HO Loco Opinions Wanted

Model Railroader General Discussion (Model Railroader)
1

I’m slowly building my roster of HO Locos. So far have 2 Kato locos that I’ve added DCC/sound to, and I’m very happy with them, but have considered [because of available NS models] Athearn as an option. I heard too much negative commentary on Intermountain, so I’m not going there.

I like the quality of the Kato products and have them in both N and HO Scale. Does the Athearn RTR and Genesis line measure up in quality and detail level? I’ve considered the RTR models as I can get, for example, a Dash9 with Tsunmai decoder and Bass Speaker for about $175. If I go to the Genesis line, that price jumps $50 for a SD70-M2 [both acceptable for modern HO running].

Suggest away, and thanks in advance!

Dan

2

Wow, if you want loco opinions, you sure came to the right place!

In general, you get what you pay for. But, some are more value than others and all will have a problem child sooner or later. Personally, Stewart/Bowser, BLI, P2K, Atlas/Kato are my favorites. I have no experience with the new Athearn, MTH, or Intermountain however. It sounds like you are looking for modern era diesels, so I would first find what would work for your collection and then ask for advice here.

3

Athearn Genesis are good. But they still don’t have LEDs in them.

Intermountain and MTH are my favorites. I have several ES44ACs and SD70Aces. Great runners, smooth as silk and sounds great.

4

I don’t understand why you don’t like Intermountain, because they are some of the best offered, especially if you get them with factory installed sound. I have heard that Intermountain actually opens and test runs every model before it is shipped.

I’m not sure if it’s just the luck of the draw, but two of our club members have had nothing but lemons from Athearn Genesis recently, and one of them just sent back a BLI Paragon2 Cab Forward that was miswired at the factory.

I have two recent Athearn Genesis GP9 models, both with Tsunami sound factory installed. The Southern Pacific Black Widow version has horrible sound that cannot be corrected, but the Illinois Central one sounds very good. I think the SP version, which was an earlier release, has a poorly designed speaker installation.

Kato models are the smoothest running of any currently on the market that I have had experience with, but adding sound is practically impossible. If you want sound, get the Kato Kobo with factory LokSound instead of trying to add your own.

5

Hi Cacole,

Thanks for your input!

I’ve only heard of bad press about Intermountain recently with the release of the NS Heritage units. Many of the guys I know said that they rec’d damaged units or units missing parts. Other than that, my only interaction with them was for 3 boxcar kits I bought that had missing parts, and it took at least 4 emails and 6 months for them to replace them. All in all, not a big deal, but that 's it.

Nice to know from everyone about the Athearn units. As for decoder installations, I’ve done frame milling and other mods to get good sound results, and I see the install as part of the enjoyment I get from the Hobby. The N scale sound installs can be a hassle thought…lol

I wish Kato would come out with some Dash9s or SD70-M2s in NS herald. The road I’m working toward is an NS Segment, but interchanges with the CN and two regionals, so I can find locos I need for those roads from Kato in their paint of undec models I pain t and decal myself.

Thanks again all!

6

from a performance standpoint, and i am referring to pulling power and smoothness, my HO scale kato rs-2 and nw-2 locos put everything else to shame. possible exception is the early atlas geeps but i think they have kato drives…

charlie

7

All to sadly Athearn RTR and their Genesis line is hit and miss in QC department…Last RTR car I bought had 3 of the four stirrups laying in the car’s tray.

Here’s another thought Atlas and Atlas Trainman are top of the line.

Don’t overlook the older Life Like P2K locomotives and the older Atlas yellow and red box locomotives.Decoders can be added to these engines.

8

Athearn Genesis quality is, sadly, hit and miss. Some engines look great and some have paint issues, excess glue issues, and handrail issues (warped, crooked, broken but in the box, or they just plain fall off).

When you find a good one, you have a great engine indeed.

But for me, the Proto engines run better–at least if you compare F units to F units.

Atlas engines are exceptionally smooth runners and while not having all the detail of Athearn Genesis, are among the best you can buy.

There’s nothing wrong with the Intermountain modern diesel units. Some may take a slightly higher voltage to start, but their quality is more consistent than Athearn Genesis. Their parts support is also very good. Likewise MTH is generally speaking more consistent in quality than Athearn Genesis.

If you have to have all the most correct road specific detailing even for unique engines of a given roadname, Genesis is the way to go, but to run on a layout day after day–the others at least offer illuminated numberboards, may outpull the Genesis, and may run quieter (for the no sound versions). Athearn uses totally crappy lightbulbs that don’t last very long, may be glued in and can be difficult to remove and simply replace–and they’ve never gotten the memo about illuminated numberboards–which most everyone else is now providing.

All the manufacturers offerings have their place and their target market. I don’t like that BLI now forces you to buy the version with sound and DCC already installed, but they make a good engine–and for those like myself who have to have E units, they are good engines.

Even the–gasp–Bachmann engines can be very good for some people. They offer excellent bang for the buck and so far as I’ve seen run very well (I’ve owned the latest small steamers they did new from the ground up).

John

9

Keep in mind that a lot of this is personal preference and mere opinions (and we know what opinions are like…[:-^]). I own multiple copies of Athearn and Intermountain locomotives and both are good. But when it comes to SD7OACe’s, I personally like the Athearn Genesis SD70ACe’s over the Intermountain. The detail is phenomenal to the point that many criticize them for being too fine and hence delicate. I also think that the Athearn ACe’s are more accurate, but again, many Intermountain fans will argue that (see my opening sentence…[;)]). I have never had a problem with details breaking on the Athearn locomotives myself. You just need to be careful is all. Sure Athearn had QC with their early SD70’s, but I have had zero issues with the last half dozen or so Genesis locomotives that I have bought over the years (and Intermountain is not without it’s own issues in that department anyways). Again, individual perspectives will vary.

