It’s well beyond the idea stage:
http://fleetowner.com/news/topstory/indiana_toll_road_lease_013006/
Part of that,is so Indiana can get “Funding” for the two new Ohio river
bridges between Louisville Ky. and Southern In. (that we’ve needed for “umpteen”
years,and they’ve spent the federal money elsewhere.)
That is a pretty hot topic for Hoosiers right now. It gets attention even on the juvenile radio stations. I don’t know how I feel about it, but if it helps get the state out of debt, it can’t be all bad.
Gabe
The toll roads here (with the highest toll/mile in the country) are now under attack by the trucking lobby (duh…) and moves are afoot to make future toll roads unviable as an option. There is a smarter way to get the highway departments out of debt, but the truckers (who do the main damage to the roadways) are not willing to pay for it.
THeyr’e Still Hashing It Out Here In Texas.Thanks To Soon to be Disgraced Congressman Tom "What Money?"DeLay and Governor Rick"How Many Aggies Can Fit In Tom DeLay’s Pocket?"Perry!!
It really does sound okay,so long as we can get the two “new” bridges built.
It would seem that for this day and age; the “Kennedy” & “Sherman Minton”
bridges are approaching “retirement” age.
At least all the railroad bridges are still in very good shape.(even if there is a
barge lodged against one of them.)
To Quote From Led Zepplin’s “Stairway to Heaven”-‘It Makes Me Wonder’.If It Was A Japanese Company Wanting To Build It,You’d Have People Raising Nine Kinds of Hell and Sticking A Chunk Under It!!But If It’s A Spanish-Austrian Company Building It,You Rarely Hear A Peep Out Of The Citizenry!!Go Figger!!
…I have questions about it…There is a certain amount of money earned from the traffic on the Toll Road…Ok, that’s a certain value…We…{the state of Indiana}, have that income…and now our Governor is attempting to “lease” the road to another party and they are going to pay us up front 3.8 billion dollars and we will take that money and do road work in this state that is way behind schedule. All that sounds great…But, the income from the road remains the same…{unless the 3rd party expects to throw a tremendous rate increase on it} So it simply sounds to me of just inserting a 3rd party into the formula {and of course they expect to make big bucks}…so where is all this extra “profit” coming from that they can offer us {Indiana}, the 3.8 billion…?? If that big profit is there now…why don’t we just use it to pay off construction bonds and do the building we say we need…?? And leasing the highway for 75 years…to a foreign outfit…?? Just a bit scary.
The Chicago Skyway was sold some years ago and one suburban state representative is now proposing the sale of the entire northern Illinois tollway system. Unfortunately for drivers, the owners of the Skyway have decided to do major repairs this summer at the same time as major reconstruction on the southern part of the Dan Ryan. The Metra-IC commuter trains will likely gain a lot of riders.
Privatization of major highways would certainly do much to level the playing field on the issue of highways vs. railroads. Here is a question. Was the Inidana Toll Road built and maintained just by funds raised by the state of Indiana? If Federal funds were involved, I would think that an appropriate share of the proceeds of the sale should have to go to the U.S. Treasury.
The only other thought that I have relates to the question whether the government requirements for maintenance that might be attached to the sale contract will be effective over the long term. It should be born in mind that the private owner is making the purchase to make a profit and not just for the fun of owning a nice strip of concrete. Do the issues of non-competitive pricing come up? So what if tolls go to a level that causes too many drivers to choose to use highways owned and maintained with public tax dollars?
The State of Wisconsin has “privatized” many functions previously done by the state bureaucracy, with the idea being that the private sector would be more efficient. Nursing care for the disabled without personal funds is one example. The private contractor is paid by the state to provide such care for the patients who are unable to provide funds for on their own. When one of the nurses gave me a $110,000 Form 1099 for the payment she received from the state, I had to wonder.
Be careful what you wish for.
