http://www.journalnet.com/articles/2005/04/12/news/local/news03.txt
The debate will continue about how safe RC trains are or are not. This accident could have happened on any train though.
My condolences to the family.
Unfortunatly, sounds like he just made a simple mistake, slipped and fell. Sadly, the one took his life. My prayers for his family and those left behind.
john k
A train at any speed can still be dangerous.mt condolances to the family.
stay safe
Joe
That’s to bad & my regrets go to the family. Goes to show how dangerous RRing is. [:D][:p]
[quote]
Originally posted by jhhtrainsplanes
[
My condolences and sympathy are with this man’s family.
Two days of experience in this yard – and at 3:50am?
Not wearing a control pack??
Riding on the freight car???
I thought the primary safety premise of remote operations was that the guy at the switching end was the ONLY person running the locomotive. If this guy didn’t have a control pack… who did?
What I’m reading ‘between the lines’ here is that somebody was playing the role of engineer in ordinary switching, but wasn’t doing it on the locomotive, and probably without watching the whole train. We probably need to wait for reasonably full details, perhaps from the FRA and NTSB accident reports. But something here is NOT ‘safety-first’, I think… and that, much more than “remote control operation”, is the most significant factor here.
I think we need to wait for the whole story. Sounds like he could have been working as a utility brakeman/switchman in the yard with more than one crew as an extra helper. Of course there are rules governing use of U-men too…
LC
On the UP, once you are selected for RCO training, either you take it and pass the course or you are OUT. Most old timers are opposed to RCO so they use mostly new hirers to fill this position.
The UP is so short handed in spots that some employees with only 18 months total experience are being trained to become locomotive engineers. Scary, huh? The UP doesn’t like it either, but such is life.
Fra says you only need 1 yr senority to qualify for engineer. I have a idea what caused this but i wont say. the rule violations are very clear . and trainmasters should be fired for this
Why should the trainmaster be fired for this incident (presuming that he did not instruct the crew to ignore or circumvent the safety and operating rules)? [%-)][%-)]
And was not aware that they were happening… If he knew and still let it happen, he’s as guilty as anyone.
Well, that is a good point… If he knew about the situation prior to the incident, then yes he is just as guilty. My point is that, without all of the facts, it seems a little presumptious to “hang” the trainmaster on top of the surviving crew members.
Well after hearing about all the accidents in RRing it just shows how dangerous it is. [:o)][:D][:p]
[quote]
Originally posted by jhhtrainsplanes
[
[quote]
QUOTE: Originally posted by spbed
Well after hearing about all the accidents in RRing it just shows how dangerous it is. [:o)][:D][:p]
So then why all the smiley faces?
UMB
Why did this man “not” have a belt pack?
The trainmaster on duty should have attended a safety briefing at the beginning of the shift, and seen to it that all employees who are going to be working with a remote locomotive have a belt pack.
Two or more people can work the same train, you can “pass” or “pitch” control of the locomotive to each other.
If this guy was riding the car, he should have had a pack and control of the move.
Even though we dont use RCO where I work…if your riding the point of a shove, your the guy in control.
In fact, the only command our engineer can obey from anyone else when someone is on point is the command to stop.
I cant put my helper on the point, then shove him down a track, he has to give the commands and do the shoving himself…for obvious reasons.
If the trainmaster let this guy walk out the door minus a beltpack, hes in deep stuff.
It is part of his job to make sure everyone has the correct equipment to do the job safely.
Ed
There is a local classification yard here where I railfan alot. They have it marked with signs of RC locos. When ever they are working the yard there is two or more people. Some times the person braking the cars doesn’t have a belt on.
On CSX you are not supposed to control an RCO while riding the side of a car.
[:D] But I see crews on RCO’S sitting in the seat controlling the loco. and riding the cars controlling the movement on CSX’S RCO’S all the time!!! [xx(]
When I was training there is definately a lack of proper training! On my first day we were told that periodicly our instuctors would be riding with us to evaluate our progress. We did a little RC training here and there, (mostly classroom), but at no time did our instuctors actually work with us. There is a huge problem with how RRs train new people. Now, like others had said we don’t know all the details of this particular incident. From my experience most of your training is a waste of time!!! The crews you work with have no training qualifications or guide lines at all! Most guys/gals you work with are great conductors/engineers/friends, but they are lousy teachers. There is still this automatic resentment towards trainees just because they don’t know anything and slow the process down. Alot of conductors can’t be bothered to show you all the ropes or let you do everything because they are more concern with their early quit! Most of them only let you do the basics. They have no requirements to train you, no obligation. They see trainees as a liability so they don’t give you too much to do! You as a trainee have to be agressive and insist on doing every thing, but then again you end up sticking your head out when start to do that and the crews really start to dislike you then. You can go through the entire 3-6 month program and it is possible to keep getting paired up with these crews that really don’t know how or what they need to be showing a trainee. THE TRAINEES JOB IS NOT TO GET YOU COFFEE!!! The funny part is you can still qualify knowing only part of what you need to know. Basically aslong as you pass your final and work safely on the OJQ that’s it. Then when you are working out there and you are slow, making minor mistakes, you really get it from the crews. In a way though, you are who you are because of them so if you are bad to work with who fault is it? As for management, they can stick all that safety stuff you know where! They expect way too much out of brand new employees.
heavyd’s works ring true. How many times hav I faced such a situation both as a trainer and a trainee.
In my previous work I have had over head cranes lifting very large and heavy steel coil to my trailer under control of a man with a belt pack.
You were away from the trailer and OUT from UNDER the load as it traveled the air from pickup to your trailer deck.
Assuming these belt packs are similar to those used by Remote drivers of locomotives why then wasnt a “Buddy” there able to have eyeballs on this guy? And WHY is he riding the car being shoved by the idiot engine without a human on board?
Many more questions. I am sorry for his family, they suffer a great loss because some one did not want to do the work right the first time.
But I too will be interested in the final report.