Thats the title of a 14 page post on www.modelrailroadforums.com under General Forums page 1. It starts in 2005, pg 7 up is 2010 and pg 11 is June 2010. This is a primarly HO site but this topic is very general. I didn’t read all of it by any means but did read quite a bit. It seems nearly all hobbies fear there in trouble. There are few train shows in the high population Los Angeles area anymore. Back in the good old days TTOS filled all my needs. I never went to all scales shows like I did Sat. the Great Train Expo thet was very enjoyable. Im thinking Im glad I bought all that postwar and MPC back then as it would be difficult now.
I don’t think I know enough to generalize to all hobbies. But I’ve posted some of my opinions on why model railroading in particular has slowed down, in the thread “Teen railroading:” http://cs.trains.com/trccs/forums/t/176428.aspx
As for Los Angeles, it is likely that the Los Angeles demographic is dissimilar to other areas of the country. I live in a mostly-rural area, where the nearest hobby shop is 40 miles away, and the nearest scheduled train show is a 3-hour drive. But both the hobby shops and the train shows do exist. I can’t honestly say that the number of hobby shops within driving distance is any greater or lesser than it was in, say, 1960.
I bought most of my postwar and MPC back in the Seventies, when it was cheap. I was living in a city at that time, and a truly outstanding train shop was nearby (from what I see on the net, it is still there, and has even opened a branch store). The postwar Lionel hadn’t yet become so much in demand, and the MPC was new and not yet considered collectible. Otherwise, I probably wouldn’t have been able to afford it at all.
In some respects, we may be better off now than we have been in some years. I’ve been eyeing a Baldwin switcher from American Models, which makes an excellent line of S scale locomo
I don’t know that it is “in trouble”. Judging by the number of participants in our club’s youth program, as well as a long waiting list, there is interest. However there are so many more offerrings in the hobby arena today then when I was young, heck of a long time ago. Not to mention the electronic toys & games.
The only really good show I have attendeed was the W.G.H. a few years back. Looking forward to their next visit here. Keep saying I’m going to a Cal Stewart Meet but haven’t yet. York, no way,just to far away.
In regard to O scale, to some extent, the economic conditions have had an over riding impact. At the same time, the issue is the culture and it’s relationship with railroads themselves in terms of any growth in the hobby that could be bringing in a younger demographic. Someone once said that without steam, the comparison is like watching a conveyor belt compounded by the uniformity or lack of obviously discernible differences in types of motive power, a narrowed variety of rolling stock as well as the vanished era of many independent roads. color schemes, cabooses, percentage of those employed by the roads having dramatically shrunk, the demise of intercity passenger service, lack of railroads in interacting with PR with public.Remember the road names that intrigued us…of far away places? Whats a BNSF? A CSX?. Where is Norfolk Southern? The romance of the rails has been superseded by Wall Street. What would David P Morgan think?. Most modern essays on railroading are like reading a engineering journal. How many articles can be done on Cajon Pass? You once could identify regions, local flavor, idiosyncrasies… What in the world is a Bangor and Aroostok? We spent a good portion of our youth outside, actually experiencing the world…playing. if I just look at how many layouts are set in the steam or transition era, it seems to affirm this. Another is the diminished role in the industrial and manufacturing base. In other words, that world of the interactive role in professional terms, has gone making the whole concept of railroading as a profession as exciting as driving a truck.Where this would appeal to a child now is very limited. The schools involved with railroad instruction or civil engineering is almost nil. We need a Louis Marx as I am sorry but for most families $200-300 bucks for a circle of track in this culture is no bargain as there is no tie in other than watching the repetitious cycle of trains running a circle, which again the kid has to really stretch his or her imagination to be more tha
Don’t know but the hobby shops are sure drying up. [sigh]
Being replaced by the internet sellers, the vast majority of your LHS’s can’t even buy stock for what most of the big internet outlets are selling.
