And later, for a short time, T-1’s, (Broadway Limited, Spirit of St. Louis, Jeffersonian, Liberty Limited)
Also, “diesel dilemnas” occasionaly put steam on the front of normally diesel-hauled streamliners, and the one I remember is the Southerner. Looked great with a beautiful Green, Gold Paicific at the head end.
The Lakawanna’s streamlined “Phoebe Snow” was pulled by steam before the F3s and E8s showed up.
The New York, Ontario & Western “Mountaineer” was a streamliner made of rebuilt heavyweight cars and was pulled by steam.
Milwaukee had a connection with one of the Hiawathas somewhere in north Wisconsin that they outfitted with “streamlined” coaches and a matching teakettle so that its styling would match the Hiawatha in styling.
Reading company also ran the “Wall Street” behind steam using streamlined rebuilt Harlan and Hollingsworth coaches.
I would not call the NYO&W “Mountenier” a “streamliner.” Beyond paint there was not much modificaiton of the equipment.
I believe that for a time the NKP used its Hudsons on streamlined passenger trains between the Chicago station and wherever the diesels took over…
Don’t forget the CN and GTW streamlined 4-8-4s that hauled the Maple Leaf and other trains. Of course, the trains weren’t totally streamlined but included some older heavyweight equipment.
In fact, the NYO&W never owned an all-steel passenger car, we called them “The great Timber Fleet” in contrast to the New Yokr Central. It was really mostly a paint job with some skirting applied to the 4-8-2’s.
Katy Texas Special 1948-1950 between Waco and San Antonio. Ran under steam until the E8s arrived. Within a few months after inauguration , the E7s were turned at Waco for servicing, which could not be accomplished adequately in the short turnaround.
FWD Texas Zephyr had a similar operation between Fort Worth and Dallas.
And don’t forget theTNO Sunbeam and Hustler 1937-1953 Dallas-Houston, referred to by some as the “Texas Daylights”. Pulled by probably the prettiest streamlined Pacifics of the bunch (OK I’m probably biased, but the P-14s are right up there with the GSs). Beautiful, and very fast.
The Illinois Central post WWII City of New Orleans originally had a connection of through streamlined cars that that ran between Louisville through Paducha to Fulton, KY where they were combined into the main Chicago-New Orleans train. At the time the IC had no diesel servicing facilities on the Louisville line of the Kentucky Division so they semi streamlined a light Pacific, No, 1146, specifically for this run. To the best of my knowledge this was the only streamlined steam engine the IC ever operated. The Frisco streamlined a number of steam locomotives which reguarly powered the Firefly, the Meteor and the Kansas City-Florida Special. Photos of both the IC and the Frisco streamlined steamers can be viewed on the www.gelwood.railfan site.
Mark
Ummmmmm, there were steam powered streamliners all over the USA. Let’s see, in the west: SP Morning, Noon, San Joaquin and Sacramento Daylights, the Lark, the Starlight, the Overland, the 49er, the Treasure Island Special, the Golden State, the Sunbeam and the Hustler. Santa Fe: the Chief, the San Digans, the Grand Canyon, and who knows about the Chicago-KC, Texas, Tulsa trains. UP: City of St Louis, the steam powered SP connections. In the midwest, many 400’s and Hiawathas were steam powered. And in the east, the list would be too long, but most, if not all, early NYC and PRR streamliners were steam powered, how about the B&O Royal Blue, and Cincinattian? C&O used steam on a number of streamliners, as did SRR and N&W. CAn anybody refute my assertion that the ONLY regularly scheduled steam DOMEliner was the SP San Joaquin Daylight? AA
That’s interesting re: SJD. Got dates?? I thought they had dieselized by the time the 3/4 domes were built in the mid 1950’s.
A worthwhile book covering the streamlined steam locos is “The Steamliners” by Kevin Holland. Besides the expected locos, it covers many of the oddballs and one-offs. My vote for one of the most unusual would be Lackawanna’s Atlantic #988, converted from a camelback by the road’s shops. The book doesn’t mention any Hudsons, but LV had a group of Otto Kuhler styled Pacifics.
Just being a bit technical here about the three Frisco trains mentioned. I think only the Meteor was fully streamlined so far as the train itself was concerned. The Firefly may have been modernized, not sure. But the KC-FLA Special was detinately not a full true streamliner with a fast schedule, though it did have quite a few streamlined cars in its consist through the years and ended its life with a notation that all regularly scheduled cars are streamlined. But as to being a streamliner at the time it had a streamline-styled locomotive, I think not. .
