I am designing and building my freelance steel mill, mine, and logging camp N scale layout. My question is for the logging modelers what is the next best locomotive, after the shay, to use on a N scale scene?
Have you looked at any logging books, How To magazines, videos or checked the net for websites dealing with the logging industry? That would not only give you the information you want but would also provide you with a wealth of other information you will need to build your layout.
I did not because those books could be outdated at times and the human mind is a lot better to probe but thank you.
Just to give you a head start, here is a useful website that is full of links
http://www.railroaddata.com/rrlinks/Logging_Railroads/more3.html
The logging and logging railroad photo books of the glorious old images of Darius Kinsey are often in public library collections and can provide hours of enjoyable study. The large format glass negatives captured tons of detail.
Shays, Climaxes and Heislers were all popular with logging railroads largely because of the flexibility of their drive trains (as opposed to rigid frame rod locomotives) and the fact that none of them was built for speed.
There were purpose built rod locomotives, usually with small drivers and the trailing trucks were often placed differently than on a main line locomotive – because the purpose was less to support a large firebox than to enhance the ability to take sharp curves when running in reverse. The Mid Continent Railroad Museum in North Freedom WI has a logging railroad 2-8-2 that is a classic example of what I am talking about.
But there is another class of steam locomotive used for logging that might be worth exploring and that is engines that were discarded or retired by their original owners. One common example was the very small steam locomotives that were used by street (and elevated) railroads just before the introduction of electric traction for urban transportation. Even steam “dummies” – the little steam engines with an enclosure meant to look like a horse car (presumably to avoid scaring the other horses on the steets) found their way to logging railroads, not because they were well suited to the service – they weren’t – but because they could provide tractive effort at little cost because they were fairly new yet there was no longer any other purpose or need for them. Little 2-4-2Ts also found logging (and industrial service) after the big urban “L” systems no longer needed s
Depends on what time period you’re modeling.
Early 1900s you could use one of these great Climax kits (13-ton or 18-ton) Randy Gustafson makes for the 11-105 Kato “critter” chassis.
The LifeLike 0-6-0T would work too. Mark Watson shows how to make some mods & install DCC to make it a smooth runner here.
An Atlas 2-6-0 could stand in as well, for the early eras.
For later (1930s-50s) you could get away with using a BMann 2-8-0 or 4-6-0 as older steam sold to logging companies, but these might be a little big for the track / feel you’re trying to achieve with a logging scene. (Both are very good runners, though).
For post-WWII logging, you could slip in a Bmann 70-tonner, Kato NW2 or LifeLike SW900.
The Sierra RR in California used two S-12s (paired back to back or front to front, depending on the engineer’s preference) to haul ore, lumber and boxcars from the depths of Gold Country in the Sierra Nevada mts. down to interchange with the big lines.
Republic Locomotive Works makes brass shells for Nn3 mechanisms, as well as has a lot of great wooden laser kits for cars & structures. I really like their 20-ton coal / ore hoppers:
[That’s a Bmann Ten Wheeler behind the cars]
Hope this helps.
I would get the Kalmbach logging book, because it is very informative. I would highly recommend the shay, because it was the most popular geared locomotive for logging and mining. For the steel mill, I would recommend a good 0-6-0T.
I was thinking of using the bachmann 70 ton, but I felt it didn’t caught the feel of true logging. The only loco I have is a 4-6-0 CNW and I was thinking of getting a 2-6-2 loco just for logging since I couldnt find any tank locos.
Thank you for the info
[quote user=“dknelson”]
Just to give you a head start, here is a useful website that is full of links
http://www.railroaddata.com/rrlinks/Logging_Railroads/more3.html
The logging and logging railroad photo books of the glorious old images of Darius Kinsey are often in public library collections and can provide hours of enjoyable study. The large format glass negatives captured tons of detail.
Shays, Climaxes and Heislers were all popular with logging railroads largely because of the flexibility of their drive trains (as opposed to rigid frame rod locomotives) and the fact that none of them was built for speed.
