I have a couple nice brass ATSF El Capitan and Super Chief passenger sets; is there still a market out there for them? I was always scared to run them and they are simply expensive display models… does anyone else have the same problem (too many expensive “shelf” peices)?
At one time I was something of a brass collector…25+ years ago. I would run them with considerable care but never resigned them to a display shelf. Now a days though, seeing how the prices of plastic are getting into the same range as brass. Brass might be the better deal. I would more likely run on a regular basis the Custom Brass Reading T-1 I want and put a BLI Rdg T-1 on the shelf.
I believe there is a market…still. Maybe not as stong as in the past. My shelf pieces are plastic, like my Bachmann 2-6-6-2. The thing is absolutely beautiful but it’s sooo fragile, I don’t run it. I still have a few brass and use them.
Mark H
Certainly there is still a market. Watch a website such as brasstrains.com over a couple days and notice how some of their offerings are sold almost as soon as they are listed. I enjoy my brass pieces, and only buy things that will be used on the layout. Sometimes it may be several years before I get around to painting an lettering a brass engine for my private road (knowing that I will be decreasing its value by doing that lettering), but yet I did purchase it because it “fit” on the layout.
Bill
The brass market certainly has changed over the years due to a lot of factors.
One large factor to the brass market in the past years has been the availability of many so called rare brass models that were not available in plastic or die cast metal. Those new plastic, die cast and brass hybrid models with sound installed certainly made the older brass less attractive to many modelers. The latest BLI 9015 series brass hybrid is a good example offering brass and sound with good detail to the general public at a much lower cost than the premium brass that was available in the past.
Another factor about brass models that I believe is valid is the price of the premium brass models that are still made in Korea. List price at PSC or DVP for a 4-8-4 is between $2000 and $2200 and the articulated list between $2600 to $3500 in HO scale. Those prices are rarely paid since most of us look for the best bargain and purchase late models as second hand, but not used models. I tend to wait for about two years or mo
Why yes.
If you gotta have an NW5, it’s the only route. Which is why I have two on order from Overland. If they ever get around to doing them.
If you want to faithfully model railroads that are running steam, brass is your main choice. Except maybe UP and PRR. And even then, if you want a UP 2-8-8-0, you’re still buying brass. Or a UP 4-6-2, for that matter.
Ed
There is a market for brass, new and used. The used market splits into parts: the high value collectibles and the run of the mill. Value can come from sheer age, rarity, and quality. Rarity can be affected by the introduction of good quality plastic by the way – many guys with old Milwaukee Road brass passenger cars saw the values drop when Fox Valley and Walthers introduced their various Hiawatha cars. There are deals to be had in the used brass market by the way.
Dave Nelson
For some of us that model what might be termed “niche” railroads in steam, such as Rio Grande standard gauge, for the most part, brass is about the only way to get a representative roster. Yes, in plastic, Proto offered a nicely detailed 3500 series 2-8-8-2 and Genesis offered the 3800 4-6-6-4, but Rio Grande used the 3500’s in helper service and got rid of the UP styled 3800’s as fast as they could, so that still leaves the major roster of D&RGW steam that can really only be filled in brass.
Same thing for a lot of other railroads, so there is still a market for those of us who do not model UP, Santa Fe, Pennsy or New York Central. It really always has been that way, and probably always will.
Tom
What are you talking about? The vast majority of Santa Fe steam engines are only found in brass. Only a handful, the relative few Northerns, 2-10-4’s, and some of the engines from just two orders within one class only of 2-10-2, are represented well in plastic. Until relatively recently, the Santa Fe guys had very little steam at all in plastic. (The ex-N&W 2-8-8-2’s are neat, but only lasted for 3 years on the Santa Fe before being resold).
Yeah, sure, there’s engines that are “close” to Santa Fe–but close is a very relative term. Bachmann’s 2-8-0 is a whole lot closer to an IC prototype than to any Santa Fe engine.
Excepting the secondhand original Y-3 2-8-8-2, Santa Fe never owned a USRA steam engine of any other type. Not even briefly. Additionally, most of their power has a unique Baldwin/Santa Fe look to it that just does not look like other road’s motive power (even to someone born many years later).
Some people like to say that a class or two of Santa Fe Mikado were “close” to USRA engines, or perhaps might have been a prototype for them–but only in principal dimensions–the engines themselves appeared markedly different from any USRA motive power.
Respectfully submitted–
John
There is still a brass market, and I’m hoping to save up for a really nice Santa Fe steamer or two.
Given the choice, I think I’d prefer a nice solid brass steamer with a good, square frame over an awful lot of currently available mass-produced steam engine models. I can redetail it if necessary, and they can generally be repaired without the help of a brain surgeon or rocket scientist, neither of which describes me. Diesels are another matter. Many, many brass diesels are inferior in construction, operation, and detail to modern mass produced diesel models.
