Mileposts from Chicago, St. Louis, Kansas City, Minneapolis

Trains Magazine General Discussion
1

Hi everyone! Here’s a project we’re working on at the magazine that some of you might be able to help us out with. For a series of upcoming Maps of the Month, we are trying to figure out what active railroad lines still exist whose mileposts are measured from the following cities: Chicago, St. Louis, Kansas City, and Minneapolis-St. Paul.

For example, from Chicago, the mileposts on Union Pacific’s ex-C&NW Overland Route extend as far west Clinton, Iowa (138.9). Then they reset to zero again at Clinton for the line west of there.

So our map of Chicago mileposts would include the UP main line from Chicago to Clinton. But no farther.

This will be a modern-day map, not a historic map. That means, for example, UP’s Adams Line between Minneapolis and Milwaukee (former C&NW) would appear on the Twin Cities milepost map, since that is where the mileposts are measured out of today. (That was not the case historically, but because this will be a modern-day map, we are looking for information about today’s railroads.)

And therein lies the challenge since so many lines exist in pieces now.

We have a pretty good handle on the Class Is (UP, BNSF, CN, CP) after going through their employee timetables in detail. (Although Texas is still somewhat of a mysery…)

What we’re looking for now is information on short lines and tourist railroads, as they often operate on isolated pieces of trackage whose predecessor railroad installed the mileposts years before.

For example, in Washington State, the short line Toppenish, Simcoe & Western operates about 24 miles of ex-Milwaukee Road trackage, and sure enough, the mileposts (MP 1990-2014) still still reflect a measurement from Chicago.

Those are they types of examples we’re especially interested in.

This very well could be an exercise in the impossible, but have you ever known us to shy away from a challenge? I’d enjoy hearing what all of you know and certainly appreci

2

Sounds like fun- if we ever get ourselves dug out around here, I’ll have to scout around the local rail lines and excavate some of the mileposts![swg]

3

well mile post 88 will get you to FC tower which is 190 miles from chicago on the csx B&O line.I’ll have to look at my books for the maw.

stay safe

joe

4

well woodburn indiana is milepost 78.7 measured from toledo on the woodburn branch.thats where the maw begins.

stay safe

Joe

5

The old CB&Q/BN/BNSF East End is measured from Chicago. Pretty sure our North and Northwest lines are, as well. And it’s entirely possible that our Belvidere Sub measures distance from Chicago as well.

6

Mile post zero is a t The former northwestern station and goes to clintion iowa mp 139.5 from clinton west ward it goes from mp 0.0 to mp 3566 at fremont nebraska where the former up takes over Council Bluffs starts mp0.00 at nx001 and works its way west fremont for example is approx 40 miles west of Council bluffs and shows fremont as mp40 and north plattle as mp 284 hoope this helps if you need more in infor e mail me and i will send you the old timetables to showw this Larry

7

Looking at Watco’s South Kansas and Oklahoma timetable and a February 1971 Official Guide seems to show that the Neodesha Sub between Sherwin, KS (349.7) and Fredonia, KS (414.0) is on the old Frisco measured from St. Louis. See page 297 Table 10 Pierce City to Ellsworth.

The Chanute subdivision between Humboldt, KS (117.4) and Cherryvale, KS (152.0) was on the Santa Fe measured from Kansas City. See page 446 table 9 Chicago, Kansas City, Tulsa

One other could be the SKOL Moline sub between Fredonia, KS (152.8) and New Salem, KS (238.7) on the Santa Fe measured from Kansas City. Couldn’t find anything in the Official guide, but the mileposts seem correct.

8

Found another one…Missouri & North Arkansas between Clinton, MO (266.6) and Fort Scott, KS 338.2 on the MKT between St. Louis and Parsons. Page 306 of the Feb. 1971 Official Guide, Table 8.

9

Related (and maybe dumb) question - I understand how the mileposts ran on the main stem of a RR, but how were the miles numbered on branch lines? Still from wherever the numbers started on the main stem, or from the point where the branch left the main stem, or some different scheme? Thanks.

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I’ve seen examples of both, JOdom. Usually a branch line will have its mileage numbers preceded by a letter to distinguish the line from a main line. As I mentioned earlier, the UP (former CNW) Belvidere Subdivision starts at Milepost 30-and-a-fraction from Chicago (possibly because it was the original main line).

