My Lionel 1990 LCCA locomotive has to run at 70% area of transformer. I’m using a ThrottlePak 1301, 24VAC Output, 64VAC Total Output. I know there are a couple of spots that I need to add lockons. The track is clean as are the wheels and pickups on the Lionel. I’m not using any of the Rail Sound Systems But it just seems like I shouldn’t need to run at that 70% range.
My old 70-80 year old trains run ok on the same track using an AF 128 250 Watt transformer.
Is the ThrottlePak my problem?
Thanks for any input.
Bill
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So you’re saying that the transformer must be throttled up to the 70 mark of the range to make the locomotive run? Or am I misunderstanding you?
Is this the transformer that you’re using?
Also–do you have an AC meter? I’d recommend checking the voltage range.
Finally, have you tried running the Lionel loco with the Flyer transformer? If it does the same thing, then it may need some lubrication.
Yes, that is the transformer. And it needs to be throttled up to the 70 mark. It runs lower but slow/stop at 50. I was told when I bought the loco that I shouldn’t run it on the “old” transformer, it was too powerful (amps or something). Was recommended to buy/use the ThrottlePak.
I have not tried the Flyer transformer with this loco.. I just checked the ThrottlePak. 7-8 volts at the terminals at 50% and on track. I know I get 11-12 on track from the Flyer transformer. Is there a reason I can’t run this loco from Flyer transformer?
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What’s the maximum voltage that the Flyer transformer outputs? If it’s higher than 18 (I suspect that that’s the normal max operating voltage of the ThrottlePak and that the 24v is from when the “boost” button is pushed) then it probably wouldn’t be safe for the loco, but lower than that it’s good. So long as you have a circuit breaker (a TVS diode is also good insurance, but not necessary) you should be fine. I’ve run 1990s Lionel equipment, a slightly newer Williams diesel, and a brand-new Menards loco perfectly fine off of old Lionel and Marx transformers (I just got a small Flyer transformer, which is more or less the same electrically as my small Lionel transformers). I would think that your Flyer transformer’s voltage range starts at 0v, jumps to something like 8v, and then goes up to the maximum voltage. That’s like what mine does. The ThrottlePak probably starts at 0v and then goes the full voltage range up to its maximum. Most older locomotives need several volts to get going, so older transformers usually skip the lowest voltages. Newer ones sometimes do not, which works better with new can-motored locomotives (much lower starting voltages). However, they have to be throttled up quite a bit to get the older locos running.
I think he has to get an AC meter, and chart the output voltage both with ‘boost’ engaged and disengaged for multiple positions of the rheostat. (And then do the same for the AF 250W unit…) BUT he has to take the readings with a fixed load, perhaps as much as to produce the 4A indicated by the 1301’s VA rating.
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A meter is absolutely necessary!
I checked the ThrottlePak and it does ramp up slowly. 1.2 volts at 10% up to 12.5 volts at 70% and all that is with the booster on. Those measurements are both at the terminals and on the track.
Beginning to think I should get a different transformer and replace the ThrottlePak. What would be a good one to replace it with?
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I would think long and hard before getting a different transformer. There doesn’t seem to be anything wrong with the ThrottlePak; it’s just not properly matched with the loco. If you do switch, my recommendation would be that you use the Flyer transformer (I really doubt that there’s much danger, especially if you use TVS diodes and a good circuit breaker). However, if you want a new one, well, it’s gonna be spendy. So, you could go to Lionel and get a transformer from them. However, that’s a lot of money for what is, in the grand scheme of things, a comparatively low-power transformer. Obviously, used transformers are available–but since you already have a rather powerful Flyer transformer that would be redundant. New-ish ones can be obtained similarly to older transformers (I like Trainz.com), but you might have the same issues as the ThrottlePak. Of course, the extreme option would be to build your own transformer–but I don’t see that happening… 
It would be nice to be able to run all trains from one transformer. I’m going to venture down path of adding diodes/circuit breaker to be able to use the Flyer transformer. I’ll probably be back with tons of questions regarding TVS diodes, etc.
I appreciate every ones input and suggestions.
Bill
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Perfect–here’s some TVS diodes ((Pack of 20 Pieces) Chanzon TVS Diodes 1.5KE33CA 1500W 33V DO-201AD (DO-27) Bidirectional Channel 1500 Watt 33 Volt: Amazon.com: Industrial & Scientific) and some circuit breakers (Amazon.com: A ABSOPRO Circuit Breaker Blade Style Fuse 5A 28V Manual Resettable for Car Marine Metal Khaki (Set of 2) : Automotive). While your transformer is supposed to be equipped with a circuit breaker, I don’t trust original circuit breakers–I’ve got several Lionel transformers with dysfunctional breakers. However, that’s not a problem with external breakers like these–which are also often faster-acting. Here’s how to wire them in. You’ll want to mount the circuit breaker somewhere that you can get at it to reset it with a screwdriver.
This is the way that I’m doing it on my railroad, except I haven’t gotten my TVS diodes yet.
If you want to use the horn and bell on the locomotive (since you mentioned that it has Railsounds), I can show you how to do so with the Flyer transformer.
Super! Thanks. I’m off and running (like a turtle). Baby steps.
Thanks again.
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If you need anything else, I might be able to provide it.
The circuit breaker above indicates “Car Marine” and 28VDC. Are these direct current? Does that work on the AC circuit? Or am I missing something.
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VDC means ‘volts direct current’.
Using a DC breaker on AC is far less troublesome than trying to use an AC breaker on DC, because any arc between the contacts will extinguish every half cycle. But you also want to remember that the peak voltage in sine-wave AC is greater than the ‘rated’ voltage, which is RMS(measured via ‘root-mean-square’) – a little more than a third again as great (e.g. about 161 to 163V for nominal 120VAC house current). That is probably where the 28VDC rating came to be used – that would correspond to about 21VAC.
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Woke_Hoagland is right, they are indeed DC. They still work on AC, and trip quite reliably.
And big thanks again. Diodes should be here in a couple of days. So attacking circuit breaker right now.
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You’re welcome!