I have 2 (maybe 3) Kato N scale SD45’s that I want to paint as NYS&W Yellow Jackets. The shells in GN (orange and green), C&NW, and EL. Just about everything I read about stripping Kato shells says to use Pine Sol. Very few citations mention anything about the time involved. One soul stated that “30 minutes to 2 hours” should do it.
The GN shell sat in Pine Sol all yesterday afternoon, all evening, all night, and all morning (close to 24 hours). Nada. The paint doesn’t look or act any different, and it doesn’t budge when I take a toothbrush to it (one retired from active service). I don’t understand if everyone swears by Pine Sol why it completely crapped out on me.
Any other ideas?
If isopropyl works on Kato shells, what concentration? 70%? 91%? 99%? (These are the only concentrations I’ve seen in the stores.)
Is Chameleon available?
I am considering a sand blaster, perhaps more aptly named a sand “polisher”, but at $200+, that will be a while. I had hoped to strip and paint before the next paycheck!
I’ve never seen 99% Isopropanol. 91% is supposed to be very useful. There is also a product you can find at Wal-Mart in the auto department called “CSC - Castrol Super Clean” that is a degreaser product. I’ve had some success with it.
It may be very poisonous, but it works, it’s what I use to strip my models, it works within minutes, I’d advise you to test it on an old model first incase it attacks that type of plastic. just make sure you wear gloves and a respirator, otherwise you can get real sick.
There was a discussion thread a few months ago about using DOT brake fluid. Pros - good for most plastics, but I think they said not for Katoplastics. I have used it for some time with few problems. Cons - It’s toxic but nowhere as bad as acetone, wear vinyl gloves - it penetrates latex, have good ventilation and eye protection, sometimes leaves a film - rinse well with water and detergent, disposal is an issue, you can’t just dump it down the drain (especially if you have a septic tank instead of municipal sewer).
I posted recently about my experiences with Kato and chemical strippers. I tried just about everything and none of them worked well, and some of them damaged the plastic. Kato plastic is very sensitive, it seems, and tends to become weak and crack when exposed to chemicals. For Kato I would recommend sandblasting with 220 grit aluminum oxide. I have a Badger sandblaster and it works great with no damage to the plastic. A brief recap: Pine Sol and brake fluid did nothing. Scalecoat paint remover attacked the Kato plastic (though it works well on other brands). Chameleon was ineffective and may have also softened the plastic, ditto for Polly Scale ELO.
This seems to be one of those threads that pop up from time to time asking the same thing. For most models the 90% alcohol will remove the paint with out any problems. Brake fluid, which is alcohol based, will do the same thing unless you get one of the newer silicone based fluids. Pine sol, Simple Green, Easy Off oven cleaner and others will work sometimes on some models. All of the above as well as the ones not mentioned will, acording to the results posted on theis forum as well as others, damage the kato shells. The grade of styrene Kato uses is different from what most other manufacturers use. (in case you are wondering, my plastics reference book lists over 400 different grades of styrene) The concensus on these forums is to use an abrasive blaster to remove the paint from kato shells. I have resorted to this for all of my paint removal jobs a I have access to a nice booth at work.
It is a bit frustrating but at least since 2003 a number of Kato locomotive owners have posted on this forum warning not to use 91% alcohol on Kato shells. I remember one person stating that he simultaneously soaked 3 shells and they warped. That was a very expensive experience.
Though I’m in HO I also run into paint stripping headaches as 91% alcohol, Brake Fluid, and Pine Sol don’t always do the job, depending upon the shell’s manufacturer. Be careful with brake fluid as some of today’s thinner plastic models become more brittle after a dip in it.
I’ve decided to go ahead and invest in a small sand/bead blaster. I used a sand/bead blaster years back when I worked in a transit company’s body shop. Great tool that works quickly in minutes, yet leaves a smooth surface without removing details (of course you have to be careful).
Pine Sol is THE ticket for older Rivarossi. It is the Only thing that touched that black paint. I have not found anything yet it did not work on. I don’t own any Kato. I would not even try acetone or laquer thinner on any plastic, because I have never seen one they would not attack. Note those two only come in metal containers. 91% alcohol may or may not work. I can never tell ahead of time. Testor’s Airbrush thinner just wiped some paints right off without damaging the plastic.