I’ve noticed this trend in the last decade or so, and I believe that there are multiple factors at work here. I’m speaking primarily of O scale, which is what I model in exclusively, but to a lesser extent it applies to the other scales as well. First of all, ours is an expensive hobby, and in these times this can be a relevant factor in deciding to invest in building a layout. Today’s generation is spellbound by flashy video games, iPods, fancy cellphones, and the internet. A train with a few freight cars going around in a circle on the floor cannot compete with this in the eyes of the vast majority of today’s youth.
I remember the colorful trains and railroads of my youth with great fondness & in great detail. I spent many an hour at the Cherokee Yard in Tulsa, Oklahoma, marveling at the mysterious roadnames of places mysterious & far away. Today (at least in my opinion) railroads are not the same-dull paint schemes, boring streams of identical intermodal units, and a lack of the distinctive and wonderful varieties, colors, & types of freight cars, passenger cars, & cabooses. Sadly, the greatest generation is in its twilight years, and a lot of their enthusiasm for and knowlege of these things will die with them. Today’s generation cannot be nostalgic for something they have never seen.
I have hope for the hobby, though. The recent Lionel Signature Edition releases are the answer to many a collector’s dream, as are the recent offerings by MTH, Third Rail, & others. Although I personally am not a fan of the new modern electronics and tend to stick to the old school syle of model railroading, the recent leaps in electronics & technology have opened new possibilities to the hobby. The great selection of items available today allows the possibility of modeling almost any road name or era of railroading, and we can only hope that the new gene
I know there are many factors in the downward trend in the train hobby. A few thoughts:
- Kids are more entertained by constant changing scenes (flashing lights, action, etc) the likes of which they find in video games. They can play for hours on end.
- Parents have become consumed with their own issues and actually welcome the fact that their kids will sit in front of a computer or TV, or DS and not interrupt the parent’s activities.
- There are more choices for entertainment, like 200 channels on TV to choose from, etc.
If we were to invest more time in our kids, and for this topic, our sons, they would come to like many of the things we like. For our home, I enjoy the times when my kids come to work on the layout with me. It not only gives us time together, it imparts knowledge that they would not likely get without the investment of that time. How many of us have learned mechanics and wiring basics from working with our Dads because they invited us along in both their hobbies and their work on the house, etc.
We have a saying at our church Whoever wants the next generation the most, will get them. Basically, they will learn about life and how to deal with issues either from their parents, or they will get them from the world. If you don’t tell your daughters how precious and beautiful they are, don’t be surprised when they run off with someone who will. If you don’t tell your son how much you love him and want to see him grow up and be a good moral father, don’t be surprised when he follows a path of poor judgement. And we do this all with being a good example for them to follow.
Just my [2c]
dennis
You are correct. Mail-order vendors cut deeply into the sales of hobby shops, and now the internet vendors, with their one-click ordering have finished the job.
Naturally, times are hard, and we all need to save money wherever we can. But every internet sale is one less to support the local hobby shop, whose overhead is vastly higher.
As far as the high-ticket items like train sets and expensive, high-end locomotives are concerned, that doesn’t have much impact on the buyer. But in the long run, when you need a couple of trucks, or a pack of Kadee couplers or a few pieces of track, that’s when you miss having a hobby shop around.
&n
Interesting reading, so my [2c]:
It has been a few years, now, that I moved from the “HO” world to the “O-27” world. When I made the switch, I started buying modern stuff at my -now closed- local hobby shop. Something new was always coming “in” and the “$” were flowing out. I had been used to spending less for quality smaller train items and realized that, for me, it was time to “pull in the reins”.
I decided to “go” postwar thus "sort of" closing my eyes to the new “bells and whistles” and sold most of the newer stuff on “E-Bay”.
I think that the “Hobby”, as such, is doing OK. There may be “pricing” and “quality” issues, as there are with most hobbies, but as long as there are trains, innovation and kids (young and not-so-young, with money to spend) it will survive. Thanks for asking.
I think alot of the perception of a troubled hobby depends where in the country you are located. The majority of trains historically were sold in the Mid Atlantic to the Northeast and the Midwest. Having lived in many parts of the country due to being in the military I saw definate regional differences in interest in toy trains and model railroading. But no matter where you are if the youth are not entering the hobby there will be a decline. Fortunately I live near Baltimore now and there are plenty of Hobby Shops within a two hour drive and multiple train shows, big and small, every year including York, PA to attend. The shows continue to be as big and as well attended as I have seen in the past.