There were purpose built rod locomotives, usually with small drivers and the trailing trucks were often placed differently than on a main line locomotive – because the purpose was less to support a large firebox than to enhance the ability to take sharp curves when running in reverse. The Mid Continent Railroad Museum in North Freedom WI has a logging railroad 2-8-2 that is a classic example of what I am talking about.
But there is another class of steam locomotive used for logging that might be worth exploring and that is engines that were discarded or retired by their original owners. One common example was the very small steam locomotives that were used by street (and elevated) railroads just before the introduction of electric traction for urban transportation. Even steam “dummies” – the little steam engines with an enclosure meant to look like a horse car (presumably to avoid scaring the other horses on the steets) found their way to logging railroads, not because they were well suited to the service – they weren’t – but because they could provide tractive effort at little cost because they were fairly new yet there was no longer any other purpose or need for them. Little 2-4-2Ts also found logging (and industrial service) after the big urba
Okay, if you dont want the shay, who am I to say get it. The four basic types of locomotives on a logging railroad were rod locomotives, shays, climaxes, and heislers. Rod locomotives were used on flatland southern operations, and most everywhere else, there were shays, climaxes, and heislers. The last three, called geared locomotives, were specially designed for logging and mining. Shays and climaxes were commonly found on logging railroads, and heislers on mining railroads. The railroad that I am modeling bought a heisler, a climax, and at least three shays, without a single rod locomotive. But the shay, by far, was the most popular, selling nearly twice as many units as the other two. Also, they were very reliable, and there are stories of shay locomotives running for seventy years on just routine maintenance. One guy once said that the shay was so reliable, you could take a stick and draw two parallel lines in the dirt and the shay would follow them.
If you think that the shay doesnt capture the true feel of logging here is what I would do. First go onto the digital archives of University of Oregon and University of Washington, search for logging railroads, and look at plenty of the pictures. Then make a pilgrimage to the nearest tourist railroad that has a shay on the property. After that, if I have failed to convert you to the thinking of a logger, get an 0-6-0T, a 4-4-0, or a 4-6-0, but nothing larger than a 2-8-0.
I do like the shay but I would like to have a smaller engine for my logging section of my layout. The scene only going to have is a Heljan Warehouse, two flatcars with stakes, and a locomotive. After some time, I will add more cars and gradually buy one or two shays, but I thank you for your knowledge of the logging industry and I’m just asking questions to make sure my logging looks and feels like a real logging railroad but miniature.
John: I think he’d like to have the shay, but, since it’s 1. out of production right now & 2. hecka expensive on flea-bay, he’s looking into other options.
Personally, I’d love a Shay, too. But until Atlas gets its geared steam gears in motion with a new run (“Any day now!”), then we have to make do with others.
Or scratching: I’d love to make a heisler out of a kato kritter chassis or something better, like Randy Gustafson did, but that’s on the model railroading bucket list.
I would love to have one or two but they do cost a lot and out of production even if dealers’ website say they are in stock. I want a tank or steam engine with or without a tender for my layout. My logging camp/site is going to be on top of a high hill, but the train will have to go up a long snake like line if that make sense.
[quote user=“Mr. LMD”]
IVRW:
Okay, if you dont want the shay, who am I to say get it. The four basic types of locomotives on a logging railroad were rod locomotives, shays, climaxes, and heislers. Rod locomotives were used on flatland southern operations, and most everywhere else, there were shays, climaxes, and heislers. The last three, called geared locomotives, were specially designed for logging and mining. Shays and climaxes were commonly found on logging railroads, and heislers on mining railroads. The railroad that I am modeling bought a heisler, a climax, and at least three shays, without a single rod locomotive. But the shay, by far, was the most popular, selling nearly twice as many units as the other two. Also, they were very reliable, and there are stories of shay locomotives running for seventy years on just routine maintenance. One guy once said that the shay was so reliable, you could take a stick and draw two parallel lines in the dirt and the shay would follow them.
If you think that the shay doesnt capture the true feel of logging here is what I would do. First go onto the digital archives of University of Oregon and University of Washington, search for logging railroads, and look at plenty of the pictures. Then make a pilgrimage to the nearest tourist railroad that has a shay on the property. After that, if I have failed to convert you to the thinking of a logger, get an 0-6-0T, a 4-4-0, or a 4-6-0, but nothing larger than a 2-8-0.
