Last week I watch the US Dollar sag against most other currencies on Wall Street.
Over the years I watched space dwindle. The home I live in is pretty good for two people, but when you consider the cost to Add on or build a new building on our land it’s alot cheaper than trying to buy into a bigger place.
Well what you’ve said is true, but the housing market is a completely different story. Its not good for anyone right now, and even though the price of lumber and building materials is really high, you’re right.
-beegle55
Unless you make what I concider a high wage, or you income isn’t rediculous…YES! Model railroading can be quite friggin expensive.
Space is very expensive here in the SF Bay Area, however, there are ways to better utilize the space you do have available. Building around the perimeter of a room, even a small one, can allow you to have broad curves, long runs, and good scenes without monopolizing the entire room. You can neatly build the railroad on top of bookshelves, over the entertainment center and other furnishings by using modules and still use the room for other purposes. The layout can be nicely integrated into the room by puting a finished fascia on the front of the baseboard. Us model railroaders are innovative types and can always find some sort of space or arrangement for a layout in our preferred scales.
I have one that has gone down:
P1000 Newsprint car, CN. First one was $24.99, the second was $18.95 (all in CDN $s). And all the rest of the newsprint cars I have got since have been at the $18.95 price (but they are BC Rail [;)] ) [8D]
The median household income is $48,201 vice the mean of $66,570. (from http://pubdb3.census.gov/macro/032007/hhinc/new04_001.htm)
Median income is a better measure than mean, because it better reflects the average household without the distortion caused by very high income households.
Enjoy
Paul
Absolutely correct. The idea that $66k is representative of typical housholds across the United States today is utterly absurd. Outside the major cities, annual wages of $30,000 and even less are still very common today and more and more formerly lower middle class families are now verging on the cutoff that supposedly defines the proverty line!
Indeed, the Fat Cats are doing just great, as well as skewing the figures, but the average guy has been slowly loosing ground in purchasing power for many years. Back in 1967 the husband worked to support the family and the wife still typically stayed at home, taking care of the house and kids. Today, in most cases, both adults have to work just to make ends meet if they are homeowners and guys around my way often take on an additional part-time side job to obtain any meaningful disposable income. If that’s considered an improvement in our economic situation, I’d hate to see what’s the flipside.
CNJ831
Of course the “baby boom” situation many of us grew up with - Dad going to work, Mom being a fulltime homemaker - was something of a historical oddity. Before that time women often worked, although it was often done in the home so may have been picked up as official employment, like taking in wash or doing sewing.
It is pretty amazing how things have changed regarding housing, I remember Linn Westcott writing an article c. 1972 about visiting a “dream layout” of a wealthy guy who lived in a palatial “$100,000 house” (mansion). Last year the run-of-the-mill ranch house we bought cost over $200,000!!
Back to the original post…keep in mind that 1982 was the height of the “Reagan Recession” that came before the boom years of the mid-eighties. I remember it well, when I graduated from university in June 1982 unemployment was over 10% and prices were falling because no one had money to buy things. If the gov’t hadn’t juggled the books a little, I suspect the country would have met the criteria for that being a depression rather than a bad recession.
Our wages are a darn sight less than the Median. Aside from taxes, necessary bills and trains/entertainment we are happy to have a savings account.
The Government needs to count the people by how much they have saved up instead of looking at those IRS tax forms. They wont, because it is easier to lobby Congress to stack the spending higher and leave the worrisome problem known as the budget for the next Congress.
My area says that they enjoy a median income of 35,000 dollars per household. I like them to go to the local grocery store and see the forest of WIC assistance cards being swiped. They need to go down to the Walmart super center where all the REAL money is being spent usually in another county.
There is a small number of people who enjoy trains compared to the overall population. Judging from the large number of lake fishing and hunting shops in the area there are other hobbies competing for the dollar.
I would like to know what is keeping anyone from being what they would like to be ( I am speaking about a career here ). I was born and brought up in a dirt poor neighborhood, cold water house, 3 family, no central heat, and dad made $19 a week back in 1940. I wanted something better, and so did my parents for their children. All they could afford was a junior college ( 2 year ) and that was with me working part time to help. I wanted to go into the field of electronics, as I knew that was a good area to make the $$ that we never had, and I always loved anything electrical as a boy.
Later I entered the Army and received more training in electronics. This helped me get a good job upon exiting the Army. Later I went on to get a full degree, while I was married and had 4 children, attending school nights, 4 nights a week for 5 years. The rest is history. I later went on for a Master’s degree in business at age 50, ya that’s right …50!! Why? Because I wanted to see if I could do it, and 4 years later after attending school at night, I made it with honors.
I am NOT telling this little personal story to toot my horn, I could care less, I am not that way , but when I hear people knock those who make the “big bucks” in life, I see red. Who was holding “you” back? I had it as tough as anyone and did it, ask yourselves why you couldn’t do it? People have come to this country with only the shirts on their backs and pennies in their pocket, and cannot even speak the language and yet they succeed.
I think one needs to ask oneself ," what is REALLY holding me back"…the answer is YOU!
i will admit that motive power is becoming very expensive. i wish athearn offered their RTRs without all that extra circuitry to make them DCC-ready. so us cheap DC modellers could get them for less.
but there will always be great bargains. Lombard Hobby never fails me there. $47.50 for a brand new athearn genesis SD70. you cant beat THAT!
expensive but worthwile. i mean you also have to factor in the newer detailing on these models. compare the new athearn RTR SD45s to their older bluebox ones. the RTRs look simply amazing!