Since there are more government workers in this area fewer people are without jobs and still have money to spend.
There are a few Hobby Shops in Arkansas that have managed to make it this far.
However, trains are last on our expense sheet and we have switched scales to O gauge. That required a change in how we deal with hobby shops.
Email and internet is a good way of doing business. Both of my hobby shops will order anything I want within reason on a email from me.
Then let me know when it arrives.
Cannot beat that good service.
I think each year that we have a store is a year to make the most of. They may not be around next year. I have seen many very good Hobby Shops come and go over my life time. And only have the memories of them. Blue box kits at 1.40 minimum wage at 3.35 and so on LOL. Brass at 100.00 and so on.
These articles (and responses) are interesting. There are certainly demographics involved, as a primary participant group ages - and the next generation choose to do other things. To a certain extent, folks also like to see others share their enthusiasm because it validates their leisure choices - look at the angst over the future of recreational fishing or boating (at least in my market). Others have pointed out the changes technology has made in distribution channels. On the other hand, this same technology has knit some of us together - especially in areas low on fellow hobbyists or groups. .
I think it comes down to one’s exposure to both prototype railways and to their miniature counterparts. I was introduced to the hobby via my father’s Louis Marx & Co. outfit dating from about 1957 and sold through Sears in Canada, I believe it was. Although the tracks in my town were lifted while I was still an infant, I have made efforts to learn the history and appreciate it. History is not a very exciting subject for many of today’s young people. Sixty years ago, both the aura of the railway and its practical use mattered to the public. Now, only the practical use of it matters for citizens and their governments. No one beams with excitement at the sight of a train anymore, much less a miniature of one. [:(]
Your post brought up another avenue for promoting the hobby whose diminishing ranks may be attributable to the railroad themselves in a less obvious manner. I cannot come up with an industry that is more connected and is more responsible for the physical growth and economic development of this country than the railroads. Outside of Union Pacific, I think the railroads themselves have done a huge disservice to themselves in not tooting this horn. If they did more younger people might be exposed to history, the evolution of transportation, it’s vital role and as a result, their political base may be grown in terms of public support, which of course, you want to provoke interest…so would a greater interest in the role of railroads add to the growth or even continuation of the hobby? I don’t know but it seems on the surface of things to make some sense.
IDM1991’ I agree with your statement of; “No one beams with excitement of a train anymore, much less a miniature one.” In another post I made, I mention, in my immediate area, that the railways have diminished their trackage, leaving R.O.Ws. up for grabs, also some of the local hobby shops have closed. I feel, these recent occurrences are mostly due to the economy, lack of interest in prototype railroading and lack of interest in model railroading. I also mention greed!!! Ralph
Rather than blame the present “world as we know it,” may I respectfully posit that it is the opportunity, responsibility and, yes, even the joy, of a parent to present, uncover, and then encourage a latent interest in a child. With such parental attention, each child will find a true passion for a fascinating something, whether it be big trains, model trains, playing the piano, riding a bike, swimming, collecting, et al. If that interest goes dormant for while (due to sports, college, marriage, children), it is guaranteed to return, to then foster the same interest in a new generation. (Just make sure that you don’t give away the “toys” in the meantime !)
There are a myriad of train-related things to do to get started with a child: visit a nearby railroad club or layout, go down and watch trains go by, give the child a train magazine subscription, watch train videos, mentor for youth to get a BSA merit badge, hang out and have lunch with Dad at a railroad station, troll the Internet for cool train layouts and gear. What used to be the LHS is now the Internet. Then, surprise the child with a starter train set around the Christmas tree or on a birthday.
Give a kid a little bit of your time, and a lifetime hobby will be born. All kids ought to be led to find their passion.
I cannot agree with you more. Right now my son and I are building a train layout at his home. He use to help me build mine, now I am helping build his. I am certain that he will also share the joy with his children when he has them.
The Little Engineer, Mickey Jr., already enjoys-“Choo-Choo.” Ralph