to avoid the need to gap frog rails. Others will use only all metal frogs, and need to therefore gap properly, and power them properly, using more than simple two rail wiring of standard track wiring.
A powered frog when simply dropped into place without proper wiring will lead to a quick dead short.
I also do not reccommend using any sort of metal strips, as not only will you have the shorting issue, but then you will have out of gauge turnouts.
Paul, that is an interesting approach to say the least. I surely won’t challenge what you say, but have you done that yourself? That would take quite a bit of engineering to get it right and to avoid dead shorts in the process.
Rich
Easy to avoid shorts. Just make sure there is no metal-to-metal contact. Your continuity meter is your friend.
I would fabricate the metal frog top, press it down to frog height with a soldering tool big enough for the job, drill and countersink for a flathead machine screw and attach the wire by using a miniature stake-on to act as washer for the nut on the other end of that screw, under the assembled turnout. Clean the plastic flash out of the flangeways and you are almost good to go.
Now you have the problem of powering the frog. Snap-switch top-mount motors don’t have contact sets like a Tortoise, Rix or my ancient KTM rocksmashers. I have used a number of methods - everything from home-brew contacts at the end of the throwbar to relays (powering frogs on spring switches.) Wiring an Atlas relay in parallel with the topside machine is a tad on the costly side, but you would then have an extra set of contacts to use for sig
Hmm, if I needed powered frogs, which I don’t, it would seem a whole lot simpler to just get some Peco Electrofrogs.
Rich
What an effort!
Why not just wire a stay-alive capacitor into the locos?
I would advise the OP to “forgetaboutit” and either keep using the turnouts as is or dump them and replace with “better ones” with metal frogs.
If your locos have any kind of multiple pickups, they would go over the small plastic frogs w/o interruption.
No other company makes turnouts like Atlas snapswitches, Rich.
Snapswitches have either a 18’ or 22’ curve, and a straight. They are not like #4, #3, #2, etc switches.
I do know how to wire the frogs.
I must use snap switches because I am building the 4x8 2012 Virginian layout, which requires a lot of these turnouts. And since this is a small layout, Im running small engines with really short wheelbases(0-4-0, 0-4-0t, 2-6-0). These engines stall a lot on these turnouts, really annoying.
@IRONROOSTER have you ever tried that strat? I have thought of that, don’t know if Im up to it.
Another idea I have thought of is placing strips of metal where the flange goes(in the gap), so that the flange can pick up electricity instead.
@tomikawaTT I have ways to power the frog, using a sliding or snap lever switch.
Yeah!..then after He dumps the snap switches and get’s ‘‘better one’s’’ He’ll have to change His trackwork on all the divergent paths…geometry of the snap switches, is just not the same as other turnouts. Now what? Hopefully He doesn’t have a whole bunch…all nice and ballasted!..I would try a keep-alive first.
Take Care! [:D]
Frank
I haven’t tried it because I haven’t had the problem.
You’re right about the number of snap switches in the Virginian track plan.
You might look first at fixing the problem on the locomotive side. Except for possibly the 0-4-0t I would think making all the wheels on both sides of the locomotive and tender pickup current would solve the problem.
If the 0-4-0t is already picking up on all 4 wheels and the wheel base is too short to span the dead frog you’re sort of stuck with modifying the switches or using an 0-6-0t.
Good luck
Paul
He says that he has a bunch. But, don’t know about a whole bunch. [(-D]
Rich
OK, how about this? Could you cut out the plastic frog and form a metal one out of solder? Solder would be relatively easy to file and shape.
Rich
I’ll second, or maybe third, simply installing keep alive capacitors into the locomotives. If the turnouts work and the issue is the locomotives lose power when they cross the frog, then wouldn’t keep alives in the locos solve this problem (assuming you’re running DCC that is…)?
Yes, I do have DCC. Thanks for the suggestion, but did you read that I have 0-4-0s, and 0-4-0ts?
I dont know about you, but fitting a decoder, and speaker inside a 0-4-0t is hard enough, along with the keep alive… I don’t think that will fit…
Again, thanks for the suggestion!
Charles
OK, Charles, you can’t fit other brands of turnouts on your layout, you are in no mood to mess with metal strips for powering frogs, and the locos are too tiny to add Keep Alives inside. Can’t blame you at all.
So, why not try to carve out the plastic frog and fashion a metal frog out of solder. What have you got to lose?
Rich
I have handlaid turnouts. It is easy to fabricate frogs. Rail nipper or Dremel with diamond cut off wheel. Needle nose pliers and a file. Just take your time and duplicate what the stock turnout looks like. All part of model railroading.
I bet you can Google the issue. Might take a little time.
Rich
Interesting that nobody has taken MR to task for designing a layout that requires small locomotives without using powered frogs.
I have to admit that I never followed the Virginian build thread. Maybe the topic came up there.
Dave
If fitting a gold cap capacitor won´t work, you have the option of fabricating a replacement frog using code 100 rail and a thin piece of brass, or to replace your snap switch with a Peco SL92 E electrofrog switch. They match in radius and angle, but not in length of the straight part. Shouldn´t be much of an issue to correct that.
If all that fails, build a new layout, using switches with powered frogs this time. I am dead serious - sometimes it´s better to count your losses and start anew!