Quentin,to the best of my knowledge you would be very correct.
The first three as you stated,and a “head end” and “rear end” brakeman.
They didn’t have any facilities at all. If you had to go, you went over to the side and hopped the wind was blowing in your favor…
FRA just had an edict out that the road locomotives had to have lavatory and potty facilities on the new(er) locomotives and yard facilities had to have the same for the older units built in the yards … (no more running over to Mickey D’s to give back with interest or to the corner gas station)…
http://www.epa.gov/fedrgstr/EPA-IMPACT/2001/January/Day-02/i33363.htm
TITLE 49–TRANSPORTATION
CHAPTER II–FEDERAL RAILROAD ADMINISTRATION, DEPARTMENT OF
TRANSPORTATION
PART 229_RAILROAD LOCOMOTIVE SAFETY STANDARDS–Table of Contents
Subpart C_Safety Requirements
Sec. 229.139 Sanitation, servicing requirements.
(a) The sanitation compartment of each lead locomotive in use shall
be sanitary.
(b) All components required by Sec. 229.137(a) for the lead
locomotive in use shall be present consistent with the requirements of
this part, and shall operate as intended such that:
(1) All mechanical systems shall function;
(2) Water shall be present in sufficient quantity to permit
flushing;
(3) For those systems that utilize chemicals for treatment, the
chemical (chlorine or other comparable oxidizing agent) used to treat
waste must be present; and
(4) No blockage is present that prevents waste from evacuating the
bowl.
(c) The sanitation compartment of each occupied locomotive used in
switching service pursuant to Sec. 229.137(b)(1)(ii), in transfer
service pursuant to Sec. 229.137(b)(1)(iii), or in a trailing position
when the locomotive is occupied, shall be sanitary.
(d) Where the railroad uses a locomotive pursuant to Sec.
229.137(e) in switching or transfer service with a defective toilet
facility, such use shall not exceed 10 calendar days from the date on
which the defective toilet facility be
Or the “Two loaded Crews” with one non-working toilet thread.
Kurt.
…Yes, Walt…that’s the way I remember it was early on…Of course this thought goes back a ways to include the “Fireman” and a place to house some of the others…the caboose.
I seem to recall an article in Trains a few years ago written by a guy who used to be a yard manager (if I remember correctly) for CSXT somewhere in the Detroit area. In the article, a crew was about to refuse to use a locomotive because the toilet was so bad. It seems like after soaking the cab and toilet area with Lysol and giving the crew another can, they went ahead and took the locomotive.
TITLE 49–TRANSPORTATION
CHAPTER II–FEDERAL RAILROAD ADMINISTRATION, DEPARTMENT OF
TRANSPORTATION
PART 229_RAILROAD LOCOMOTIVE SAFETY STANDARDS–Table of Contents
Subpart C_Safety Requirements
Sec. 229.139 Sanitation, servicing requirements.
The following regulations shall printed on the same paper stock used by the Sears catalog and hung by a string in easy reach of the sanitary facility.
WRONG!!! The coal scoop was a multipurpose tool.
Didn’t some of the roads (especially the midwestern ones) mandate keeping
“corn cobs” in the locomotive cab ??
I believe there were no steam locomotives in North America equipped with any kind of toilet whatsoever. Generally engineers and firemen used the facilities before boarding and after completing their runs and at station stops or yards in between. In an absolute panic situation, the train would come to a halt and the “behind the bushes” stratergy was used.
Special large “drover” cabooses were used on western stock trains where "drovers’ who were aboard to water and feed the animals slept on bunks in the caboose. These continued in operation until well after WWII.
On steam engines you pee in coal pile and you*** on a shovel and trow it in the fire.
No worse than running as a OTR driver. Sometimes the only bathroom nearby is the side of the road.
At least when a “full-crew” law isn’t involved. They varied from state to state. Indiana’s law required an additional brakeman (total of six crew) when a freight train exceeded 70 cars.
I imagine most modern locomotives do have toilets in them. I remember a few years ago conrail was doing tours of one of their locomotives a GP-15-1 in Latrobe and the engineer showed me the bathroom in the nose of the loco. I also watched something on PCN tours the other day and they were doing a tour of the Erie GE locomotive plant and in the cab there was not only a toilet but also a small refrigerator for the crews food.
Never heard anything about bunks though.
Actually, it was more than 69 cars in Indiana that required a third brakeman, law was changed in 1972. New York also had a full crew law that mandated a third brakeman, not sure about the car count, and I’m thinking that Arkansas did.
The last full crews I can remember working with ever (engineer, fireman, two brakemen, and a conductor) was probably about 1987, possibly 1988. The reduced crews of conductor and engineer came in existence in the early winter, about December, 1991.
at the sacromento railfair there was a dash 9 and i was young so i might remeber it badly
but i remeber like a bunk and like a light and then a toliet and i was probly ‘dee dee dee’ but i remeber a microwave but i do know that some locos have a refrigerator
We were watching a film of a steam locomotive crew cracking eggs and putting bacon on the coal shovel, and cooking their breakfast on it in the firebox.
If cooking on a coal shovel isn’t bad enough a thought, one of my buddies watching the film mentioned he remembered crews using the shovel for toilet purposes, and tossing it into the fire.
yuk! I was riding my territory in an un-airconditioned locomotive when I was directed to the toilet in the hole in front of the unit. Being female, going outside to the rail wasn’t an option. The worst part…flushing it and watching this black goo come up to the rim.
Cooking on the shovel was pretty common over here too - thing is, the firebox would be more than hot enough to sterilise it, so if you scoured off the coal dust and put it in the fire for a few minutes it’d be perfectly safe. I think toilet facilities involved waiting for the next station stop here!
Even assuming that the shovel really did get sterilized I’d imagine that whatever you cook on there would still taste like you cooked it in an ashtray. Plus wouldn’t eating off rusty metal result in ptoemaine poisoning?