So looking at today’s photo of the PRR S1, that looks like a diesel style air horn on the front. So did this locomotive NOT have a steam whistle?
That’s the way it looks.
IIRC, Milwaukee Road 4-8-4s (I forget the class), and I believe, some Southern Railroad locomotives had air horns rather than whistles.
SP GS-4 4449 has both a whistle and an air horn.
The Pennsy’s Duplex T1 and the NYC’s S1b Niagaras had both horn and whistle. I would guess all the modern ‘fast steam’ engines had dual horn/whistle, maybe even by federal regulation? That much I don’t know.
The production lot of PRR T1’s did not have horns, only the PRR standard whistle. No sure about 6110 and 6111. I’ll see what I can find.
I may have been tripped up by a foobie provision of a horn in the decoder files of the BLI Paragon T1. It has both. Live and learn.
Crandell
The horn may also have been an economy move. The whislte uses more steam (meaning coal/oil, water) than one might imagine. Another reason could be the horns sounded more “Modern”.
I believe the MILW S class had both horn and whistle…
On the Southern Pacific locomotives equipped with air horns used them for grade
crossings as the road thought the sound carried better. The same locomotives
also had steam whistles which were only used for “railroad” signaling such as
calling the flag our or back.
Air horns provided a ‚modern’ sound in that they made steam sound like diesel - I think it might be called a kind of camouflage.
About: steam consumption of whistle blowing leading to low boiler pressure -
ggg
That would have taken some formidable whistle indeed with
It’s me once more.
By the way:
Does anyone believe the Loewy shrouding of the S-1 looks real nice? I don’t think so. Just look at those deep side valances – no meaning, no function, no going together with the locomotive’s inherent lines and proportions. Looks became much improved when they were cut later and the seven foot drive wheels fully came to view. But in the front treating and all the boiler top line it feels to me like Raymond didn’t really know what to do with a steam locomotive, less with a most formidable one as # 6100!
Thanks for your comments, Juniatha. It seems to me that a steam whistle will use more steam than will an air horn will use air…a lot more. If the pump(s) use steam for brake-pipe pressurization, and they run intermittently, and a horn is used intermittently, the comparatively little air the horn would need seems small by comparison.
Crandell
I believe the Lackawanna put a horn on at least one of their Pocono’s very late in the game. Never heard it used, however, only the natural whistle.
@ Crandell
Ok, >> they run intermittently, <<
– that’s a point.
[;)] Only, I would h
I can’t put my finger where I read this (Trains or Classic Trains), this is from memory. At speed, the frequency of a steam whistle would not project forward enough to be heard at grade crossings. However, the air-horn has a different frequency that would project ahead to warn those at the grade crossing. Simple fact of being heard vs. hitting something at 80 + MPH.
Maybe some of the experts here can confirm.
Thank you.
Juniatha, I was not precise in my statement. I’ll try again…the pumps don’t operate continuously, but the various steam appliances, including the whistle, operate either continuously or regularly. The horn, if used, would draw a small volume of air, and along with leaks and the required crossing horn sounding, the use of air would be easily handled with intermittent pump operation. The pumps would use less steam than a whistle at full pitch, would they not? I am asking, since I don’t really know…it just seems to me that in a number of randomly sampled five or ten minute periods for a given steamer working at track speed on a certain route, steam whistling is likely to use more steam than would the pumps and the air-fed horn.
Crandell
@ Crandell:
Yes, I see what you mean – only, sometimes I tend to look at things from a sarcastic rather than a fully earnest viewpoint, sorry.
~ “Don’t worry – be happy” [:)]
I am late to see your response and to acknowledge it…my apologies. I shallnow ponder it and reflect as I am able, Thank-you! [:)]
Crandell
I remember them well. A family on my street owned one, and I used to pass it on the way to school each day, giving it admiring looks on each trip. In fact, I have a model of a '51 Studebaker bulletnose in my living room today.
I must disagree with you about the Hawk, though. They’re outstanding cars, but for my money, the most beautiful Studebaker was the Robert Bourke Starliner coupe:
http://www.carlustblog.com/2010/03/195354-studebaker-loewy-coupes.html
Hi, Arkady
You guys go back in history – gasp ! Pwwh, I check it up in my book on American cars of the 1950s … A-alright, now I see what you mean.
Well, no problem, Arkady, I guess that’s why they make so many different cars …
Ok, so on that linked site I read that by that time Monsieur Raymond Loewy had designs being designed by his designers, I stand corrected – although I can imagine his casual adding one or the other correcting line on a drawing presented to him, which miraculously yet obviously lightened up what had so far just been a tolerably ‘useable’ idea, making it all come together. I hope you’ll allow me some credit for I was only born some 20 years later, so it’s all history to me.
ok id stummble on this subject…air horns? ok logicaly horns on a steamer would be produce by steam…i saw a old video with it and steam came out of that horn… on the air lines that connect each cars had steam comming out…as for whisels using more steam thedn horns?/ My opion they use the same amount… think they did the horn to fool people has a deisel loco or they wanted people to get used to hearing the horns since deisels where just comming out.horn sounds do travel far.