I would be careful to test anything on a small area first, because experiments can get expensive.
I tend to use 91% Isopropyl Alcohol / Isopropanol, since it’s the least expensive and is the least likely to damage plastics (except for Kato - more on that anon). If Isopropanol doesn’t work, I will try Pine-Sol or brake fluid, more often Pine-Sol, unless I know that one or the other will attack the plastic. I also use Polly S “Easy Lift Off” (ELO) for spot stripping, although I find it too expensive to use for whole shells.
When in doubt, I get out the abrasive gun and a box of baking soda. That always gets the paint off and doesn’t harm the plastic as long as I’m careful. [:)]
I don’t want to take over the thread, but what about Rivarossi plastics? I’m currently rebuilding a Rivarossi engine and need to remove the paint. Will 91% alchol damage Rivarossi’s plastics?
Or buy an undecorated shell. You take the chance of filling in those itsy-bitsy details on an N-scale piece…and I’ve custom painted quite a few engines in my time.
Household or automotive paint removers will probably destroy a plastic shell. You need to use something that attacks the paint but not the plastic - a tall order with some of the plastics that are used in models, especially Kato’s HO scale engines. The first time I tried to strip a painted model I used generic paint remover from the hardware store and it quickly turned an Athearn shell into a shapeless, sticky blob of plastic.
The advice to “buy an undecorated shell” is sound - if you can find one. I oftentimes buy a painted locomotive and strip it because I can’t get an undecorated version, or because the painted model cost substantially less. Undecorated Katos are especially hard to get, and sometimes fetch a higher price secondhand than painted models do. I recently purchased an undecorated RSC2 from which I only needed the drive. I offered the shell and detail pack on a Yahoo group and quickly sold them for more than 30% of the model’s original price.
Some educated advice on use of chemicals (I have a degree in Chemistry):
I am totally unable to believe that anyone is using acetone on any plastic models — Athearn BB or anybody else’s. Ketones dissolve plastics, plain and simple. Acetone is also very toxic, and very flammable.
Isopropyl alcohol will, as pointed out several times, not dissolve any plastics. I will add that is also relatively non-toxic ---- it is, after all, “rubbing alcohol” — but I would not recommend inhaling it all day.
I don’t recall anybody metioning mineral spirits paint thinner. I do not know if it is effective in removing paint from plastics as I have never tried it for this purpose. I do believe this is the stuff that Floquil is using as the solvent for its solvent based paints these days (They used to use xylene whch they marketed under the trade name “dio sol,” and I will tell you one of the biggest favors they ever did to the modeling community was to discontinue dio sol. It was not only very toxic and very flammable, but being a benzene-ring aromatic it was also carcinogenic!). Mineral spirits is cheap and commonly available, sold in gallons at any paint dealer. By the way, there’s nothing better for cleaning your brushes and spray equipment!!
Having never studied the ingredients of Pine-Sol and brake fluid so I can’t coment on those. I have seen comments on various forum posts claiming that either of those will attack some manufacturers’ plastics but not others’.
The first thing I tried was Westley’s Bleche White, a whitewall tire cleaner. It is basic (non-acid) like lye or oven cleaner. You can tell by the way your fingers feel soapy after exposure.
Tyco - 100% removal, no plastic damage
Athearn - 99% removal, no plastic damage
Walthers - 100% removal, no plastic damage
Life-Like - 100% removal on white paint, lettering removal only on orange. No plastic damage.
Bachmann - Lettering removal only on orange, no plastic damage.
Bowser - Softened paint, difficult removal with toothbrush. No plastic damage.
All of these where soaked for 24 to ~ 100 hours.
Because the orange was so stubborn, I tried a 2 parts Pine-Sol/1 part water solution. Aware of warnings I started with the LL car because it wasn’t a real prototype, and set a timer for one hour. At that time the orange paint came off pretty well with toothbrush scrubbing, but the plastic had softened such that I was leaving fingerprints. . . End of Test.
I read that Wash Away works well on Bowser because Bowser uses Scalecoat paints, but have not tried it.
I would try the Bleche White first as it seems to be pretty effective but also pretty benign.
