I posted this over on the Layouts and layout building forum this morning but didn’t get much of a response so far. I thought I’d just go ahead and try here, too…
Does anyone know of a quick and dirty method online for determining whether a motion decoder is dual mode or not. The most recently updated Digitrax decoder manual (as of 4/4) seems to lead you to believe that all of their decoders can detect DC or DCC on your track and adjust accordingly.
Under 3.10 Final Decoder Test (pg. 22), the Digitrax manual states the following:
Run your Digitrax decoder equipped locomotive on a regular DC track with the positive polarity connected to the right side wheels. The Digitrax decoder in the locomotive will recognize that it is not receiving DCC commands and automatically convert to analog mode.
Is this true for all Digitrax decoders? Is this a new development, or has it been in place for a while? Or, am I missing some crucial element here? I can’t seem to find anything that states that it is referring to a particular decoder.
I got on both the Digitrax and NCE web sites and couldn’t find anything definitive - either yes or no - apart from digging into each individual decoder manual. I also referred to my DH163L0 manual but wasn’t able to find anything that said it was either dual-mode or that it automatically detected DC or DCC on the track. Not even Tony’s Train Exchange’s Decoder Comparison Matrix has a column listing for that feature.
What I’m trying to do is to locate inexpensive 2-function dual-mode motion decoders for my club so that
I’m surprised you haven’t gotten any hits on this yet. I’ve got some tcs and one nce decoder and they all say they detect either type dc or dcc and run with either. The tcs’s do indeed detect and run quite well on either, haven’t done the nce decoder yet, that’s for my old hobbytown. I’ve got a soundtraxx dsd-100lc that says nope, it will not run on dc, but at least it says so. btw, I also bought a nce power cab a couple months ago, resultant somewhat on what I read by you, and others of course. I like it a lot, still amazed at the control it brings to the scene. Have a good day Sir!
Interesting… I am kinda scared to put my DCC equipped engines on a DC track… (gulp)… would love to hear from those who have experience with this. Like those above, I have (mostly)NCE and (a few) digitrax decoders.
I’m with you on this one. I’d like to find out something definitive first before I risk running my Proto 2000 0-8-0 with the Digitrax DH163L0 decoder in it.
If it didn’t work so well I might consider trying it. However, my 0-8-0 crawls unbelievably well with the DH163L0. So I’m not willing to chance a $25 decoder just to find out.
Gary,
I’m glad you’re happy with your Power Cab. [:)][tup]
All current Digitrax decoders are dual mode. All current NCE decoders are dual mode. All current TCS decoders are dual mode. QSI and Loksound decoders are dual mode.
All of these switch the dual mode autodetection on and off via CV29. So a decoder that does support autosensing of DC/DCC MIGHT have that feature disabled and thus NOT run on DC.
Many thanks as always, Randy, for your input and expertise. [:)]
Not wanting to split hairs. You use the operative word “current” to describe the which decoders from Digitrax, NCE, and TCS are dual-mode. Could you give a more definitive definition to the word “current”? Are we talking in the past year? 2 years?
In other words: How do I know that I don’t have an old decoder off the dusty back shelf somewhere that isn’t dual-mode? Thanks.
All the Digitrax decoders I have run into will detect DCC/DC and ‘change gears’ as required. The only decoders I have that will not are the Soundtraxx sound decoders I have in my Spectrum 2-8-0’s(they are DCC only). Maybe there are others, but the QSI decoders in my BLI and P2K engines will run on either DCC or DC.
The term ‘Dual Mode’ decoder was started by Atlas with their special Lenz decoders that had a jumper to make it DC only(the idea was to eliminate the high startup voltage in DC mode). Jumpering it in the DCC position allowed it to run on DC or DCC, IIRC…
Thanks, Jim. I was already aware of the QSI and LokSound decoders being able to run on either DC & DCC. My primary interest with this thread was to find a non-sound decoder that ran on DC & DCC.
So, for the most part, current decoders will “automatically” detect DC or DCC and adjust accordingly - i.e. if that feature is turned on or off in CV29? If so, are any decoders still manufactured today that require you to physically move a jumper on the decoder board to move from one mode to the other? Thanks.
Just to clarify, since I just looked it up under my NCE decoders, CV29, bit 2 determines analog operation or not (set to 1 enables…)… Thanks for everyone giving me this hint!
Well, by ‘current’ I mean all the ones they sell right now. For TCS, they’s all had Dc capability since the very first version of the T1. The current Digitrax decoders are all thier ‘Series 3’ which is basically everythign listed on their page plus earlier versions. That’s all the DH, DN, and DZ 123, 143, and 163 decoders. The version is the the last number, like DH163L0. The only versioned ones right now are the Kato and Atlas variations, mainly in N scale as they’ve had to slightly modify them for newer loco release - thus the DN163K1 and DN163K1a, etc. As for NCE, pretty much the same thing - every decoder listed on their web page right now supports DC operation. Not sure about Lenz and other lesser known ones like Kughn.
Since SoundTraxx was mentioned, and nobody included them in their answers, the Tsunami decoders do work on DC. (You have to set CV12 as well as CV29 to enable it).
I also have several of their other decoders, including DSD-150, DSX, and LC, none of which work on DC.
Sorry everybody, the post was only there a few minutes before I wrote " I’m surprised you haven’t gotten any hits on this yet." I misread and thought it was earlier. My apologies!
If you’re asking about analog conversion, current Digitrax 3-series decoders (Dxyz3 decoders such as your DH163L0) support analog conversion, as have at least the previous 2-series. I’m not certain, but I believe the 1-series and possibly even the 0-series did as well.
So the Digitrax decoder manual (and your DH163L0 instruction sheet) aren’t leading you astray. Virtually all the Digitrax decoders you’re likely to encounter support analog conversion. It certainly isn’t anything new at Digitrax.
Yes, analog conversion (or automatically detecting DC/DCC) is exactly what I’m talking about. I just wanted to make sure that I was reading things correctly from the manual. And, yes - that’s the kind of decoders that I’d want to purchase for any club members interested in trying out DCC.
I hadn’t realized that the majority of the decoders made nowadays did the analog conversion automatically. I had long been under the impression that there was only just a certain number of them (and the more expensive ones) that could do that. Well…you learn something new everyday…[:)]
As others have said, virtually most Decoders manufactured today support both DC and DCC. Having said that you should note also the following:
DC usage should be with a filtered DC type throttle - not pulse type - I’ve seen DCC equiped locos do some very strange things when pulse thottles are used. (NCE also recommends this in their documentation.)
If you run mainly on DCC set the analog DC bit off when running on DCC and set it on whenever you run on a DC layout - helps prevents runaways on powerups or shorts.