I just got a Mantua 0-4-0, it appears that it was some form of a die cast kit at one time, and as such, it has seen better days…
There are two main problems that I can see with it:
Chipping paint
Horn-hook couplers
The box had a dealer note on it to the effect of “1950’s Mantua 0-4-0 kit”
So, I was wondering what the course of action I would need to take to strip off the paint, as well as what Kadee’s I would need to install, and what pain will this apparent age of the locomotive cause me? I’m leaning toward the #58’s, though I just don’t know if they’ll fit. I’ll post images as soon as I finish the authentication process for railimages.
For those of you who will offer help - thanks in advance [:)]
edit: looks like it is/was a model of a PRR A-5 [:)] - which is nice, because I’m hoping to model the PRR
I think the Pennsy 0-4-0’s had Belpaire fireboxes. That would leave this loco out. A real Pennsy guy might contradict me, though.
It looks like one of the all-metal ones. I would dis-assemble it and put all the metal parts in some acetone, as mentioned on another post. If I did that, I would make great efforts not to breath the fumes, have it on my skin, or be near open flames–I’m thinkin’ outdoors. If you do, make SURE you don’t accidentally put in something that’s more than just metal. I’m thinking, for example, that the insulation on the drivers might be damaged if put in the acetone. So, no trucks, drivers, motor for a start.
I had a variant of this loco. I seem to recall the the space for mounting the front coupler is very narrow–might be tricky. The Kadee website has coupler recommendations. Maybe they’ve got something for yours. If not, I guess you’re going to have to get a sample pack and puzzle it out on your own. Of course, this little guy and his siblings were VERY popular. Perhaps someone out there has done the deed, AND recalls how they did it.
I’m not entirely sure of the origins of the loco (ie PRR or just generic… ) I was just going off some pics I found of the PRR switcher.
Yes, the loco is all metal, save for the drivers, and the drawbar - so looks like i’m going to be needing to get some acetone. As for the couplers though, their entire box is plastic, so i should be able to replace everything with a #5 (or #58… i hear those are more realistic looking…) and move on from there.
I have one of those locos that I assembled from a kit back in the mid-1960’s. I believe the metal that it is cast from was called Zamac, an allow of zinc and other metals. It was sold under the Tyco name. You should be able to sand the original paint off.
The motor that was used back in those days was their biggest drawback. If you can find a can motor that will fit, it should improve the running qualities significantly.
If you ever decide to try putting a decoder into it, you’ll have to change the motor because one motor brush is connected electrically to the frame.
yeah, i noticed the direct-to frame connection of the brush… though said brush will be the least of my worries, as it appears that the tender picks up one side of track power, and as such is entirely electrified… and seeing as this would be the only place to mount/hide said decoder…
oh well, its a nice lil loco, and DCC is a ways off for me - can’t afford it for the time being…
Yes it is the standard Mantua all metal “Shifter” which shared a tender and boiler/cab casting with the 0-6-0 “Big Six” (the 0-4-0T was called the “Booster” and the 0-6-0T was the Little Six – they too shared a boiler/cab casting, and all of them had the same motor and drivers). All were generic and had no specific prototypes although the 0-4-0 engine does have some vaguely PRR lines to it, without a Belpaire firebox of course of a true A5. With added details the engine can end up looking like various prototypes. In the November 1964 Model Railroader Mantua ran an ad showing how one man had converted the 0-6-0 version to a Southern Pacific prototype by changing the tender and adding valve gear and a flanged center driver (and he had clearly added Kadee couplers to front pilot and tender). I think you’d agree it looks pretty nice even by today’s standards. Oh and by the way … in that same issue of Model Railroader, America’s Hobby Center was advertising the kit for the 0-6-0 — at $8.25. That was cheap even back then. The 0-4-0 ready to run, with smoke, was $10.88. The 0-4-0T kit, again all metal, was $5.95. I bought one and it was one of my most reliable engines for years.
