What are the pros and cons of having a multi-level layout? Is it better in a smaller area? Is it hard to see?
Thanks
I built one, and I’ll build another.
Finding the right deck heights will take some trail and error. Also, you won’t get double the layout area unless you use a nolix (an around the room spiral) because some layout area is lost to either the helix or train elevator, whichever you decide to use.
Speaking of helix’s, some people don’t like them because your train is out of sight for some time and they do eat up some good real estate. Because of this a helix is probably not the way to go on a small layout.
A small layout also negates a nolix, leaving a train elevator as the only real option that comes to my mind.
There is a mushroom design that might work for your purposes, but maybe somebody else can fill you in on that as I’m kind of foggy on how that’s done.
Pros
- Can make a lot more layout space in the same amount of room space.
- Can see more trains without moving.
- Easier for a single person to operate (orbiting type of operations).
- Can eliminate duck unders
Cons
- There needs to be some sort of lighting for the “lower” level.
- Remember to work on the “underside” of the “upper” level you have to be in the lower level so if it already has scenery it could get tricky (at least without breaking things).
- There is twice as much people traffic in the isles (three times as much for a tripple deck), so they have to be wider. And watch out for operating areas. Stagger the towns or suddenly two or three people need to be in the same place.
- Transistions in scenery can be tricky without looking strange.
- If the space is small it can be tricky to move the trains between levels. Helix, elevator, steep grades, etc.
How one sees it depends on how it is made. Often sitting in a wheeled chair can be used to view the lower level at a comfortable angle. Likewise a shelf step can be used for viewing an upper level.
interesting question . i wonder what the smallest multi-level layout is .
a helix takes a decent amount of space , about 4’ x 4’ in HO given 22" curves . and how do you hide it ? this is why you see helix’s in a room next to the layout
a nolix might be even worse . assuming 2% grade and 16" separation from rail to rail i think that works out to 66.66 feet to climb from one level to the next . that’s a room larger than 15’ x 15’ probably closer to 20’ x 20’ . that might be considered small by some but i’d love to have that much space
somebody kick me if my calculations are out of whack
If space allows, I very much prefer a nolix to a helix
What is a train elevator?
I am in the process of building my multi-level layout. It is basically double level, execpt in two spots it will be tripple level. Here are some observations I have made while planning and now building mine. It is an around the room mushroom style.
Pros: (the reasons I decided to do it)
More mainline run as well as everything that comes with it like:
longer sidings(means longer trains)
more distance between sidings
more towns
more industries
more opportunities for interchange
more staging
Cons:
design is critical
benchwork must be well thought out
getting it all to mesh can be difficult if not planned out properly
cost
compromise still must be made
significant grades between levels
I have a large “T” shaped room 36’x18’ with a 13’x13 enterance area to the room that looks like this:
36’
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i i 18’
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i i13’
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13’
The layout is around the walls with two pennisulas. The first level has West staging, creek sub, cherokee yard, cherokee sub. The cherok
Ignore this, it did not come out they way I thought it would. I am sure you get the idea of the shape of the room.
Mike in Tulsa
BNSF Cherokee Sub
Like this ?
Photo’s please Mike, I’m just about to start my benchwork.
Cheers, Ken.
Photo’s of yours please too!!
Ken.
Well…For the most part, two levels will get you twice the space to model and if you’re short on space, it really is a great way to get more space! In short, I’ve built one and would build another!
As already mentioned, the separation issue seems to be the biggest stumbling block…All though, some would say that it’s hard for a viewer to focus on one level at a time! I say “no way”! I have seen many a multi-level pike over the years and have never had trouble separating the view…speaking for myself, that is.
One thought, which is what I have done, is to have the upper level just below eye level while standing and the second level just below eye level while seated in an office chair on casters. Personally, I like a slight downward look at a RR and this works real well for me.
Yes, a wider isle is called for if you need to have chairs passing or standing and seated operators passing…but remember, everything is a tread-off somewhere! As for me…Here on the CCRY, the isles are a bit too tight, but we’re just a “tighter” operating group!!
