Howdy again. I just purchased a 2343 Santa Fe engine/dummy for my pop for Christmas. This was a train that he had as a kid which had been stolen along with a bunch of his other trains…So I am trying to slowly rebuild his collection.
I know that he had some passenger cars with this set…But I was wondering if the cars varied over the years? I understand that the engine I purchased was made between 1950 and 1952. Did they ever come in a freight set? Or just passenger cars?
The 2343s pulled freight and passenger sets. David Doyle’s book on post war Lionel sets gives a listing and photo of each, including which cars were in each set.
The 2343 came in just one passenger set, 2190W in 1952, which was the year the aluminum cars were introduced. Two Pullmans – 2533 Silver Cloud and 2534 Silver Bluff – the 2532 Silver Range dome car, and the 2531 Silver Dawn observation.
In 1953, the 2190W was repeated, but with 2353 Santa Fe engines; in 1954, 2353s again, with the baggage car substituted for the Silver Bluff. The GG1 Congressional set headed the line for 1955 & 1956, and the 2296W Canadian Pacific in 1957; in 1958, “Super Speedliner” cars returned for a year with the 2383 diesels, followed by the Santa Fe-lettered cars for 1959-1960-1961, and then the 2383 came with the “Presidential” cars from 1962 through 1966.
There were two Santa Fe freight sets in 1950; 2175W was repeated in 1951 with a different tank car, and there was a third set in 1952.
As Jim suggests, David Doyle’s book on sets is useful (and, to me at least) really fascinating. It’s readily available (I got mine at Border’s). Paul Ambose’s Greenberg set book has been published in two (very similar) editions; I think it’s out-of-print. Greenberg and Doyle have very much the same info, though Doyle has many more photos (but generally really small ones), and the overall look and “feel” of the books is very different.
If your father had O gauge passenger cars that where aluminum before 1952, he probably had the AMT cars. the cars were made by American Model Toys, and were released in 48 or 49, i cant remember the exact date. The AMT cars are gorgeous and came with lighted drum heads on the observation, something the Lionel cars lacked. They of course came with fixed couplers. The cars sold well and as a result are fairly common today. They were usually sold by dealers to accompany Lionel’s F-3’s. There are usually a few sets on Ebay. I believe the Santa Fe cars came lettered for the “El Capitan.” Here’s a link to a NYC car on Ebay so you can see what they look like.
Those cars are beautiful!!! I will keep looking…The loco is a Christmas surprise…so it’s gonna be really hard to find out which cars he had without letting the cat out of the bag. I might just give hime the engine and let him figure out the car sitation. I do have some loose pieces of rolling freight…that would be cool to put with it.
That is a wonderful gift you are giving your pop. Whether you get the cars or not, I’ll bet he’s going to be extremely pleased with his 2343s. Perhaps you could turn the search for the cars into a shared experience. Something you two could do together. Either way, he’s a lucky guy.
A dealer at the show I went to last month had the AMT cars as well as the Lionel 2500 series. I like the Lionel 2500 series over the AMT, because the AMT cars are a bit too short IMHO.
I did notice the shortness of the AMTs, Jim. But did you see the finish on the roofs? Like chrome! And FYI, I thought my post war wish list was all crossed off until you posted about your 2500 series cars. Now I look through Ebay every day for them. [;)]
I’d wait until spring for a good deal on those cars. They are pricey right now. I wouldn’t pay over $65 for each one. I though my PW wish list was done, but somehow the stuff keeps finding its way to me. I really don’t know why that is.[:D] PW is certainly addictive.
The Amt cars are short, but when you see them in person, wow. They are sharp. There was a company in the early 40’s that made some super nice, scale aluminum cars. They were probably the most beautiful of the old aluminum models. I saw a set once at a show, but i cant remember who made them. Doesnt really matter though because they are super rare and out of my budget. Jim is right, this is the worst time to buy clean trains, however junk and beaters are at rock bottom. Yay!
I agree that now is not the optimal time to be looking for toy train bargains on Ebay. But it doesn’t hurt to browse. I’ve found my best buys there in the spring and summer. Until then I’m just window shopping…
I agree with Jim, this will be a very special Christmas for your father. Re filling in the pieces, two F3 Santa Fe addicts are better than one, can cover more ground, and will have fun doing it. Particularly when they are father/son…getting the band back together, so to speak. If my father was alive today…but I digress.
Check out Jim’s SF F3 pictures and his link in the thread “Sunday Photo Fun 12-9-07.” Jim is sowing the seeds of train addiction to the very youngest of his clan with no regard to gender. He’s modest but also can’t hide the fact that he made the cover of the Feb. 08 issue of Classic Toy Trains. And I believe that there is also an action video somewhere in these threads of not one but two passenger sets of his SF F3’s simultaneously tearing around his layout.
I have both the AMT cars and Lionel 2500 series cars. The AMT roofs are dynamite. Lionel plated the roofs on the 1991 superchief cars just like the AMT cars. As one poster stated, the AMT cars are rather short and appear dwarfed by the O gauge F3’s. They do not seem to track and roll as well as the Lionels either. But experience may vary. One thing to watch out for with the AMT cars is cracking of the chrome finish.
Thanks for all the feedback! Right now…I think I am tapped out as for the money aspect…So I think I will have it be a fun hunt for the rest of the set as many of you suggest. I did get the rest of the freight for the 2055 he is getting for x-mas as well. I can’t complain…my pop got me the Lionel 258 with the orange stripe. (I am a Prewar junkie.)I have been after this one for longer than I can remember. It will truely be a Lionel x-mas.
(I am a Prewar junkie.)I have been after this one for longer than I can remember. It will truely be a Lionel x-mas.