I do like the shay but I would like to have a smaller engine for my logging section of my layout. The scene only going to have is a Heljan Warehouse, two flatcars with stakes, and a locomotive. After some time, I will add more cars and gradually buy one or two shays, but I thank you for your knowledge of
[quote user=“IVRW”]
Mr. LMD:
IVRW:
Okay, if you dont want the shay, who am I to say get it. The four basic types of locomotives on a logging railroad were rod locomotives, shays, climaxes, and heislers. Rod locomotives were used on flatland southern operations, and most everywhere else, there were shays, climaxes, and heislers. The last three, called geared locomotives, were specially designed for logging and mining. Shays and climaxes were commonly found on logging railroads, and heislers on mining railroads. The railroad that I am modeling bought a heisler, a climax, and at least three shays, without a single rod locomotive. But the shay, by far, was the most popular, selling nearly twice as many units as the other two. Also, they were very reliable, and there are stories of shay locomotives running for seventy years on just routine maintenance. One guy once said that the shay was so reliable, you could take a stick and draw two parallel lines in the dirt and the shay would follow them.
If you think that the shay doesnt capture the true feel of logging here is what I would do. First go onto the digital archives of University of Oregon and University of Washington, search for logging railroads, and look at plenty of the pictures. Then make a pilgrimage to the nearest tourist railroad that has a shay on the property. After that, if I have failed to convert you to the thinking of a logger, get an 0-6-0T, a 4-4-0, or a 4-6-0, but nothing larger than a 2-8-0.
I do like the shay but I would like to have a smaller engine for my logging section of my layout. The scene only going to have is a Heljan Warehouse, two flatcars wit
[quote user=“Mr. LMD”]
IVRW:
Mr. LMD:
IVRW:
Okay, if you dont want the shay, who am I to say get it. The four basic types of locomotives on a logging railroad were rod locomotives, shays, climaxes, and heislers. Rod locomotives were used on flatland southern operations, and most everywhere else, there were shays, climaxes, and heislers. The last three, called geared locomotives, were specially designed for logging and mining. Shays and climaxes were commonly found on logging railroads, and heislers on mining railroads. The railroad that I am modeling bought a heisler, a climax, and at least three shays, without a single rod locomotive. But the shay, by far, was the most popular, selling nearly twice as many units as the other two. Also, they were very reliable, and there are stories of shay locomotives running for seventy years on just routine maintenance. One guy once said that the shay was so reliable, you could take a stick and draw two parallel lines in the dirt and the shay would follow them.
If you think that the shay doesnt capture the true feel of logging here is what I would do. First go onto the digital archives of University of Oregon and University of Washington, search for logging railroads, and look at plenty of the pictures. Then make a pilgrimage to the nearest tourist railroad that has a shay on the property. After that, if I have failed to convert you to the thinking of a logger, get an 0-6-0T, a 4-4-0, or a 4-6-0, but nothing larger than a 2-8-0.
I do like the shay but
So anything 2-8-0 or gear locomotive is good for the tight swirling higher logging camp scenes?
Yes, anything 2-8-0 or smaller, or any two or three trucked geared locomotive is perfectly fine.
A slight note, test that the locomotive on the curves and the grades with the maximum number of cars you want to pull before you confine it exclusively to that branch. If you cant return it, it will look perfectly fine elsewhere on the layout.
I will take that in note.
I will only need two locomotives for my logging scene: a permanent loco, diesel or steam, that will be based at the logging strip and will only push and pull the two flatcars with stakes from the front. Then, a loco would attach to the a gear or steam loco to be taken down from the camp to the main line.
-Or-
I just might have one loco who will work at the warehouse and the logging strip and pull it down the hill.
I have one kato nw2 and two SD40s being painted for my layout. I have 4-6-0 and a conrail SD45 already on my layout that will work the main and branch line.
I did a short Google research on “Rayonier”,if you scroll down the page you’ll find a site with many photos of the locomotives this company used for logging.It was a quite varied choice actually.
I saw a Rayonier locomotive page and saw some cool locomotive.