wouldn´t it be a great sight, looking out of your window and one of these Ma&Pa 4-4-0 would steam by…
Talking about roster, after WW I, all German State Railways, i.e from Prussia, Saxony, Bavaria etc were merged to form Deutsche Reichsbahn, who after paying reparation to the Grand Alliance, was in desperate need for new motive power. They standardized the design very much to guarantee interchangeability of parts. This gave the roster of “Einheitslokomotiven” (Standard locos) a “family face” - similar to what the PRR did. In total, there were some 30 different “classes” of locos covering the range. A lot of them are available in HO scale. In addition to those locos, many of the pre-WW I designs remained in service, blowing the number of different design up way over the 200 mark. If you model the early 1930 era, chances that you will be able to stock up with most of them are pretty good, as a number of smaller, shop-type companies fill the gap the mass-producers have left. But again, don´t ask for the price.
Incidentally, one of the last steam locos to got out of service in the late 1970´s was an old Prussian P 8 4-6-0, designed and built in 1906, after more than 70 years of active service!
At the turn of the century, SP used ten locomotives to haul its transcontinental passenger train running between San Francisco and New Orleans, via Los Angeles. American 4-4-0 types were used except for 4-6-0s (double-headed upgrade, one locomotive downgrade) for crossing the Tehachapi Mountains in southern California. Later use of all-metal cars (so-called heavyweights) and growing train length called for more powerful locomotives.
You are most welcome for the info and thank you for the same from your end. Just imagine, a history similar to what you discibed from your country, repeated on 25 or 35 seperate principal railroads as small lines consolidated into those big lines here. Standard parts?, the only standard parts here where the ones that came from outside vendors and where used by all/most of the builders and railroads. Things like Delta trailing trucks, Commonweath tender trucks, Worthington or Elasco feed water heaters, etc. After that get out your tools, fire up the forge, crank up the lathe, or call Baldwin, Lima or ALCO and have one made. That is why so many of the large railroads here had their own massive shops and could build all or most of a loco from scratch, as many did.
As a collector I guess my input won’t really matter as much on this issue, but I just want to say, just because I tend to favor larger steam engines from the 1940’s, this doesn’t mean that I lack a soft spot for classic little steamers like the 4-4-0 or the 2-6-0. [;)]
I for one would love to see some high quality HO models of these two engines, I would buy several of them if they ever came out.
Keep in mind though, as already pointed out, there are other scales that have made these available. O gauge really has some nice 4-4-0’s out there, highly detailed die cast ones with great motors. If the third rail can’t be tolerated, I’m sure these engines could be modified for 2 rail operation on an O scale layout.
Back to HO though, I wish that Bachmann would release their old 4-4-0’s in the Spectrum series, this time around with crisper detail and higher quality motors.
Imagine if this level of detail could be compressed to HO.
A common thread in this discussion is that few 4-4-0 models have been produced, because the market is too small to cover investment costs. There is probably some truth to that view. Big firms largely focus on well established markets and bring out products for which the demand is clearly demonstrated, though that often means competing for a limited market share with others. But catering to well-established markets can be problematic, as IBM and GM discovered, and it may be more lucrative to create new markets with products like IPods and Priuses for which no demand is initially proven.
Bachmann’s success with On30 equipment shows that even big companies can succeed with this approach in the model industry. Early On3 equipment was hardly in great demand a decade ago, much less On30. Yet Bachmann ventured into On30 in a big way and built a new market that’s now one of the model train industry’s growth areas. Bachmann’s success probably depended upon producing not just one but several well-made locomotives (including a 4-4-0) and a whole line of rolling stock, so that a modeler didn’t have to worry about obtaining enough equipment. Access to Chinese capital and labor also helped, given Bachmann’s focus on mass production of moderately priced injection molded models.
But innovative products don’t have to be based on this approach. In most industries, today mass sales have given way to niche marketing, that is, focusing on a smaller, more defined market segment. Railmaster (http://www.railmasterhobbies.com/loco.htm), a small New Zealand firm, has shown this can work with regard to an even smaller segment of early model railroad
I have no room what so ever for a G-scale layout, but those large Bachmann old timers are gorgeous.
I have been sorely tempted more than once to simply get one to display and the 2-6-0 is equally good looking
Actually although not a numerous as the “Americans” the “moguls” were almost as ubiquitous to mid 19th century pioneer railroading, and with the exception of a few brass releases over the years nobody has bothered with an 1870’s early mogul in true HO scale. (I’m sorry, but the things called moguls put out by Mantua and Roundhouse don’t even come close to this)
The idea here would be that one has to GROW a market but the problem appears to be that there needs to be some kind of invesstment beyond just the money to do this----we may be facing a kind of lack of enthusiasm on the mfg’s part to invest time and effort as well—never mind monetary investment. It may very well be that there may be as well a lack of vision here—think of this for a moment—many of us are not modelling the big mainlines or the giant coal drags that Erie had—or the Virginians etc. A lot of us model small branchlines or shortlines or some such----‘moguls’ were produced by the barrelfull for the RR’s yet we find that, in general, there is a derth of moguls or any such sized locomotives around for the modeller—where is the vision to see a potential market here?
