I used matte medium on the last ballasting project I used. Brushed down a coat on the roadbed, put down ballast, and applied a few layers of the glue over the ballast. But I’m not happy. It looks great, but I still have scenery work that I need to do. When I do the work, I might need to pound a little. Bumping or brushing against the ballast and vibrations from the pounding quickly loosen it up. Foam on the ballast? Tough to clean up without removing a vast amount of ballast! It’s getting irritating, and the same thing is happening to my grass. I can’t keep anything looking good for more than a few days when working on the layout. So long story, well, not really short, but to end this… I’m looking for suggestions of what to do? Is this unavoidable? I thought about putting down a layer of Elmers white glue down and topping it with the medium. Thanks for the help in advance…
As another poster has said, it is best to wait until surrounding scenery is done before ballasting. However, many of us rush into painting and ballasting as it seems logical to do it that way. But you have learned a good reason why not to do that.
As to the surrounding scenery, most of the scenery book authors recommend painting your scenery substructure (plaster, plaster cloth, pink/blue styrofoam, etc.) with a “dirt-looking” flat paint and then immediately sprinkling basic scenery materials into the wet paint. That can be real dirt, some kind of ground up foam that looks like dirt, or anyone of the many colors and textures of Woodland Scenics, etc. ground foam.
At this step, it isn’t meant to be a finished project, just something to make you layout look like something other than a white-plaster/pink foam desert while you are working on the rest of the stuff.
Only proceed to the track ballasting stage when you have convinced yourself that the scenery near your track is pretty much as you want it. Then ballast - it prevents the ground foam or whatever overlaying your ballast.
BTW, I have found that gesso (art store product) works really well in disguising the edges of cut or carved styrofoam into looking something like scenery. When you stain/paint it, it looks pretty good.
Well seeing as I’m redoing all the scenery, I’ll save redoing the ballast for last this time. The ballasting I put down was when I was just going to touch up the scenery, but I’m ready for a full overhaul. Thanks for the advice. As far as a wetting agent, I didn’t use any previously but I’ve heard that diluted dishsoap works well, so I’ll give that a shot next time. Thanks!
I’ve also heard people use straight 70% rubbing alcohol to “wet” their ballast but found that it started to strip the paint I sprayed my track with, so, beware!
I must be misunderstanding something. This ballast that you are placing over painted on glue, is it a road or gravel lot? For ballasting track you need to spread the ballast and work it with a small soft brush to position, then spray with wet water and dribble on the diluted glue. Your ballast is not bonded well enough and that’s why the problem with coming loose.
Before spreading ballast, I will paint on a diluted glue to the roadbed shoulders and sprinkle on some ballast. I find that shaping the shoulder profile is easier this way and less chance of thin spots and holidays.
For my wet water I like to use 60-70% water, 30-40% isopropyl alcohol and a few drops of detergent. The detergent is probably not nec. as the alcohol does a good job breaking any surface tension. I use this same mix for wetting for other scenery materials also.
Thinned matte medium (1:4 glue/water) also works well for scenery cement, but the initial layer of ground foam is secured buy painting 50/50 glue on the plaster, ground goop or foam. Most of this gr
Having put down several thousand square feet of ground cover and ballast over the years (worked for a layout building company), it shouldn’t matter whether you do ballast first or last, (I happen to prefer doing it first, it locks the track down), how you do it does matter. If your ballast or ground cover is coming off if you rub it, then too little glue was used to adhere it and/or too little or no wtting agent.
If you use a raised roadbed, (cork or whatever) paint the glue on the shoulder/bevel full strength and then apply some ballast to the shoulders first patting it to the shoulder lightly. Let it dry overnight and then vacuum up the excess, now apply the ballast over the track and blend it into the shoulders and ties, etc.
The next step is to pre-wet the ballast down with wet-water. Using a spray bottle (409 or Fantastic or all purpose sprayer) fill with water and add about 10 drops of detergent and mist it onto the ballast and soak the ballast just short of puddling, let it soak in for a minute or two and then apply the glue mix. I recommend working 1 to 2 ft at a time, then spraying the next section, you don’t want the wet-water drying up before you get to it with the glue.
Whether you use white glue or matte medium, it should be a about a 50/50 mix of glue/water with 4 or 5 drops of dish detergent added. I usually use an elmer’s glue bottle adjusted to dribble to apply the glue. Don’t be stingy with glue, again apply plenty just short of puddling. Let it dry overnight, then check for loose ballast, spots that might have been missed or gotton to little glue, re-apply the wet-water and glue to those areas, let dry, then vacuum any excess. Once this has dried for a few days the ballast should be nearly rock hard and should not come away if brushed against.
Well, that’s my 2 or 3 cents worth. Jay.
If you do ballast first, just cover it with 2" masking tape in the areas where it’s going to get dirty. And it’s just as much a pain to clean u
That’s why I paint my track after I ballast. I do all the dirty scenery work (backdrop, bridges, plastering, dirt cover) first, then ballast after that. After the ballast I add the grass, bushes, and trees. You can see the details here in my Scenery forum clinic.
I’ve gotten good results by dropping 70% isopropyl alchohol to dampen the ballast without disturbing it, and then dropping on a mixture of 1 part elmers glue to 2 parts water with about 1 drop of dish detergent per 50ml of mixture. The balast dries hard.
I learned the hard way that you must thoroughly shake the scenic cement, or the sticky part stays in the bottom of the bottle. That will defineatly result in crumbly ballast.
Thanks for all the great advice. Next time, I’m going to:
Use a wetting agent, I’m thinking alcohol as it will speed the drying process, and I paint my rails once there in place so the alcohol won’t have any negative effects.
Paint on bottom layer of glue to roadbed.
Work slower and apply glue liberally to achieve total coverage, and start from the sides and work my way up.
Allow plenty of time to dry.
Do all of this after your done making a mess with plaster dust and foam! [soapbox] Haha.