Another option, since you have expressed an interest in Norfolk Southern, is the new Bachmann HO NS Heritage schemes due out this fall. They come DCC & Sound equipped in 10 different heritage schemes. That Lehigh Valley scheme looks sweet!

Happy Modeling!

Don.

10

Hi Charlie,

I’d agree with your comments re: Kato quality/pulling power. In a recent ops session, my SD40-2 Kato pulled 35 cars up a 2% grade without a hitch.

Dan

11

Don,You should know by now I’m the last person to complain about any manufacturer but,I’m not going to cover up Athearn’s poor QC problems-there is no reason under the sun that 3 of 4 stirrups be laying in the car’s tray-brand new $24.95 car.There no reason for wavy handrails and glue spots-this problem persist on the newer models.

It saddens me to speak of Athearn in such manner. I been a long time customer and will more then likely keep rolling the QC dice and hope I don’t crap out like the last three cars-2 have one stirrup laying the the tray-easy fix and a automatic glue on future cars.

Athearn did replace the handrails.

12

I keep giving Athearn chance after chance–I keep buying their engines–and have owned many. It saddens me to post on topics such as this…

I try them out, but ultimately am frustrated by the lack of quality control, and then end up selling them.

Even now, I want to pre-order a (just announced) SCL F-9, but am conflicted, thinking it might be better for me to find a Proto 2000 SCL E unit instead, given past problems I have experienced with Athearn F units. Even recent purchases such as the WP orange and silver FP-7’s had their issues…so I sold mine.

13

I own all of them and I like all of them.

14

If you can do your own work, then Kato is the way to go. I have 8 or more NW2 and they all run great.

15

I believe that all Athearn locos, no matter what the price, still don’t have LED lights… and the incandescent bulbs they use supposedly burn out rather quickly.

A 200-250 dollar loco that I’m paying for someone to design neat-o lighting functions into the software goes for naught if the 1950’s technology bulbs burnout in a month.

I won’t buy an Athearn locomotive until they change the lighting to LED’s…without adding to theMSRP since the locos are already comparably priced to their LED installed competition.

16

And it looks like the little light bulbs are way off kilter. Wouldn’t be a problem if they back lit a light bezel with LED’s…like every other producer.

17

I will make my standard comment here, first it all depends on what prototypes you are looking for - Diesel? newer or older? Steam? etc.

I cannot comment on ANY brand of modern, or semi modern diesel, since I restrict all my purchases to models of prototypes built before 1954.

But, when it comes to EMD F units, which I have lot of, Genesis and Intermountain are the best by far in my book. The new Proto F units are fine, but I don’t really care for the slower gearing, it just was not necessary. And the undecorated version of the Proto F unit is a modernized version - out side my time period so its of no use to me. Those other two brands have good undecorated options.

I do have a large fleet of other Proto diesels, GP’s, PA’s, FA’s, SD’s, BL2’s, S1’s, and a few of the F units - all great runner and great looking.

Other than Genesis F units, the only modern production Athearn locos I have are the RS units, and despite the experiances of others, my three are just fine.

I am always amussed by those who say stuff like “I only buy KATO and ATLAS” well they do make nice stuff, but they don’t even come close to offering all the prototypes I want - maybe others can settle for only buying or “collecting” what a few companies choose to make, but I am building a model railroad, and I need a roster that makes the needed representation of a real working railroad.

In my experiance, some 44 years of now in HO, every company has winners and dogs, judging by the “brand” is seldom a good idea.

As for Bachmann, their newer diesels run very well, even if the detail levels are not exactly “high end”. Their steam on the other hand is mostly some of the best values in HO today - with a few pieces that do have some weak points, but generally a lot more loco for a lot less money than most of the other players in the steam market.

BLI diesels have disappointed me at nearly every turn, they all seem poor

18

[quote user=“Doughless”]

And it looks like the little light bulbs are way off kilter. Wouldn’t be a problem if they back lit a light bezel with LED’s…like every other producer.

19

I am a modern diesel modeler. I own or have owned almost all of the major manufacturers. Here’s my take on them:

Atlas incl trainman: smooth running, like a Swiss watch. Not a big fan of their factory installed QSI sound. Never had a reason to contact customer service.

Bli: very smooth drive. The paragon 2 sound is quite good but limited. But I can’t see how you’d ask for more. I own two of them (sd40-2 & ac6000cw) both are superb runners. Cs is ok.

Athearn rtr & genesis: like the others have said, hit or miss. Qc got bad there about 3 years ago but has since improved. I like LEDs, and there is next to zero chance they will put them in their locos (I talked directly to an Athearn rep at the ATL NMRA). They are nice locos overall. Good cs.

Intermountain: I love these locos. I have several copies of various es44ac/dcs. LEDs, nice detail, good sound, smooth drive. Their cs is outstanding and extremely responsive.

Kato: they are Swiss watches. I’ve never owed a factory installed model. All mine are custom factory installs. When I do a custom project, I usu try to do it w a Kato. Never contacted cs.

Mth: talk about hit or miss…they’re Dcc ready sd70aces had motor shorting issues. I had one. They eventually got it sorted out, but it often took several weeks for someone at mth to return an email or phone call.

Hope this helps,

pbrad

20

Don,That’s the “supped up” bb SW1500-those are still used today.

The drive is smooth as silk and no complaints there. Just the wavy handrails that got pass QC and the headlights.

On the other hand my 10 RTR GP38-2 and 12 GP40-2 has no issues. One of my GP60Ms had glue spots and a small nick on the long hood but, both are smooth runners. All of my CF7s are great little engines with no issues but, they’re kinda light in the pulling department but, so was the prototype.