Hello everybody,
I was told that VIA only uses their F40’s to pull the passenger train through the Rockies. The GE P42’s stay out of the Rockies. Why is that?
Thank you
Frank
No, the F40s are used in Eastern Canada as well. I’m not sure why P42s aren’t used in the Rockies.
This is a guess:
Via has 21 P42s and 53 F40PHs. Since the number of P42s is small, they can be kept on the Corridor in the East, eliminating the need and cost to stock parts for them elsewhere. So it reduces cost.
I don’t know why they didn’t replace all the motive power to the P42s
This is total speculation based on historical anecdotal evidence. ATSF used F units for Passenger service because weight on drivers was critical and E units could not pull the grades over the rockies. Could be Via has found the F40PH is better in the mountain territories
I have been meaning to answer this question for a while, but I lack one critical piece of info.
At some point around Sudbury,ON the Canadian switches to CN tracks. F40’s are EMD based products and P42’s are built by GE. CN has only recently, within the last couple of years, purchased GE locomotives*. So, in the event of breakdowns and routine maintenance in western Canada, the CN employees doing the work would be trained to work on the EMD type locos.
CP has been buying GE units for almost twenty years now, so where VIA runs on CP tracks, in central Canada, CP employees should have no difficulty working on P42’s.
Bruce
- of course excluding any GE units acquired in any of CN’s mergers/purchases of IC, WC, DM&IR, et al.
What comes to mind, is that it is not cost effective to replace perfectly good working engines.
[sarcasm] Money would never be a factor. [/sarcasm]
AgentKid,
I’m not aware that VIA switches to CN anywhere in Ontario. I believe it’s CN all the way across except for eastbound in suburban Vancouver where it takes CP from Sapperton (New Westminster) out to Mission.
Also, CN has been buying GE power since at least 1990. However, VIA locomotive maintenance is handled by VIA employees, not by employees of the host railway(s).
Dayliner, there are two sections wherein CP and CN use each other’s tracks for directional running (as the SP and WP did in Nevada).
One is in Ontario: between Parry Sound(CP)/Boyne(CN) and Sudbury(CP)/Wanup(CN), southbound traffic moves on the CN and northbound traffic moves on the CP.
The other is in British Columbia: eastbound traffic moves on the CP as far east as Basque (mp 55.9 on the CP Thompson sub; 57.47 on the CN Ashcroft sub). I am not really certain just where VIA gets onto the CP’s Cascade sub, whether it is directly from the CN’s New Westminster sub at Brunette or at CP Jct., (Sapperton on CP’s Westminster sub) or at Matsqui Jct and thence to Mission Jct. Canadian Trackside Guide is not consistent with the information shown for VIA’s service on the two roads here.
Perhaps Bruce can dig into this, and let us know just how the Canadian gets out of town on its way to Basque.
Are there any VIA maintenance employees outside of Toronto, Montreal, Winnipeg, and Vancouver. Who deals with breakdowns between Winnipeg-Saskatoon-Edmonton-Vancouver?
I will get back to Johnny’s question later.
Bruce
My apologies, I was mixing up AC units with GE units. I was thinking of the following TRAINS Newswire article about CN receiving its’ first AC units in November of 2012.
Because of this info I will have to retract my original answer.
Bruce
I’m not sure, but I believe that VIA keeps a “protect engine” in Jasper, or at least they did a couple of years ago.
VIA uses the P42’s in the corridor because they are higher speed. The F40’s are rebuilt recently and perfectly capable of handling the Canadian.
CN doesn’t have anything to do with maintaining VIA’s engines.
The Canadian leaves Vancouver on CN and stays on CN for about 40 miles and joins the CP at Mission until Basque.
Barry Williams
Mission BC
I concur with Johnny’s reading of the Canadian Trackside Guide, but it just doesn’t make sense to do it that way. Barry’s explanation agrees with the map on page 70 of SPV’s Railroad Atlas for Western Canada.
The Trackside Guide routing might have been used at one time as a way to keep EB “Canadians” out of CN’s Thornton yard to reduce congestion.
Bruce
Hello everybody,
thank you for all the great replies. As usual the members on this forum have been very generous with the information.
Frank
Quoting Williamsb: “The Canadian leaves Vancouver on CN and stays on CN for about 40 miles and joins the CP at Mission until Basque.”
Thanks, Barry. Perhaps the editors of the Trackside Guide should check the older copy to bring the next one fully up to date?
I do have a question: does VIA #2 go all the way to Matsqui Junction before entering the CP, or does it use the Page sub between Page and Riverside, where it joins the Mission sub, or does it actually enter the Mission sub at Matsqui Junction? The SPV atlas does not show a connecting track in the proper direction for this at Matsqui Junction. Of course, I have know an SPV atlas to not show all possible connections at a junction.
I wonder: in 1997 (the first time my wife and traveled in Canada, from Vancouver east), I think the Trackside Guide indicated the routing I mentioned earlier, except I do not remember how far east the eastbound traffic traveled. I bought an issue of the Trackside Guide soon after that trip, but I cannot find it now that I want to check what it showed.
Hi All
IIRC
The Canadian leaves Vancouver’s Main Street Terminal which is served by BNSF (Vancouver to Sapperton Yard in New Westminster) at which point BNSF connects with CP heading eastbound though Colony Farm to Port Coquitlam. From PoCo the Via travels eastbound on CP (Mission/Ashcroft Subs?) to Basque where it interchanges with CN to Kamloops, Jasper and points east.
I put my in-laws on that train in Vancouver for many years after Christmas (Dad was retired from CN, Pointe St Charles Shops). We would follow the train eastbound through Burnaby to wave good bye at a grade crossing near our home.
When we moved to Chilliwack we would pick them up westbound at Chllliwack, a CN flag stop, and put them on the eastbound train at Agassiz, a CP flag stop.
One of those memorable family traditions…
Merry Christmas All…
Charlie
Chilliwack, BC
Charlie, I think Main Street Terminal (I’ve always known it as CN Terminal) is now Pacific Central Station, sort of like the renaming of Canadian Pacific Station to Waterfront Station. I believe they also changed the neon signs on the front form Canadian National to Pacific Central, as CN no longer runs trains there.
I will try and get this right. I do not have my CTG as I am currently in Saskatoon. I got here from Vancouver on VIA #2.
The Vancouver station is the ex CN station now owned by VIA and named the Pacific Central. It is also the bus depot and used by Amtrak.
Several years ago CN and BNSF swapped some lines and CN now controls the New Westminster sub. Both #! and #2 only use CN and do not use the CP through Coquitlam. You cross the Fraser River at New West on CN , past Port Mann CN yard on the Yale sub to Page as Johnny asked, on to the CP Page sub for 2 miles to Riverside to CP’s Mission sub, across the Fraser River to Mission and onto CP’s Cascade sub.
Matsqui Jct is connected on the northeast only from CN’s Yale sub to CP’s Mission sub. This is used by westbounds headed to CP’s Cascade sub and Coquitlam. Other westbounds including VIA’s Canadian #1, coal and intermodal to Robert’s Bank and most CN trains continue west on the Yale sub.
In years past VIA had crossed to the CP’s Cascade sub and used the route described into Vancouver through Coquitlam and New West. Apparently when the West Coast Express started on CP’s Cascade sub from Mission to Vancouver’s ex CP station now called Waterfront, they did not like the toilets being flushed as the Canadian went by the commuter stations!! VIA has now modified this.
I hope this helps. I think I have it correct.
Barry Williams
Mission BC