Didn’t they try something similar with the E&LS a few years ago, how did that work out?
I find this topic on subsidized log/pulpwood cars rather intriguing, as not only does CN have more than enough money to buy the cars themselves they actually loosened the purse strings a couple years ago and bought some. They are numbered in the DWC 200000 series and were ordered for drilling pipe service, but with the option of using them to haul logs/pulpwood too. With the downturn in oilfield activity one would think there is a surplus of those cars (and indeed other flatcars and gondolas) that could be used to fill this shortage.
Also those AC & Soo pulpwood gondolas and WC bulkheads are a common sight in Western Canada only they aren’t hauling pulpwood, rather scrap metal, new ties/spikes/other O.C.S. material, steel pipe/beams/rebar or logs in northern B.C. (despite the end of log trains on the Dease Lake line there is still a healthy log business in and out of the Prince George area). Almost seems like CN is playing the state for a fool to get some new cars on the cheap. I would hope that the state will retain ownership of the cars and lease them to CN so the taxpayers get at least some money back over time.
Wisconsin Central had a trailer ramp in the former Milwaukee Road yard in southwest Green Bay for many years.
However, it slowly dwindled and was finally closed.
That was before CN bought WC and the EJ&E.
At the same time, the Chippewa Falls ramp is not that far of a dray from the upper Wisconsin River valley for traffic heading west on CN, and Chicago is not all that far of a dray for traffic to other points.
One geographical reality is that Northern Wisconsin and Upper Michigan are really a big peninsula from a rail traffic standpoint, isolated by Lake Superior and Lake Michigan, bypassed by transcontinental mains to the north and then to the west-southwest.
Basically, everything to the east and north of the CN main line through Wisconsin is part of this de facto transportation peninsula. (Yes, CN does cross to Canada at Sault St Marie, but the traffic density is extremely light.)
Unlike the Florida peninsula, where the population density supports significant rail traffic on the FEC “container shuttle”, the population density for northern WI and Upper Michigan is also very light.
Green Bay, home of the 13-time NFL Champion Packers, had a population of just under 105,000 at the 2010 census. And that is the largest city in the region.
I am actually surprised that CN has not spun off everything to the east and north of their Wisconsin main line between Superior and Appleton to a Genessee & Wyoming or Watco type of operation.
That loading on the KCS looks awfully messy to me; that on the Southern is just like what I saw in the Southern in South Caroloina and on the AT&N in Alabama.
They are attempting segment by segment abandonments instead of spin off. Note that in Northwestern Wisconsin where the Frac Sand Boom is taking place, CN was attempting to sell a 45 mile line segment to Wisconsin and Northern but instead cancelled the sale once it learned how well financially Wisconsin and Northern was doing with just the new Sand Mining operations (very stupid, IMO as CN does not have the labor agreements to compete but fairly typical self-destructive rail competition).
Anyways it was the abandonment applications and taking the line segments out of operation that Wisconsin saw and stepped in with offers to attempt to assist CN’s marketing department lure more business to the NE Wisconsin lines and stop the line retrenchment. My view is that CN will abandon them regardless and is just trying to see how much money they can shake down Wisconsin for. There is no way when you look at the mileage of rail in the UP and Northern Wisconsin that Wisconsin will be able to preserve even 50% of it unless it has a Gold Rush of some type. CN has a line that runs the full length of the UP and then one that runs crosswise. There is nothing up there but forest and bears. Those lines would work well as a bridge line if Canada built a new major city West of Toronto (call it Metropolis) and placed that new city just above Wisconsin and Michigan. Thats not going to happen though.
I would guess that the Southern type pulpwood car would have to be loaded neatly with both side’s piles leaning toward one another so they don’t lose the load from those open-sided cars. The KCS cars have side risers to hold the logs good enough for mechanical loading. On the Southern you see a 4 man crew unloading that tiny truck and stacking the railcar. On the modern KCS type operation, an equipment operator with a double claw hook makes quick work of a mountain of logs too heavy for hand loading.
Well there is the remaining Tilden mine in the Marquette iron range on the line north from the Escanaba ore docks. The ex-C&NW line became isolated from their other lines when they sold the surrounding lines to the WC. The lines south of there would get all-rail winter moves. Speaking of gold mines, a failed gold mine processing mill was converted to a concentrator mill for a new nickel mine just north of the iron range. A couple of miles of rails-to-trails was re-railed to connect the mill back to the rail system. I believe the concentrate cars are headed to Sudbury, so the original Soo line across the UP would be the most direct line for that. Last I knew there were paper mills still at L’anse, Munising, Manistique, Escanaba, and Kingsford.
There is a link on one of the above links that shows all the online lumber gathering points as well as the paper mills. CN has almost an absolute monopoly on all of them. I think there is only one on E&LS.
What surprises me is that apparently CN won’t lease log cars from TTX (they are a member company, right?). TTX deals in log cars, reporting marks LTTX, which may be suitable for pulpwood business as well as actual logs (out in Oregon and Washington, I’ve seen plenty of these lately). If they’re suitable (a big “if”, I guess), CN could save a bit of money by going this route (or perhaps come up with a modification that would work).
A new-built log car would probably have no ends, no floor, and just U-shaped supports spaced properly for handling six-foot pulpwood logs.
The study done for the TIGER grant, that was cited by CMStPnP near the start of this thread, has a sentence that said no lease log cars were available. They gave no further explaination.
The map specified that the paper mills shown were pulp using mills. Some paper mills use recycled paper or are finishing mills. I think the way to tell pulp mills from non pulp mills is smell. The pulp mill sulfur smell will knock your socks off. I noticed the L’anse and Munising mills were not shown, and maybe others. There used to be a paper mill at the Ontonagin end of the E&LS, but that was closed 2010 or 11, and was leveled by Feb 2012. The Escanaba mill is on E&LS, but I think CN also has access.
Another thing to consider is changing technology. A paper mill near me used to have a mountain of pulpwood at their entrance. Over the years it has been replaced by a mountain of wood chips. As forest automation continues, new equipment nips trees at ground level, then continues gathering more trees in a vertical bundle, and then bringing them to a chipper, which blows thm into an enclosed truck. No further log handling. Will those new log rack cars become obsolete, in favor of wood chip cars?