I am building an 8 x 12 layout in the garage. I have built the table but someone has told me to put sound barrier board on top to kill some sound. I bought 1/2 x 4 x 8 sheets of sound insulation board but it appears to be too soft . I have 2 sheets of 5/8 of maple (don’t ask why) so can I put this soft material between the 2 sheets and accomplish the sound reduction?
One thing I was hoping to accomplish, was to have a material that I could easily cut into to make rivers and lakes.
Sound dampening is getting so much attention these days because of the use of builders foam (pink, blue, or green) as the table top. This material is not as dense as wood. If you are going to use the 5/8 maple for the top, I don’t see the need to add anything extra for sound dampening. If you do, you can use Woodland Scenics black foam roadbed material under the track. When you glue the ballast to it, use matt-medium and water as the adhesive. It will not be rock hard like white glue would. If you want, you can glue on a sheet of the builders foam to the maple to make it easy to cut in rivers and lakes. Or you can cut the maple to make a cookie-cutter layout.
On my HO layout, I used the blue foam sheet as the top over thin Luan, and the only sound dampening I used was the Woodland Scenics black foam roadbed material under the track and matt-medium for the ballast glue. It is not loud at all.
If you are running O gauge or Lionel trains, then it is a different story.
If you haven’t cut or otherwise damaged the insulation board, take it back for a refund. There is no more worthless “sound reduction” product than Soundboard (and I speak with thirty years of experience as an acoustical engineer). There was another recent thread discussing this topic and the most effective means of reducing the sounds from your trains is to resiliently isolate the track from the subroadbed/benchwork. I like to use Woodland Scenics foam roadbed and only use a non-hardening caulk to glue the track to the roadbed and the roadbed to the subroadbed. I ballast the track using matte medium but I also use strips of waxed paper to keep the ballast/matte medium mix from touching the subroadbed. The small gap created when carefully pulling out the waxed paper ensures that ballasting the track won’t short circuit all of your sound isolation work. Note than any ground cover materials applied over this gap should also be fairly resilient to avoid short circuiting your previous work.
If I don’t use the 1/2" sound insulation board, then I will still have 1-1/2" of maple (2 sheets screwed together, and I am using 1/4" cork as a roadbed. Will this be sufficient? Sounds like the glueing of the ballast down is some type of issue??
Does the thickness of the table top make any difference?
I wouldn’t screw the two sheets together. 5/8" is plenty strong to hold your layout. Use it for another project or to enlarge your layout.
Good luck,
Richard
The thickness may. It would like putting track on a 2x4 vs a 1x4. However, I don’t think the difference is enough to worry about.
Perhaps you could do a test. The worst way to lay track if you want sound deadening is to use cork roadbed and nail the track down.
The norm for sub roadbed in HO model railroading is 1/2 in plywood. I would just test with one sheet of the maple, and another test using two sheets.
What is your concern about the noise? It may help us to answer your questions better by knowing why you seem to be so concerned about it.
Quiz,
What makes you think you need that much thickness in a table top? One sheet will be fine esp if its maple. No need to screw two sheets together. As far as your sound deading is concerned you can lay down a foam tape like camper tape or an automotive product like dynamat. Just lay the foam tape or dynamat under the cork road bed. Haven’t used it but Woodland Scenics track roadbed is foam produce as well.
IF you subscribe to the magazine, check out the jan 2013 issue on page 40. Pelle Soeborg’s article “5 expert tips for installing track and roadbed”
Good Luck,
Derek
I have been trying to read and listen to others. I don’t have an “issue” yet. The 2 sheets of plywood are already put together due to some damage to the top of the first sheet. How should I fasten the track and cork roadbed down? Screws?
I’m finding this thread and the other about sound deadening to be rather intriguing. I guess my initial thought is … why do you want it so quiet ? I can maybe understand if you are concerned about annoying people in an adjacent room - but then, our bedroom is adjacent to my train room and my wife claims she doesn’t hear a thing during our operating sessions.
My layout is built in typical fashion. A combination of open grid and solid flat areas made from 3/4" plywood with homasote roadbed. I also use white glue to balast with. When running trains, the noisiest thing in the room is the sound of metal wheels rolling by. I can honestly say there’s no dicernable benchwork noise. (?)
Methinks there’s too much concern over making the benchwork deadly quiet. Remember how much noise the “benchwork” made last time you watched a real train roll by ? [;)]
Mark.
If your sheets are just screwed together, you could unscrew them. A damaged surface on plywood, unless pretty major, can be smoothed with Sculptamold. Roadbed can bridge some roughness. If you are going to put a layer of foam over the top to give you the ability to have below grade scenery, that will completely cover the damage. I have seen damaged hollow core doors used, despite quite a hole in the side. Foam over the surface or using the hole for below grade scenery both work.
As for fastening track down. Not all, but many folks (myself included) are now using latex caulk to attach both roadbed to plywood or foam (be sure the caulk is foam friendly) and track to roadbed. A very thin bead, spread with a putty knife, so thin that it does not come up between the ties is all that is needed. Should be able to find more detailed information many publications, online videos and posts on this forum. If you are a subscriber, one of the installements under VIDEOS/Project Layouts has Cody laying track. He does it a little different than I did, but mine worked and his does too.
Good luck,
Richard
Sound only seems to be an issue when the bench work is constructed like a drum. That is, when using a sheet of builders foam as the layout surface instead of ½ inch plywood (or thicker). Since modelers are now finding some advantages to using builders foam, therein lies the concerns of train sound being too loud. If you are not doing that, there should be no issue.
Now, my layout was built for moving, so I built it light in modules. Lightweight framing was used and the top was Luan. On top of the Luan I put a one inch thick sheet of builders foam. That made a drum. Because of this, I used Woodland Scenics foam roadbed glued with clear latex caulk to the builders foam, and also used it to glue the track in place on the foam roadbed. By doing it this way, there was nothing solid that would transmit sound to the layout, and the foam roadbed acted like an insulator. Now, if you use white glue to hold the ballast in place, you have just made a solid connection between the track and builders foam because white glue dried rock hard. But by using matt-medium for the ballast glue, which does not get rock hard, you maintain a sound separation.
To answer quizeshow904 about holding track down: There are a couple of ways that it can be done. First off I will tell you that I despise track nails, but I will give you a couple of choices.
The old original method still used by some modelers today - Nail the cork roadbed down, then nail the track down. Comments- Cork dries out over time and crumbles. Real RR’s do not nail their track down. (Have you seen any nails in the center of real RR ties?) Nails can change the gauge of the track if they are too tight against the ties. If you miss hitting the nail with your hammer, you hit the track. (Not good)
The newer method - Use clear latex caulk to hold the roadbed down. (cork or foam) Weight it until it dri
Quiz,
To expand upon what Elmer said, if you are concerned about sound transmission DO NOT use any mechanical fasteners. So no nails no screws. As Elmer says use caulk to lay down the cork and the track.