Jay
I would be really leery of privatizing the toll road. In northern Va we have a hybrid - state toll road from beltway to Dulles Airport and private toll from airport to Leesburg. They are both 14 miles long. The state one costs $1.25 and the private one costs $3.20 weekdays/$3.00 weekends for the full length. Cheapest less than full length trips are $.50 and $1.55.
The state one was supposed to be toll only until it was paid for, but it’s such a cash cow the state won’t turn it off. At least the money is in the state coffers. The private one is just a ripoff for users.
Enjoy
Paul
I travel the Indiana Toll Road and the Chicago Skyway just about daily. Rates increased on the Skyway and will on the ITR, if this occurs.
I have mixed feelings on the subject. Not so sure I want to be selling our infrastructure to others. However, I am a free market guy, so this is a real test for me! But, what is next…privatization of the military?
What I had heard was the big motivation for this sale was the construction of the Indianapolis - Evansville interstate. The sale of the ITR would allow financing for that road. I guess that means that highway would then be a toll road and we would sell it off. Why not just allow a private company to come in and build the road?
Regarding truck tolls and the age old “they dont pay their fair share”, be careful what you wish for…trucking companies dont pay tolls, the ultimate consumer of the products do, it is just a pass along in the overall scheme of things.
ed
Most long-distance toll roads (and toll bridges and tunnels) predate the 90-10 split of federal-state highway funding. Since federal funds were not available, bonds were necessary to fund construction and tolls were necessary to pay off the debt and maintain the roads. In Illinois and possibly other states, the toll roads are separate from the state highway system so maintenance and improvements have to come out of toll income.
…Yes, the Pennsylvania Turnpike that was opened in Oct. 1940…{first 160 miles}, was built by Pennsylvania Turnpike Commision…Of course it was then folded into the Interstate system but I believe it’s still operated by the PTC. Original Bonds were paid off by tolls and paid off ahead of schedule…Of course tolls are still charged for maintenance and rebuilding and updating. It is built through some rugged territory and winter weather takes it’s toll {no pun intended}. In recent years a third lane has been added in the mountainous sections and some other areas and of course that required a large amount of cash inflow…Sure has improved it too…
As opposed to Ronny “I’ll Indict a Ham Sandwich If It is to the Right of Fidel Castro” Earle?
Remember, it took a dozen tries before Ronny E could find a grand (sic) jury with enough Dems on it to finally rig-stick the indictment. Clearly, Ronny Earles needs to spend some quality time in federal prison for bastadizing the judicial system.
DeLay will be exonerated soon.
As for Perry, remember that the whole Texas rail plan is his pet project. He’s clearly years ahead of any Dems out there regarding open access.
Actually, the idea of toll roads for new highway corridors makes great sense, as long as those new highway corridors actually provide significant mileage savings for drivers over current options.
That’s a far cry from privatizing Interstate Highways, given that they are funded partly by federal user fees and partly State user fees, given that the current user fee system is adaquate for maintaining these roads. If only we could keep certain fringe elements from siphoning off Highway Trust Funds for things like transit, we could more than keep up with the maintenance demands for the current system. But if we have to both maintain current highways while concurrently trying to fund new (and of course artificially expensive) highways, then the Highway Trust Fund gets stretched pretty thin.
We’d be better off equalizing the US rail network to match the characteristics of the rest of the worlds transportation modes, rather than trying to convert our open access highways/waterways/airports/pipelines/transmission lines into (or back to) the proprietary closed access model.
It’s alot easier to push a rat through a foxhole than it is to push a fox through a rathole.
As an Aggie, I think this is pretty funny . I assume that Aztec is in Texas, with an eye on the local situation, as opposed to the Pacific NW.
I’m really getting a very good “chuckle” out of reading this “Thread”.
Even though this “Thread” is not totally about the Louisville-southern Indiana
bridge problem;maybe we should start a “New” railcar ferry line across the river here !!!
TO “HECK” with the motorist’s who drive their big vehicles between states !!!
Let them eat cake,or something else !!