Bill,
I believe you are right about the Frisco trains. I don’t think the KC-FLA Special carried many, if any, streamlined cars in the days when it was steam powered. On the other hand I am fairly certain the Firefly consist was made up of modernized and streamlined (at least as to paint job) heavyweight cars though definitely not a lightweight streamliner when headed by steam.
At the risk of offending some readers there were at least three streamlined steam locomotives that IMHO were less that aestheticly pleasing successes. These were the engines that headed the Reading’s Crusader and two NYC trains the Michigan Central’s Mercury and the Big Four’s James Whitcomb Riley. I have heard these referrred to as looking like “inverted bathtubs”. To a lesser degree the same might also be said of the 4-4-2’s that powered the original Hiawathas.
Mark
The first SP domes, completed in 1954, were assigned to the SJD, the train was dieselized in 1956. There’s a Pentrex SP video which shows extensive footage of 51/52, in steam, with the dome-lounge. It appears 51/52 had that distinction (only regularly scheduled steam/domeliner) for about two years. Steam was assigned between Oakland and Bakersfield until 1956. Bakersfield-LA was dieselized earlier, about 1953, I think, but I’m certain of the 1956 date, when steam was retired system wide. AA
AA–
How bout that. Learn something new every day. Thx for the info.
I can report on having ridden a standard (but with modern air-conditioning) Pullman sleeper from Kansas City to Jacksonville in 1959 on the Frisco’s KC-Florida special. This was a business trip, and because a had several clients sharing the expenses I was able to spring for the drawing room in the 12 Section 1 Drawing Room sleeper. I remember lighweight coaches on the train, and at least one had a letterboard lettered for “The Meteor.” During the layover in Memphis, the Rock Island’s RDC departed. The departure gate said to Tucomarci (spelling?) but I suspect that was via connection and the car may have only to some mainline point further east.
Actually, about that RDC -----the remnant of the Chocktow Rockette (note spelling Rockette rather than Rocket) —it really was the entire train.; Though former lightweight cars were added in Memphis when needed.
And…since the Rockette, such as it was, survived only because of the mail contract, in the mid-1950s RI took the baggage compartments out of the three RDC3s assigned to the run and converted the entire space to a 30’ RPO, making them probably the only (any others anyone can think of???) what might be described as “RDC 3-1/2” full-length combination RPO-coach RDCs, with a 30’RPO compartment and a 48-seat coach compartment.
But wait! There’s more!..the LW car they occasionally dragged (or tried to drag, as the RDC was really not designed to drag anything–pull up the old RDC thread) was a streamlined round end baggage-observation coach, where the express and storage mail were treated to a great view out the round end rear windows and the few (if any) passengers rode in the vestibule end. Truly a bizarre car, but such was the Rock.
BTW, not that it matters since this thread is interesting anyway, but what does the Rockette have to do with steam power?? When the RDC died, they dragged it with a diesel.
Was reading this old thread with intrest. One thing I’d like more info on though is it’s been stated that the Chief was steam hauled 'till '47 or so. It probably was, but had it been re-equiped with streamlined stock by then?
I have a book entitled “The Santa Fe Chiefs” and there is no mention of the modern version of the Chief being steam hauled except for helpers in mountain districts.
Hope it was though…
Any info appreciated.
Jonathan
The Santa Fe Chief received streamlined cars in 1938 and new Hudsons non-streamlined except for one hauled the trains from Chicago to the foot of the Rockies where new non-streamlined Northerns hauled the trains to Los Angeles. In 1946 the Santa Fe converted several FT A-B-B-A freighters to passenger service and assigned some to the Chief. Not all Chief consists were diesel powered until 1947 when the A-B-A sets of Alco PAs were assigned. There was a brief period when the Chiefs lost there fully streamlined consists when the Super Chiefs went daily and some cars were borrowed from the Chief consists. This only lasted for about two years and the Chiefs and Super Chiefs were fully streamlined once again. The heavyweights temporarily assigned to the Chiefs were shadowlined striped to match the fluted sides of the lightweight cars.
Al - in - Stockton
CNW’s Minnesota 400 used streamlined c.1912 Pacifics starting in 1940 or 1941. They were primarily yellow, matching the passenger cars better, unlike the more famous CNW streamlined engines that were dark green. By the time it became the Dakota 400 (basically same train, different name), it had already been dieselized.