A Pere Marquette branch line that ran from Allegan to Pentwater, Michigan, started with Milepost Zero at Allegan. This line crossed the Grand Rapids-to-Chicago Main Line at Holland (later reconfigured to join and separate from the main line), which had no effect on milepost numbering. For you, Matt, this line’s mileposts start at Grand Rapids, not Chicago.

11

Looking at the original premise, the Kalmbach homebodies need to get out, take the blinders off and see the rest of the country…Hello? Wrinny?

add Denver to your list of MP 0’s (BNSF and UP/ C&S and DRGW/D&SL)

MP 0 to MP 3 at Trinidad/Jansen still barely survives (C&W Southern Division, aka Trinidad Ry)

MP 0 on the East Denver Beltline is about to return from the grave. (RWM knows)

MP 0 still exists barely at Lamy, NM and French, NM (until terrible ted tears it up for his buffalo)

MP 0 on the D&IM/DL&G Associated RR’s route will soon be exhumed (if RTD doesn’t screw up)

MP 0 is still at Topeka (ATSF to points west)

MP 0 at Garden City, KS twice (GCW & GCG&W)

Milepost Zero is at 20th Street currently. (541.2 miles from CB&Q MP 0 in Lincoln…Dimbulbs at BNSF changed jointline ATSF mileposts in 1998 because the operating crews and dispatchers don’t have enough fingers and toes and cannot subtract at all…screwed-up a lot of other things, but the losers on the cascade green side of the fence are smiling)

please don’t forget Dotsero!

12

When did it get moved to there?

13

Can’t help you with Chicago, et al.

On the topic of branch lines - sometimes you have to go into some history to get the answer. In one case near here, mile posts are numbered from a town that hasn’t had rail service since forever. Were it not for a microbrewery in the old train station there, you’d have no idea.

What is now short branches on CSX and MA&N was part of a line that ran from Utica to the St. Lawrence River. I found milepost 71 on that line one day - and it’s no where near 71 miles to either end of the existing track. The portions that are gone are a little less ancient, having come up in the 1960’s.

The Adirondack RR runs on the original Mohawk & Malone - and the mileposts on much of the line are measured from Herkimer, although a portion of that track is ancient history.

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Never left.

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The Iowa Interstate uses the ex-RI mile posts from Chicago. Begins at Blue Island MP 15.7 and ends at Council Bluffs MP 488.0 IIRC, some of the trackage used on the Illinois side of the Quad Cities is now BNSF with the original RI tracks abandoned.

The CN Iowa mains also use mile posts from Chicago. Omaha MP 517.8 and Sioux City MP 510.0

The Cedar Rapids and Iowa City Ry uses mile posts starting at Cedar Rapids. On the line acquired from the Milwaukee Road, they renumbered the mile posts instead of using the origninal MILW mile posts.

While historically Larry is correct on the CNW starting over with 0 at Clinton, MP 138.9 = MP 2.1 today. There are no mile posts for 1 or 2.

Jeff

16

The 1988 charts show Topeka as Milepost 50-something, from Atchison and also from KC. If it’s now Zero, how far west from there have the mileposts been correspondingly reduced?

17

While technically Holliday is now MP 0, the original transcon went via the Great Bend/ Hutchison Sub and then was revised by the La Junta/Middle Div. 4th District that Amthrax runs on now (ugly MP equation at Kinsley…plus some short miles in between)

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Mike,

Thanks for the Kansas information about Watco, et al. Much appreciated! You’ve helped me out.

There’s no bias against Denver or anywhere else in the country. We just looked at cities where a lot of railroads started from.

(If I let personal bias intrude, I’d be lobbying for a milepost map for Jersey City, NJ, my birthplace. There are still portions of Amtrak’s Northeast Corridor measured from there, not to mention pieces of the old Jersey Central, Erie, Susquehanna, etc.)

I appreciate everyone’s assistance. This is going to be a challenge far beyond even what I typically attempt. So thank you for your help!

Matt

19

The NS St Louis line is measured from St Louis to KC.

20

On the east coast, Atlanta GA has or had a Milepost Zero. Also, I believe (subject to correction, of course) that the old Western Maryland’s mileposts started from Baltimore.