Anyone know where I can find 7/7 boxcar end panels? I want two for the following scratchbuilding/kitbashing project:
I poked around the internet. Tichy and Westerfield offer 7/8 Murphy ends but no 7/7. I’d even be willing to cannibalize them from an existing boxcar shell but I don’t know which ones would have them.
I appreciate any leads you might have. Thanks in advance…
Tom
Hi Tom,
I can’t help with the 7/7 ends, but I will say that the caboose is an interesting project! I look forward to watching your progress.
Dave
Edit: Have you considered 3D printing?
No, I haven’t, Dave, but I’m not opposed to it - if that’s my only option.
10+ years ago I kitbashed a prototype of the above out of a 40’ MDC wood boxcar. The steps, windows, and doors were cannibalized from a Walthers caboose. The sill beams, interior end panels, and grooved sliding door-filler came from Evergreen stock:
It was really a proof-of-concept project so it’s a bit crude and lacking detailing. Now, I’d like to build it closer to the actual NYC prototype.
Tom
Where these built from recycled boxes because of the shortage of materials? All going to the war effert?
And I image they were made from wood box cars? Much like the wood side hoppers.
Mike.
Tom, the easiest path is to buy the Tichy ends, then choose one rib in the 8-rib portion and use either your X-Acto knife or a razor saw to make a cut across the crown of that rib.
You can then use either a mill file or sandpaper to carefully remove the half-rib and part of the valley from each portion. File or sand in only one direction at a time, not back-and-forth, as that usually ends up in a rocking motion which creates a curve in the mating surfaces.
When the excess material has been removed, use a solvent-type cement, such as Testors or MEK, to generously coat the two mating surfaces, then place them face-up on a sheet of glass or other smooth surface that’s impervious to the cement and join them.
The plastic will soften as soon as the cement is applied, and if you slide the mating sufaces against one another before aligning them, it will allow any irregularities to “smoosh” out.
Let the joint thoroughly harden, then use a round needle file to remove the smooshed-out excess.
I use this method to either add or remove ribs to/from the Tichy ends, and if I could remember on which cars I performed that operation, I’d post a picture (or three).
Do not use the F&C ends, as they cannot be joined with solvent cement, and will therefore not permit a tight bond.
Done properly, the joint will not be noticeable at all.
Wayne
If you want to see a wartime caboose with character look up the PRR NX23.
I just looked through my stash of boxcar ends because I thought there was a chance had 7/7s in metal from Red Ball, Selley, or Walthers (possibly WWII era models!), or in plastic from one or another of those Train Miniature variants. But no luck and for what you seek to do, cast white metal probably would not be the best raw material anyway.
Dr. Wayne’s reference to liberal applications of solvent cement followed by pushing the parts together so they “smoosh” reminds me of Art Curren’s kitbashing methods for plastic structures where he actively sought to over-apply the solvent to a joint and press hard so that plastic would ooze out from the joint. Most people do anythng they can to avoid that but he did it intentionally - with the idea that letting that goop harden and then carefully cutting it away with a sharp knife would mean a solid corner join with no gaps whatever.
By the way remember the earlier discussion about those boxcar ends in this older thread:
http://cs.trains.com/mrr/f/13/t/186783.aspx
Good luck
Dave Nelson
Yes, I do, Dave. Hard to believe that was over 9 years ago. [:O] And here it is clickable:
http://cs.trains.com/mrr/f/13/t/186783.aspx
And this one is even older:
http://cs.trains.com/mrr/f/13/t/87980.aspx
The latter is the thread that I perused last night. I had forgotten the more recent one from 2011. [:S]
Tom
Have you tried anything like Trainz.com or ebay? I don’t know if this would fit the bill, but a quick ebay search yielded these: https://www.ebay.com/itm/Tichy-Train-Group-3020-HO-Box-Car-Ends/231871980871?hash=item35fca5a547:g:w8UAAOxyY7FRCr5o There were a few others on there as well, but these are the only ones I saw that have the “Buy it now” option. I haven’t checked Trainz yet, but I’ll let you know if I see anything. This sounds like a pretty interesting project. Good luck with it. I look forward to seeing it when it’s done.