… and that´s exactly why we see UP 9000 from both MTH and BLI, GG1 from Trix and BLI, the 4th version of USRA locos etc.
It takes a good dose of entrepreneurial spirit to develop a market for a new product. But if you only think in single production batches and short term profits, than you just invest into seemingly secure businesses.
Basically the one who enters the market now, owns the market because there is esentially no competition. Roundhouse is basically the only player and they only have 3 freight cars in the market. I have Bachmann Spectrum, Mantua and Roundhouse engines and the Roundhouse engines are the best runners out of the box. The key is having all wheel electrical pickup on the tender.
Everybody keeps saying no manufacturer will invest in new tooling, but Roundhouse has retooled its boxcars at least 2 or 3 times, has retooled its 36 ft underframes (metal to plastic) has completely redone its drive train, completely retooled the boiler castings and dramatically upgraded the paint schemes. Manuta has redone the drive train and has a DCC friendly quick disconnect drawbar and better drive train. Considering that virtually all the 1800’s era cars and engines have been in production for 30-40 years, while they may not have a high volume, one time sales, they do sell over the long term.
One of the resin casters has producted a boxcar that by changing some details, can be built into any one of a half dozen different door configurations (two or three types, some open right, some open left) and as a boxcar, ventilated boxcar or reefer, and all are prototypical. This type of concept would be perfect for a plastic boxcar.
I cannot figure out why Roundhouse has never put a gondola superstructure on their 36 ft underframe. A nice 3 or 4 board high, wooden stake, wood side gon. It would give them a mode
The latest changes to Roundhouse engines and rolling stock had little to do with innovation, but simply the fact that they got acquired 3 or 4 years ago by the Horizon Hobby conglomerate. At that point all their existing dies and manufactured stock were sent to China for re-tooling and re-production as all RTR.
If you want to see Horizon’s focus on hobbies, go to their web site. You will see pictures of people flying RC airplanes and not people playing with model trains. These are the same people that are discontinuing Athern blue box kits.
Consequently, I would not expect much innovation from Roundhouse since they simply are not the company that they once were.
All kits and anything other than HO scale are totally gone.
If you visit their website you will see all old time engines discontinued as of 2007. About the only thing new are various releases of their standard old time boxcars, reefers, coaches, and shorty steel girder flats—all RTR and all produced in China.
Here is where a market can be MADE.Again, we need a sense of possibilities. Any idea that starts off saying well, so and so did such and such and it fell on its dupka should be met with–did they do their research? Was anything even done—that kind of thing. Read these forums and ask yourselves this question. Could this be the start of a market? And if so then it can be built on. One has to BUILD this market by doing the research–who are your POTENTIAL CUSTOMERS, WHAT are they LOOKING FOR—and WHY.
So. I get piculous and get I start getting the ol’ nose out of joint. I start asking questions. I’m building up what ever menial skills I have and start experimenting with various materials and eventually something comes together----I do assume that, in some miserable way those who placed themselves/families/friends into some kind of busines
Now I know why I want a 4-4-0. Did you see the way it took the clothes off that woman as it went by? I just need to lure the wife into the trainroom and we’ll be in business.[:-,]
Well, I be dang if I didn’t fall for my own hype about how pretty those G scale Bachmann moguls are and even though I don’t plan on switching to, or even running, G scale, I went and bought one tonight off of Evilbay.
It;s the exact same model in the picture I posted with the exception of having the Baldwin Locomotive Works printed on the tender. I only gave $185 for it which is pretty cheap for a MIB model that originally had an MSRP of $850. Of course I realize they sell cheaper than that but most shops still want more than double what I paid.
These are supposedly copies of the one of the two Baldwins (the other was the 4-4-0) that ran folks around the 1876 centennial exposition in Philadelphia. I guess I’ll get a display case for it an put it on the mantle. Isn’t it fun to have the model train bug!
There were quite a few threads this past week about steamers, particulary old ones. It caused me to think about the engines I have for the transition era that I’m modeling, seven diesels and only one steamer, a BLI light Mikado w/s.
The more I saw of the 4 4 0 and realized there are so few old steamers of any configuration available I knew I was going to buy something.
The 4 4 0 took me back to the days of “yester year” when the Clantons, Daltons, ets (wearing black hats) stopped the trains for easy cash while Bob Steele, Johnny MacBrown, The Lone Ranger, and others (wearing white hats of course) chased the bad guys down. In case some of you got lost ask your parents about the Saturday afternoon westerns.
Soooooo I decided that the Spectrum was getting the best reviews and that 4 6 0 would look more believeable with my other locos. It was also available in DCC W/S. Shortly after I made the decision my lovely wife asked what she could get me for Christmas. NEED I SAY MORE !
It arrived on Thursday and she said I couldn’t open the box, but I explained that it would need to be tested. I ran it for about 1/2 hour and took pictures. I’ll get it back on Christmas morning giffed wraped and all.