A section of track that holds an entire train and can go between levels… You drive on, lift or lower, and drive off. The advantage is that it uses very little room. All you need is a track (with walls) long enough to hold a whole train. This obviously favors layouts that run short trains. The disadvantage is that the trains are still headed in the same direction when they get to the next level and they’re kind of a pain to use in practice.
I suppose you could set it up like a track cartridge and then you could just flip it as you move it to the next level, but that sounds like even more of a pain to deal with to me.
John Armstrong referred to one form of train elevator as a “dehydrated canal lock.” In the plan where he used it, it was a 16-foot long, along-the-wall extension to a layout that filled one end of a family room and was designed to hold 2 O-scale N&W coal trains on parallel tracks. It’s illustrated inside the front cover of the book, ‘John Armstrong on Creative Layout Design,’ and described in detail on Page 59.
Another thread (which I haven’t really looked for; it’s in the forums somewhere) involved using automotive scissors jacks to raise and lower trains between levels.
I have also seen sketches of cable-hoisted and vertical-screw elevator drives, including one that was multi-track and multi-level - a dozen moveable staging tracks in a single frame.
I am in the throngs of building my n scale Allegheny & Cumberland. I allowed myself a 8’x11’ room that I built. Doesn’t seem like much, & it’s not, but ya work with what ya got ! Mine is a point to point so I can get maximin running time. It starts at M&K Junction, then goes around the wall, then loops up behind & continues upward until reaching Sand Patch. The trackwork is in reverse compared to the real thing & nothing resembles anything. There is even a mining junction…Coal Fork Junction. So, that & helper service are the main attraction. There is a duckunder, being 6’3", this is very manageable. I’ve posted these pics on another forum, so , my apologies for those of you who have already seen.
The “druther” with the most impact on your track plan is going to be train length. It drives siding length, yard track length, distance between “towns”, grades, and scenery. Train length will also likely be the determining factor as to whether multiple levels are worth the extra hassles in planning, benchwork, construction, and operation. If you aren’t happy with the train lengths achievable in your space on one level, then adding a level is probably reasonable.
Train elevators get pretty impractical over 4ft long (6-7 cars plus loco in HO); hence, the use of helix and nolix.
Iain Rice, in one of his articles, discussed what it took to make a train seem “long” to the eye. Basically, from the normal viewing distance a train of around 13ft will seem very long (you can’t see both ends at once), and most folks will wildly over-estimate the number of cars in it. 13ft in HO is loco plus 24 cars.
Not that I ever expect to have a layout big enough to run 24 car trains - although I think it would be a lot of fun, and much more realistic than the 6 car trains I’m used to. 
yours in planning
The “mushroom” concept is more of a design modification of a simple double deck. Simply put, the backdrops, aisles, and elevated platforms are arranged so that only one deck can be seen from one aisle, and the other deck can only be seen from another aisle. It makes the room visually larger because you can’t see the whole layout from one spot. ie, the backdrop of the lower level would be the layout skirting of the upper level.
Nolix?
A nolix is having all the grade visible in your layout room rather than in a helix.
Ken.
I would agree with this; however, I am modeling the late 90’s, so some of my equipment can be rather long. I would say 80% is around 40’-50’, 10% 60-70’, and 10% upto 89’. A train with 50’-60’ average car length does look long using the 13.5’ sidings to determine train length. Throw a few auto racks in the mix and it does not look too bad. My Amtrak consist of two P42’s, one baggage car, and 10 superliners looks a bit long, but it does not take to many sidings.
I was careful to design the layout so that 12ft is the longest visible area without looking around/past scenery. I also spaced my sidings two train lengths apart so a train would not simply go from one siding to another taking mainline running out of the picture. Here in Tulsa, the BNSF Cherokee sub dispatcher seems to favor some sidings for eastbounds and others for westbounds. I suspect I will do something similar thus expanding my mainline run evenmore. I guess it will depend on traffic.
I have been meaning to take some pics. If I did that then I would have to figure out how to post them.
Mike in Tulsa
BNSF Cherokee Sub