Tom
I think that because there is so little in tooling and set-up costs for brass production that Brass is doing o.k. on the market. Brass is a wonderful medium for one-off production and I simply can’t see it being replaced any time soon. I do have concerns about the overall health of the hobby! However, at my age, as long as it continues until I kick, I am not going to worry!
Interesting commentary about the fragility of models and the need to keep them locked up in display cases. Might even be a topic worthy of a separate thread. Seems a shame that models are so fragile that we are afraid to even handle them.
Rich
Yeh’ well remember the night my newly painted brass steamer took a 4’ plunge to the floor,carpeted luckily’ …a little Bending and straightening plus some tinkering and all was well’ TG!!
try that with a plastic steamer and things probably would not have ended so well!
If you following brass listings on eBay, most listings with a reasonable starting bid sell and for a good price. Harder to find models command a VERY healthy price. As with anything, condition and original box make a big difference.
I have many chances to buy brass at realy cheap prices, I ussually don’t bite because the new plastics (if you choose wisely) run better O-T-B without the effort needed with brass (I have a few). The best running brass is a two cyl shay by Kasumi, no RTR plastics of those in any road.
I have several brass passenger trains, all from The Coach Yard, that run on a regular basis.
While most TCY trains are purchased by collectors, and never leave their boxes, the trains are intended to be run, if desired.
That’s why they have fully sprung and equalized trucks, and powered baggage cars.
They all took some tweeking and tuning to get them to run properly; other than Blackstone, I’ve never found anything that was truly “Ready-to-Run”.
Make sure the trucks roll freely, have plenty of lateral swing, test each car on your sharpest curve, adjust the coupler height, and enjoy them.
The first trip around the layout will be a nail biter, go slowly and watch for any trouble, but after a few uneventful trips, if will become a favorite, and you will wonder why you didn’t do it sooner.
Jerry
Before mortgage and kids, I had a ball trying different brass models and actually playing with them. I learned a lot, and also learned a good bit about what to avoid. Perhaps soon I might go there once again…I hope.
I love my vintage DC powered AT&SF brass locos. Even though they are sometimes a bit finicky and need attention and care and tweaking, I would not want to run anything else, and I DO run them. I have 2 from many years ago and have added 2 more over the last couple of years. I am always looking for good deals online and on eBay.
It seems to me the prices of brass are still holding pretty strong for used and vintage pieces and the new ones are very high. IMHO.
I am just putting the finishing touches on a 1337 Class Pacific.
I can never decide which one is my favorite until recently it came to me and I told my wife that my favorite was the one I happen to be running at that moment.
I think the word brass usually means limited run. I think the limited run market will never die whether in brass, plastic or die cast. As noted, the limited run market is the only way some locos will ever appear in the hands of the R-T-R MRs.
There will also always be the scratch builders (one-offs) and kit bashers making the odd never seen loco models.
Mass marketers for any scale loco are going to attack the market with whatever is popular or special such that the first 3000 will be gobbled up quickly.
What will die on the vine are the brass big boys, challengers, hudsons, and the plethora of common engines that will always be popular. Such efforts are for yesteryear.
So, yes, Brass or limited run loco’s, regardless of build material, will always be around to create the rare locos orphaned or unappreciated by the major manufacterers and most MRs. Limited special runs will be for those few uphill battlers with rare and specific needs who have a desire and the cash for the specialty product.
All you have to do is look at EBay: it’s real. And frankly, the prices are pretty reasonable. If you’re looking to pick up something, this is a great time to do it.
Not if you are looking for Canadian Steam E-Bay at present has only a few listings mainly from a few vendors looking to make a profit. for the most part the listing prices are set above the current value of steam locomotives. Take heart that most of these vendors will go away, not much activity in the brass HO market in the summer.
As far as E-Bay goes there can be some very good listings for HO brass steam engines mainly for the Big Players in the US roadnames. I have a few GN brass engines on my layout that i bought for about the same price as current plastic models which are usually USRA engines painted for the GN, but not actual GN engines. These engines are for the most part great running engines, relatively easy to convert to DCC and sound as well. Given their weight they are usually great pullers as well. The main weakness of the old Brass locomotives were the old open frame electric engines. But even those can be usually be overhauled by switching out the old magnets for rare earth magnets, a relatively easy swap and one which give great results, significantly lower speed and large drop in the amp draw, great news if you would like to switch to DCC.
If you have a roster like mine which is based on the CPR, CNR and GN railroads. Canadian steam engines have usually sold at a premium as there were only small numbers of them manufactured and sold in comparision to the mainy USA roadnames.
I have over the years obtained in HO brass all of the various steam engines used by the CPR an