I hope i posted in the right forum why is there a light that was red above the ditch lights on a trailing locomotive for cn i think a GE unit. the lights were mounted on the the front and rear platforms. thanks.
I may be wrong, but aren’t they marker lights.
If it’s a traling locomotive those red lights are the rear marker lights, traditional and customary for the end of a train. You see this a lot in commuter trains operating in a “push-pull” configuration. When leading the locomotive displays white lights as you’d expect. When it’s pushing it displays red lights.
Search You Tube for postings by railfans of commuter trains (I like New Jersey Transit shots myself, it’s a bit of home) and you’ll see plenty of examples.
They are, technically, marker lights, signifying that the locomotive is the end of the train. CN is the last Class One to buy new locomotives with them. Others just use a headlight dimmed or a FRED (and I have seen Amtrak use the dim headlight solution when the one marker light went out on an F59PHI)
I don’t think a Canadian GE would operate in commuter service. FRA allows dimmed headlights as an alternative to red markers … but mandates that red markers work precisely as provided … so most modern DPU-capable (if that’s what was meant by ‘trailing locomotive’) engines don’t use the red markers.
There was some discussion here that red rear markers are required where passenger trains are present. I do not know what current Canadian law on markers is, but they did have an interesting ‘proprietary’ white/green/red class light system at one time (I’ll leave it to the Canadians here to explain its history and use properly) and Canadian power may still be set up to display red lights on the rear of a consist.
White/Green/Red is not propritary and not Canadian. It was standard for all locomotives into the late 1980’s when Operating Rules that permitted Timetable & Train Order operations were replaced by DTC and Track Warrent forms of operation.
A locomotive displaying White, indicated that it was an Extra Train. A locomotive displaying Green indicated that there were following sections of the Schedule that the train was running on. A locomotive without indicator lights was either the last section or only section of the schedule the train was operating on. A locomotive displayed Red to the rear, when it was on the rear of a train as markers to denote the end of the train as required by rule.
In Timetable and Train Order territory trains were identified by schedule number and engine number on train orders.
I was referring to the physical arrangement of the lights, which on many Canadian locomotives were physically separate adjacent red, green, and white lights in a row, as described in this article or as seen in this picture (the first one I could find browsing the Web)
Lights had the same meanings in both US and Canada - no matter how they were configured on the locomotive.
This was the system used on Alco Century Series locomotives. EMD locomotives used changeable colored lenses behind the exterior class light lens. Nothing Canadian about it.
I was just looking at CP pictures from the 1970s because of this thread. Early on the low hood EMDs seemed to have had a single changealble lens class light. Most where above the number board, but I did see a picture of a GP35 with them on the nose. Later on, they seemed to have went to the three light arrangement above the number board.
I wonder if placing the class light above the number board is the reason they went to a three light combo. It’s easier to flip a switch in the cab than to stand and reach over to change
Both Alco and MLW used that system. GMD-produced locomotives had the same movable class light system (at least initially) except it was moved up above the number boards.
http://www.railpictures.net/photo/426306/
Later GMD-built units seem to have transitioned to the three-individual-light system.
http://www.railpictures.net/photo/93574/
(EDIT: Posted same time as Jeff, who has a better answer)
The Canadian Rail Operating Rules (CROR) definition of Marker is:
When used, will indicate the last piece of equipment in a movement. It will be one of the following :
•a red light, a red reflectorized plaque, a sense and braking unit (SBU), or
•an occupied caboose, distributed power remote locomotive consist or distributed braking car,when the last piece of equipment in the direction of travel.
CP has not ordered new locomotives equipped with class/marker lights since the end of Train Order Operation and does not even put a dimmed headlight on remotes, but CN and VIA Rail both continue to use markers in some form. For CN this is in the form of the red marker light(s) on DP-equipped locomotives (although I have seen a few of our trains with a dimmed headlight instead), and VIA places a red reflectorized plate in the rear knuckle of the last piece of equipment in the train, as shown in the photos:
http://railpictures.net/photo/596762/
http://www.railpictures.net/photo/588887/
The class light meanings have already been explained and were indeed the same as in the U.S, but of course have been irrelevant since the offi
I don’t know why CN orders their engines with the marker lights as they are not required to be used in Canada or the US. It’s nice to have but with how much CN loves to pinch pennies, I don’t understand why they install them.
In Canada the engine istself is the marker and in the US they use the dimmed headlight.
I’ve got a question here.
Several days ago I saw a CSX locomotive operating on the lead of a freight with red lights lit instead of the customary white lights a lead unit would display. Nothing special about the train, just a plain ol’ freight. No white headlight, just red. Anyone know what that was all about?
They may have just forgotten to turn the red lights off after running around the train, seen that happen a few times. Are you sure it was the lead unit, and not the remote on a stopped train?
Or this could be something else required by a CSX-specific rule, in that case I’m sure Balt will know the answer. And if he doesn’t I hear he now has lots of time to look it up…
Thanks for the response SD70, I suspected they may have forgotten to turn the red lights off myself, I’ve seen quite a few CSX freights come past my favorite train watching place and this is the first I’ve ever seen with the red lights on, and that includes local delivery jobs complete with caboose shoving platforms. And yes, it was the lead unit, no shoving platform on this one and a fair-sized train, too big to be a local delivery job.
About the only CSX engines with the ‘Class Lights’ still in place are the former ConRail engines. Since it has been 17 years since the CR split happened, I am at a loss to understand how the class lights haven’t been plated over as the engines were shopped over the years.
CSX locals perform a wide variety of functions across the system. Many have small trains and shoving platforms - some have very large trains and shoving platforms - others have large trains without shoving platforms - still others, at points on their rounds, might be just light engines. They are all doing the work CSX requires of them.
Thanks for the response Balt, I think the engine in question was a GP38, certainly old enough to have been a ConRail unit. GP38’s are still very common here in the Richmond VA area, I see them quite often.
As to why the class lights weren’t plated over, well, you know the old saying. “There’s always one that slips through the cracks.”
Maybe I’m just used to it being from the U.S. but doesn’t it seem kind of dangerous to not have some kind of marker for the end of a train? Ideally a train shouldn’t crash into the back of another one but that to me seems like just one more last ditch effort to warn people there’s a parked train sitting in that dense fog or heavy snow storm…must be somewhat useful if the U.S. requires it. Just curious.
When an engine is on the rear of a train, the rear headlight is left on dim as the rear end marker.