I just checked Trainz.com, and I was able to find this: https://www.trainz.com/products/detail-associates-6235-boxcar-end-dreadnaught-4-5 I also checked Walthers, and they have three types of end available. They have one USRA type end from Tichy, and two AAR type ends from Detail Associates. I hope this helps.
Are the ribs on the prototype caboose pressed in rather than out?
According to another forum member, Dave (dehusman), they are “inverse 7/7 Youngstown (Murphy)”. It’s discussed here on a thread from 2011.
Tom
Wayne,
As usual, I appreciate your detailed response. [:D]
It’s funny you should mention creating the 7/7 end panel from a Tichy 7/8. Last night I was looking at a close-up of another NYC “temporary” war-time caboose from a .pdf doc entitled The Caboose Classics - New York Central Line - Part 2. In one of the photos (seen below) showing the end view of NYC #18755, two 7-panel sections appear to be cludged together, with the top p
The picture in your first post shows that seam. I had to look up the topic, and answered my question, on why and how they were built.
Nice project!
Mike.
You can see a better image of the end wall here:
https://nycshs.files.wordpress.com/2014/06/cabooseclassics2.pdf
Scroll all the way to the last page. Excellent infromation here on NYC cabooses of many types.
Also:
https://nycshs.files.wordpress.com/2014/02/pages-from-1975q1.pdf
https://nycshs.files.wordpress.com/2014/06/caboose-classics3.pdf
https://nycshs.files.wordpress.com/2014/03/cabooses4.pdf
The NYCSHS is a great source for information. .pdf files can be downloaded and saved or individual pages can be printed for reference at the workbench.
I also took a quick inventory of my house cars and didn’t readily find any 7/7 ends.
I do have a B&O war emergency caboose.
BnO_I-13_C1819b by Edmund, on Flickr
The B&O built these using the frames of former stock cars.
Hope that helps, Ed
Ed,
That’s the very document where I obtained the photos that I posted above. Thanks for the link. I’ve included it with my earlier post.
The cupola-less cabooses would also be another interesting project…
Tom
Good question. In Tom’s first link to those two older posts, there’s a photo of one of my boxcars, with mention of modifying a Tichy end, and then using it as a pattern to create a “rubbing” using aluminum foil.
Here’s the same car, but with a better view of it and its ends.
The model is of a CASO boxcar, done quite a few years ago, when I didn’t have much in the way of reference books for freight cars. I worked from a not-too-detailed photo, and a bit of info that came with it, starting with a Train Miniature boxcar, which was a low-height car much like the real one. I knew from the photo that the prototype had trucks with a leaf/coil spring package, and that the side sills had been patched with sheet metal due to premature rust-out. I also knew that the ends were an inverse Youngstown type. I was not, however, aware of the rib pattern on the ends.
After placing the aluminum foil over the Tichy 5-5-5 end, and carefully moulding it over the various ribs and rivets, I realised that it would be too tall for the TM car, so I simply sliced-off the excess ribs from the bottom of the foil ends. I then flipped both of the foil ends in order for them to appear as inverse corrugations, then coated both the foil and the plain sheet plastic that I had installed in place of the cars original ends, with contact cement.
After allowing it to dry to the touch, the foil ends were carefully put in place.
Here’s the car, with proper side sills, along with the sheet metal patch strips over the rusted-out sidesheets, and the correct leaf/coil spring packages in the trucks…
That is a great link. I bet the crews probably liked this style of caboose, as they look like they have lots more room!
Mike.
Actually, Mike, since the original intention of the war cabooses was “temporary” and put together quickly, the cars themselves 1) rode like a boxcar and 2) were freezing in the winter and sweltering in the summer. But, they had to make do with what they had at the time and any metal for extra cars would have been earmarked for the war effort. Some did manage to last into the 50s though.
Tom
I didn’t think about the box car trucks. I bet it was a tough ride.
I’ve never spent much time reseaching cabooses (?) until I started building my MILW. terminal caboose.
Mike.
PS. I just found your thread from 2009 when you started your project.