Thats a quote from Peter Paulnaks layout in the November CTT. Thats when I bought the bulk of the trains I have. TTOS and TCA had lively large monthly meets then. I guess the east still does. Here on the west its near dead. Yes trains especally postwar were readally avalable then but the same price as now or more it seems to me. If your lucky and patent the same trains can be bought considerably cheaper now on eBay. What do you think?
Dennis
Yeah, I think you’ve got the two best terms there for describing Ebay buying: Patience and luck!
But you also have to be search saavy and know how to look in the wrong places. (Can’t tell you how many passanger cars I’ve seen!) Sellers who know what they have usually ask book value, and that’s OK and all, but people like me with tiny budgets don’t want to see book values. (I tend to think they’re either crazy for asking those prices in this economy or that they’re just listing them to keep their wives off their backs! lol ) I have more success with sellers who don’t know what they’re selling. I pay fair prices but my goal is simple, build the best collection I can with the least amount of cash.
The market was definately better for buyers back then. I’d suggest that the resurgence of O gauge as catalized by the competition between Lionel and MTH has helped to drive up the price of classics. The farther modern manufacturers get from toy and the closer they get to scale the more sought after pre-MTH trains get. A 2036 from the 50’s can’t command a high price if the best engine in the latest catalog is essentially a 2036 but with modern guts. I have one of those, a Santa Fe engine from 93(?). But take the post-war styled 2-6-4’s and 2-4-2’s out of modern catalogs and the old engines are the only game in town.
I agree, I think the entry of MTH into the marketplace back then, reinvigorated it as well as Lionel, which I think was further advanced by the arrival of K Line. K Line in the beginning reminded me of Marx that was between American Flyer and Lionel as a low cost alternative, at least in the beginning. Even the revival of the Marx brand reappeared at that time…it was a great market.
I bought the majority of my engines and rolling stock etc back then ( thank heaven). I think if Bachman revives the K line brand…it will have a leavening effect on MTH and Lionel…they will be a strong competitor given their resources and history…which is sorely needed to level the pricing and playing field. The upward creep of the hobby’s cost while the economy dwindles down ( aside from the minority with deep pockets) has had many of my own friends retrenching, and laying low ( for now) .
What strikes me as quirky is that I have been playing with toy trains for 55 years now, and to see starter sets with steam locomotives now ( when most kids don’t know what a steam engine is, outside of Thomas) makes me wonder if it is actually attracting adults, but even most adults in their mid life have not seen a live steam engine. I began with a Marx set as a child and now toward my golden years, have gone back to lithographed toys. I looked at the MTH \ Lionel tinplate costs for new and said I would rather have the originals. The same for the reissues of reissues (conventional classics) which seem to be Lionels bread and butter rather than $1200.00 engines. Yes folks are shelling out significant money for expensive toys but it’s sort of preaching or selling to the choir. The expansion of the market in my opinion is waiting on Bachman.to level the playing field.
The 80’s and 90’s were a good time for model trains. But now with the re-issues by Lionel of some of their post-war classics has killed the price for those of us who try to sell a post-war item from time to time. I would rather buy a true post-war item than a re-issue item, so I don’t see why the market value has dropped some on the original post-war items.
I am not saying that I won’t buy a modern item but I like the older Lionel trains better than most of their new stuff. It is my opion that Lionel has the name but has lowered their quality standards very much from the 1960’s.
If I can buy a brand new Williams engine for around $250.00 but a new Lionel engine just like it costs over $500.00, I am going to buy the Williams. Lionel, MTH and Atlas are all overpriced in my opion.
Lee F.
I thought the prices of post war were going down, but watching Ebay this week has me scratching my head. Prices for many items are going for NUTZ prices again. I mean, WHO is paying that?
Roger
I second your opion about ebay prices! The economy is getting more sour every day and for ebay prices to be going up, to me is totally crazy!
Lee F.
Actually the very early 1980’s were a good time to be buying PW trains. It might have been 1985 when 60 Minutes did a feature on Frank Sinatra’s PW collection (including the structure he built in Fla. to house them). That drove PW prices through the ceiling. As in any commodity/collectible market, outrageous appreciation begat competition, copy cats (including reissues by Lionel itself), which begat destructive competition, which continues today.
The truth is correct for inflation and you’ll discover right now is even a better time to be in the market for pre circuit board toy trains. Although PW prices continue to fall, available E+ stock continues to contract.
The reemergence of PW is all about the growing disgust with the disposability of modern circuit board based motive power and accessories. The Classic stuff is classic because it continues to run & run and anyone can fix it. Anything with a circuit board, and without a lifetime factory warranty, can be expected to be issued & reissued, and thus disposable as last spring’s tulips. Just check and see how the secondary market values Proto1s and pre Vision items: just a tad more than a late 1980’s Apple 1 or a 286/DOS 3.3 computer. [2c]
I’d like to second many of the things 11th street said. I’ve stopped buying modern locos and set my collecting bar at mpc or earlier. I can handle the mpc “E-boards” in place of the old “E-units” but the new electronics just quit working centuries before the engine shells will ever rust. Plus, I like the sounds made by the mpc “wheel of marbles” tenders and the old style air whistles. It’s ingenuity you can see and feel. Printed circuit boards just leave me with a “hands off” sensation whenever I touch them.
I search Ebay an average of 362 days a year, and I usually cover pre-war, post-war, Std ga and Flyer S. Since the market crash of 2008 I’ve noticed the number of sellers has nearly doubled. Especially in the “rare” areas of collecting. There’s WAY more Ives up for sale in the last 2 years than ever before, and I’ve been on Ebay since 2000. Pre-recession I was lucky to get 5 or 10 items if I searched for Ives. Now I get an average of 100 or more every day! To me that screams “a lot of deep pockets need refilling and the toy trains have to go.”
The Standard gauge and tinplate O market is excellent right now as far as quantity goes, but I’d have to say at least 50% of the prices asked are unrealistic in this economy. The days of the old boys clubs swapping trains in back rooms is numbered, garage sale economics are coming into play to ensure that. “Liquidate” seems to be the new buzz word.
Becky
Must have missed that boom cause my PW is meager.
Shopping the junk boxes under the tables still the same to me.
Although, I have heard about this new train company called MTH but have yet to ever see one in any of the train shops.
One of the primary reasons that you are seeing more stuff(even Ives trains) for sale on ebay is the economy or lack of income. I would love to sell some of my lower end trains, but won’t get much for them on ebay, so maybe I will do a train show near January and sell then.
Also I hate all the new circuit boards in the model trains, just something else to go wrong.[2c][:P]
Lee F.