Hi I’m just wondering what the ideal weight on a HO car should be, can they be to heavy? I just have a feeling that the lighter cars have more problems then the heavier ones? I would like to know the weight in metric since I’m from Sweden.
Magnus
OIne sec here let me go get my MR…
Ho initial weight shoulg be 1 ounce.
additional weight(ounces) per inches .5 ounce
1 ounce (troy) is 31.10 grams
1 ounce (avoirdupois) is 28.35 grams
if you want it in some other weight let me know I can probably find the conversion.
Hope this helps,
dekruif
Yes cars can be weigh to heavy…NMRA’s RP20.1 is workable but,leaves a lot to be desired.You see the cars are weigh according to Length and in the opinion of many modelers this causes the cars to be unequal in weight going back to square one about some cars being to light while some are heavier.
There is a workable solution…All cars regardless of length would be EQUAL in weight by using the same weight for EACH car instead of using the method set forth by NMRA’s RP20.1 which again unequal due to car length.
Here’s a link to NMRA’s rp http://www.nmra.org/standards/rp-20_1.html. I have always followed this rp and not had any problems. Others have used lighter cars some successfully and some with problems.
Enjoy
Paul
Here is a link that will convert almost anything to anything…
http://www.metric-conversions.org/conversion-calculators.htm
Larry:
The NMRA’s recommended practice is based on train length - (1/2 oz. per inch) plus 1 oz. per car to compensate for rolling friction.
To do it your way would make and MDC ore car or 36 footer the same weight as an 85’ passenger car. Would that be better?
What weight would you consider optimum for ALL cars? Say 2.5 oz?
Either way it’s a compromise.
Thanks for the honor but,I am crestfallen because its not my idea…[:(]
This weight thought has been discuss by operating SIG over the years…As far as I know nobody has come up with a suggested weight…So,your 4 oz suggestion is as good as any as it stands now.However…We agree that RP20.1 is out dated due to the length of modern cars…It was good for shorter 36-50 foot cars however.
I think Don Gibson’s got it right. I’ve been following NMRA RP-20.1 for years, and I can tell you that it works. So long, Andy
Andy,Just because something has work for years doesn’t mean it can’t be improved.Brass track and correctly mounted X2F couplers will work just as well today as they did back in the 50s and 60s…But,we all know that couplers and track has been improved over the years…
That is all that has been discuss by several Operation Sig’s is how the weight could be improved to equal the cars weight out…
There’s also “if it ain’t broke, don’t fix it.” How are the NMRA weight guidelines broken if they work fine as Andy says? I can concur with Andy that the NMRA weight guidelines have worked fine for me, too.
[B)][B)]
Sure,RP20.1 is workable like I stated…However broken or no it could stand some improvements.Its getting those good folk that has blinders on and closed minds for car weight improvements to see the need…
This isn’t a new problem…I seen RP20.1 weighed cars string line just like cars that have stock weight…Should a 86 foot boxcar weigh far more then a 50 footer? How about or a 65 foot mill gon weighing more then a 52 gon?
How are you going to build a train in the yard? Heavy cars in front light cars in back? Not very prototypical is it? [B)][xx(]
And if we all followed that philosophy we would still all be using _______________ fill in the blank (DC electrical power systems, Stanley Steamers, black wall telephones, etc.). Most true inovations come from fixing things that aren’t broken. I’ve contended for several years that the weighting system needs to be re-looked at in consideration of today’s low friction truck technology. Then there is the whole issue of simulating the realism of a real train having different weights whether the car is loaded or not. Shouldn’t a loaded HO box car weigh more than an empty one?
Well then, I would submit the following formula to the NMRA for their consideration.
HO car weight equals prototype weight divided by 87. How much more prototypical can you get?[:D]
BB
At one time the NMRA recomended practice was 3.5 oz. for a 40’car and 1/2 aditional for every inch of car length over 6". I started w/ with this standard many many moons ago and have stuck with it. I run 40-50 car frt trains and that’s worked for me w/ one exception. For some reason 35’ covered hoppers seem to need more wt. than the normal 3.5 oz (this might be why they changed to the 4 oz recomendation for nin wt). This is something of an anamoly since it’s been my experience that, given equal car wts, the longer cars tend to derail more on shoving moves than the shorter ones (I ordinarily shove 25-30 car cuts through three facing point switches at the base of my 2% hump giving me, perhaps, more experience on facing point shoving derailments than most)
B.B. The prototype have various loads - full to empty’s - where our modeled imitations don’t. RR’s deal in tonnage where we deal in how many (cars).
Larry: …according to an SP (now UP) active RR Engineer friend of mine, thats the way they do it - heavy in front, empty’s in the rear. 'Stringlining’is now blamed on the Engineer - and costly.
Don,I was a brakeman for 91/2 years and I have watch thousands of trains over the years and I KNOW better then that because trains are made up in destination blocks…That means empties and loads will be mixed together.
The NMRA standard was set during the days of poor rolling metal trucks. A statement from a former NMRA member who passed away.
With the new free rolling trucks and Kadee couplers, we are now blessed with better train control. Our club can operate 85 car freight trains with three units leading and a pusher.
The gentleman that I mentioned had sweeping curves and ran 100 car trains. None of them were weighted to the NMRA standard.
It really boils down to what works for you. But all of the suggestions are meant to be helpful.
Good Luck.
Sincerely, Mark.
Yes, I would expect a longer car to weigh more. I think the question is how much more. An 86 foot boxcar would have more metal (and possibly wood) than a 50 foot car.
Jeff,Absolutely…How much more is the question…As it stands under RP20.1 a 85 foot car weighs at lest 2 ounces more then a 50 boxcar due to the ADDED WEIGHT PER INCH like Don pointed out.See what we are getting at?
The first time I heard this discuss was at the NMRA Convention in Dayton,Oh way back in 1975 by a group of young modelers-read 20 and 30 somethings that was discussing modern railroad prototypical operation*…I am not sure who the guy was that started this movement but,it hasn’t faded away in modern railroad operation Sigs as its still being discuss due to the length of modern cars VS. the old 36 and 40 footers…It was also discuss at a local modelers meet 3 or 4 years ago…
- Operation by radios and form Ds instead of ETT and Form 19s.
If so, an HO model of a 100,000 lb. car would weigh 1,141 lb!
The weight would scale as: Pw / 87.1 / 87.1 / 87.1 = Model weight . A 100,000 lb. car would scale out to 2.4oz. So the NMRA weight is actually heavier than it would scale out to be, but that can be allowed for by the fact that the model is made of much heavier material (scale) than the prototype. A model made of scale-thickness materials would barely support its own weight, much less a scale load.