Those figures are skewed as they are the average not the mean. Take off the top 20% (really rich people) and you see a VERY different picture.
If you want to realize how bad it has gotten the bottom 80% of Americans are spending over 500% of their average annual household income for a house now as opposed to only 390% in 1967 (and keep in mind this is based on HOUSEHOLD income where today you have two and sometimes more wage earners where in 1967 there was only 1- so to really put it in perspective we are now paying 1000% of of our individual wages today as compared to 390% in 1967. Source US Census http://goofyblog.net/historic-household-income-vs-home-prices/
If you also look household income for the bottom 80% of Americans has only gone up a bit over 67%. This means in reality the $70 brass engine of 1967 should be less than the Athearn Ready To Rolll Today.
This is not to incrimenate the hobby as the products are far superior in most cases today then in 1967 or even since 1997 and to some extent can justify the higher prices. The point is no matter how cheap or expensive the hobby is we won’t be able to afford to enjoy it anywhere because it will be too expensive for the SPACE and this hobby does require space, even if it is to hold display cases on the wall!
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jfugate wrote: |
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I thought I would do a quick bit of research from when I entered the hobby (1967) to today. The average annual income in 1967 was about $8,000 per year, and today the average annual income is $66,000 (I’m rounding to keep the math simple). That’s an increase of 825%. |
One thing everybody forgets…Cost of living was cheaper back then when compared to today…That $8,000 equals about $155.00 a week before taxes…That wasn’t a bad pay day back then seeing a gallion of milk was 29 cents and a gallon of gas was 32 cents.
We had it good back then…A brass diesel would cost between $21.95-34.95…Depending on type a steamer would run between $34.95 and 49.95…
Bully for you…and if after doing all that through no fault of your own as an industry your wages suddenly fell or failed to increase to cover the inflations cost…if we all became electricians you would be making about $12 bucks an hour because there would be an over abundance of electricians so consider yourself lucky we all didn’t take your same path, consider yourself lucky not everyone is willing to kill people and risk their own life in the service to get their education and not all of us happen to be in careers with unions (I don’t know if you are in one or not but most electricians are) which keep the wages (and their assiciated product/service costs) artificially high and not all of us have the income at today’s college costs to go back and get a degree.
I have a friend who is a computer/internet programmer…borderline genius with about a 190 IQ, went to college, did a lot of self teaching rose through the ranks, had a nice 6 figure income as most programmers have had through the 90’s and early 2000’s but the fact is most programmers now make between $40,000 to $80,000…he is doing more advanced work which needed more advanced education and he is making almost 1/2 what he made the past decade. He is not the only one, I can tell you numerous friends that are or were in fields that simply
Not to worry…From what I seen very little heed to given to forum chatter about new products after all most of the guys I know still depend on the MR reviews.I purchases my locomotives from Athearn and Atlas and cars from Athearn,Atlas,Accurail and Walthers…I do have some IM and Branch line cars and a handful of KD cars…
I also let the locomotive gurus and forum “super modelers” rattle on and all the while I can’t help but, wonder if they walk the walk they talk…Sadly most “super modelers” never post a picture of their 110% correct locomotives and cars so we will never know.
Have you seen the Nickle Plate 587? If so and have pics, send me a PM with the pics please!
You can make plastics out of soybeans and many other things too. Not just crude oil. I used to think that too untill I watched somethings on agricultural scientists of the early 20th century.
I don’t think most people are held back by not being WILLING to do something to change their lives but rather restrained by not truly knowing WH
Well Brakie, I have been humbled and honored to have seen such 110% modeling in person over the years. Sadly I will never achieve that. However, I try to do good work with what is availible and if it means a little plastic without paint here and there? I think’s is ok. Weathering will take care of the worst places if done after looking at similar photos.
Regarding one poster who claimed that home ownership free and clear is impossible there are those who choose to live in slightly lower cost of living areas and try to do it well to make it happen. We dont need 400,000 dollar homes. 50,000 done right is plenty. But not in the mega cities where everything is out of sight anyhow.
I hear stories of the humble rowhomes back in Baltimore turned into money land selling for 6 to 10 times what they sold brand new around the war years. Sometimes such expensive homes are torn down straight away to build bigger, more expensive and glitzier towers.
Such a pace cannot and will not be sustained.
Thank goodness Trains is cheap. Yes they are getting pricer and I can buy fewer of them each month because of higher unit costs but once in a while… indeed lightning can and does strike twice.
Sure am glad you guys put in that “average as opposed to mean” income information. I was feeling pretty poor when I read that most people made 66G!
I graduated HS in '73, and had a pretty decent job with-in a few years. Without quoting any statistics, it sure seems tighter now as far as income is concerned. Yesterday (Sun) gas was 2.79, but I left home without my wallet, so I didn’t stop to top off the tank. Today, it’s 3.15, and thats a sizeable jump no matter how you look at it. It just feels like the “takers” are asking more and more of the “givers”.
The only bright ray of hope I’ve seen in the past 10 years was a commercial that told me “it will take 20 years to pay off 10,000$ credit card debt”- HARHARHAR! I ain’t gonna live 20 more years, so I say slap it on the card and let 'em dig ya up to get the cash!!!
On a more serious note**, -dj-l-etric**, have to say that was a pretty cheap shot you took at the military reference “killing people”. Seems to me that was what made all of this stuff possible. Sure hope I interpreted it wrong, and if I did, excuse me.
Toodles!