I believe that nothing more need’s to be said.
Cheers, [D]
Frank
OK, then I will say it. Where are you trying to save space on your yard???
At the end? You want LONGER tracks? Smalles switch numbers are shorter and will take up less length, BUT the wide angle of the diversion means that you may only put four tracks where you could put five tracks with a bigger frog number. LION gets the best of both worlds by using no.6 turnouts and then cutting them shorter so I can put more of them closer together.
The gemoetry of the yard makes a difference too. A ladder takes up a lot of space, building the ladder on a curve takes up less space, other configureations can give you longer tracks as well. This has been written about, so the LION will not try to remember it or explain it to you.
ROAR
Lion,
I’m not the one trying to save space and I’m not the one having problem’s getting an Atlas #4 working right either.
Cheers, [D]
Frank
Or you can get the best of all worlds by skipping the Atlas #4 altogether and installing a Peco #6 which is the same length as the Atlas #4. [:D]
Or, you can do what Frank does, buy an Atlas #4, tweak it by filing at the points to provide a better fit at the stock rail, then put CA on the throwbar so it doesn’t move, then bend the point rail on the diverging track to match the small curve going into the frog. [+o(]
Rich
Actually, both Lion’s point re length vs. number of tracks and your point about Peco #6s and Atlas #4s are quite helpful. I’ll have to take those into consideration when I decide which switches to buy…hopefully before too long here.
Ah Rich,you made go measure…Sure enough a nicer switch at the same length.I never notice that before.
Truth be told, it was all accidental.
Early on in my HO scale ventures back in 2004, I bought a bunch of Atlas #4 turnouts. But, over time, I moved exclusively to Atlas #6 turnouts.
Then, in 2012, I bought a pair of Peco #6 turnouts and matching crossings to get from my outer main line track, across my inner main line track, into my passenger station. It was then that I first realized that the Peco #6 was only 9 inches in length (just like the Atlas #4) compared to the Atlas #6 which was 12 inches in length.
More recently, I took one of those old Atlas #4 turnouts and installed it at the beginning of the track ladder in my diesel servicing facility. All the other turnouts were Atlas #6. After the ladder was completed and ballasted, I realized the problem with the 6-axle diesels. I was in no mood to take out and rebuild the ladder, so it was then that I decided to install the Peco #6 turnout.
Think about it. A ladder built out of Peco #6 turnouts is a ladder built with turnouts that are 3 inches shorter in length than a ladder built with Atlas #6 turnouts.
Rich
And that 3" difference is the difference between success and failure on a small ISL or yard switching layout- both can be built on a 1 foot wide board.
Its only good common sense to go with the Peco #6 instead of the Atlas #4.
Years ago I was traumatised when I tried to run my Athearn SD45 through #4 turnouts and it didn’t like them much.
My philosophy since then has been rather than trying to negotiate the maze of what #4 turnouts might work and which might not for my long engines and long cars in a yard, I simply used #6 and then I don’t have to worry. They work and they don’t take up that much more space.
I often see people trying to squeeze long trains around tight curves or tight turnouts. I guess if you like a challege, have at it. But my lesson in train life has been to be a little more generous in your track design and you will be happier for it later on. This is the lesson I have gotten from readying hundreds of layout articles in the 80’s and 90’s and being a student of John Armstrong.
Depends on the sharpness of the diverging route.
The BB SD45 go around a 18" curve-not a pretty sight nor a good idea and will go through a Atlas C100 Custom line #4 but,has a hard time on a Model Power #4- those looks like a Atlas snap switch wanna be…
Alright, one more question. I’m operating using DC, with just a run-of-the-mill power pack you’d get, for example, with a train set. What do I need to know regarding wiring of insulfrog and electrofrog turnouts? I also need to install some of these in my “loop” of track – not just in my stub-end freight yard.
RR Telg,
My suggestion to you would be to come up with a track plan and post that along with your questions. Everyone will ask if you can anyway. Extremely helpful to anyone trying to give you advice, sounds like you are going to have a reverse loop and that would be easier to explain with a plan. Might even be better to start a new thread on it. We just spent two pages on #4 turnouts,some people may not know,there is a new subject with questions. [:)]
Cheers, [D]
Frank
RR Telg, when you say “loop of track”, are you talking about a continuous mainline like an oval, or do you have a reverse loop where the track folds back onto itself?
The difference between the Insulfrog and the Electrofrog is the frog, powered with Electo, unpowered with Insul. Either way, these turnouts are power routing, so it all depends upon your track configuration.
Rich
Ideally I’d do that, but it’s finals time here in law school, so I’m kinda crunched for time. Still, I could describe in words what I’m trying to do, but I’m not sure I’d describe it corectly or well enough so that we could have a discussion. I think I’ll just have to take your advice and start a new thread once I can post a picture.
If you are going to add a reverse loop to your DC layout, then you are going to need some special wiring, gap some rails to isolate the loop, and install a DPDT switch. Here is a link to some basic information in that regard.
http://modeltrains.about.com/od/track/ss/Reverse-Loops_2.htm
The Insulfrog would sure be a lot easier to work with in this situation than the Electrofrog.
Rich
Rich,A option would be a Atlas Controller(0220) since its easy to wire.You can cut gaps or use the plastic insulating rail joiners.
Thanks for posting that link. After poking around there, I think I should be alright. I’m not talking about building a reverse loop. I know it’s kinda hard to describe this without a picture, but the line I want to build will essentially be the same as building a siding that can be entered from either end (not a stub-end siding).
Those don’t cause electrical polarity issues that require fancy wiring, right?
If you aren’t including a reverse loop, and the polarities of the rails remain in phase throughout the layout, then no special wiring, or rail gapping, is required. In that case, it would be easier to use Peco Insulfrog turnouts. JUst be sure to add feeder wires on all three ends of every turnout.
Rich
Great, thank you!