With a bit of tinkering is can be a very smooth and fairly quiet running engine, and quite a good puller as well. You cannot solder details to Zamac but there are ways to add details, either using ACC or screwing in small brass screws and soldering details to those.
Sometimes getting the gears to mesh well was a trick. One old technique was to put a piece of paper between the worm gear and main gear, then tighten the motor in place, and carefully remove the paper (by turning the commutator of the motor with a tooth pick) and lube the gears. If done just right that prevents overtight meshing of the gears and would make it smooth and quiet both forward and backward.
Can’t wait for this weekend to come, so I can get to strip the paint, and start on the repairs.
Looking at it - I am led to assume that after I can get the cylinders off of the frame, the wheels should come free… hopefully the side rods will bend back into shape (and not break).
As for (re)detailing the loco - that will come in time, but for now I’m setting my sights on getting it running as smoothly as possible, and repainted/decaled… perhaps in the PRR livery…
Is this the same engine that Tyco offered as a 0-4-0t under the name B & O “Docksider” albet under several road names. If so I had one many years ago and it would pull a layout full of cars many more than the protoype. A good runner.
Funny thing, I have the same model of loco, made by Lima, probably in the 70s or 80s. I always used to wonder what the prototype was, since there was no indication. Durable bugger, it is, too, having lasted all these years. Exposed plastic gears, makes a noise like a bad shaver and moves like a limpid whelk.
The Mantua/Tyco ones before the 70’s were made in Woodbury Heights, NJ (near Camden). I have several Mantua/Tyco engines of this vintage and they all still run well. For disassembly of this engine, start with the drawbar screw on the tender. This should be where the wire from the motor connects to the tender for electrical pickup. To open up the locomptive, the screw is accessed from the bottom, in the center of the frame between the cylinders. Hold the parts together while removing this screw (the frame, cylinders, and boiler are separate castings), then set the locomotive upright and lift the front of the boiler. Two tabs hold the back of the boiler in place, and it should just slide off at this point. The cylinders are now loose on the frame, and before you lift them off, note where the crossheads and guides are mounted into the frame and cylinder castings. Remember this for reassembly.
For mounting a front coupler, I ended up milling out the frame to clear a Kadee #5 mounted in its pocket. For the rear one, remove the existing coupler, drill and tap the hole for a 2-56 screw, and mount a Kadee #5 in its box.
I’ve (finally) gotten the screws out, and the cylinders are “glued” to the frame - probably from all the paint on the castings right there… tis gonna need some work getting them loose. For the side rods, and all manner of other metal bits on the sides - what would be a (fairly) safe way to bend them back straight?
as for the gear mesh… it looks pretty good to me - there isn’t too much play between ther gears, but enough that it doesn’t bind (although I haven’t actually gotten power to the motor yet - that’s for the weekend)
Finally - DCC is (at the moment) out of the question. I don’t have the upfront funds available to buy a system yet. Though come this Christmas I should be able to afford something.
Having the frame and cylinders “glued” together like that is common on second hand locos. By your picture, the only metal bits on the sides should be the main rod, connecting rod, and crosshead guide. These can usually just be flattened out with a pair of pliers.
I think this is third or even fourth hand at this point [;)]. LOL!
Looks like I have a lot of work ahead of me…good thing I picked an “easy” loco to rebuild - the vendor I bought this from had a Mantua Mike 2 or 3 boxes above this one that really caught my eye…
The Mantua Mikado is a great loco, I have four of them. Although it may sound surprising, the mechanism isn’t that much more complicated than the loco you are working on now. Just more connecting rods to the other drivers.
You are quite right, the mechanical construction is vastly inferior and the entire thing is ridiculously wobbly. Before I wondered into this thread, I thought the loco was some kind of “original creation” by Lima, I didn’t think it possible that such a device could have ever existed in real life. I mean, it has all the grace, poise and powerful appearance of a dachshund.
