i thought i’d get around to photographing more 7" Marx, but couldn’t track down the B&O set so that’ll be another day. i did want to wrap up the Monon and KCS sub-thread so here are those 7" vans.
#3855 - 7" Monon caboose
both came as only 4-wheel versions and i’ve never seen anything but the plastic knuckle coupler on the Monon caboose which only came as #3855 …
#966 - 7" Kansas City Southern caboose
…but there were 15 different numbers for the KCS version; 966 through 980. this is an error that has been in the Greenberg Price Guides forever; stating the lowest number in the series to be #969. it also puts this model in line with the similar B&O and NYC versions which both also had 15 numbers. the plastic knuckle coupler seems to be more common on the KCS caboose, but i have seen at least one example with a tab coupler.
I love the disney set photos, The cars & Loco look like the ones in my 7" Nickel Plate Road Set,
I’d love to post some photos of it but I do not have any luck keeping my photos in the free photo bucket type accounts (they always seem to dissapear) and I stink at .html code, would anyone like me to email them photos of my Marx set to post on here, is there an easy way to post photos here?
By the way If anyone is interested in a set there has been a guy at the Allentown PA train meet with one of those Disney Sets for that last 3 years, It must be priced high or does not appeal to the highrail crowd arround here. Next show is in November and the vendor is usually near the middle of the big room near the snack bar, any one know who that might be?
the 994 Meteor locomotive in your set is essentially the same shell used for the Disney model, but various modifications occurred over the years. the 0-4-0 drive was the same as any other Marx loco, but dummy wheels were added to the embossed frame to visually help stretch out the small motor. the 994 came as both electric and clockwork versions. the red painted shell is less common and when coupled to the red Nickel Plate Tender, it becomes one of the most sought after combinations.
Marx #994 locomotive
pictured above is what might be called the deluxe version. most notably, the number ‘994’ actually appears under the cab windows which is rare. other items that may or may not have appeared were the headlight, headlight hood and handrails. also note that this version has separate pieces for the domes whereas the Disney model and some later 994’s had the domes pressed into the boiler shell itself.
Marx 994 - 898 comparison
but the whole point of the 994 was size. here it is alongside a companion Marx loco, the (898). at 10¼" coupled to the extra length of a 7" tender, it essentially did its job in that Unique Arts went out of the O gauge train business the following year. by the early 1950’s that new-fangled material called plastic was coming into use, however, and the late-comer, sheet metal #994 only saw a few years of production.
Another example of the 994, this one a reversing clockwork:
Again, note that the drivers and motor sideplates are black instead of plated, typical of postwar Marx. Also, note the brake/reverse lever has the tell-tale bend that lets us know at a glance it is a reversing windup motor. As Gary pointed out in his previous post, this version has the domes pressed in as part of the body, as opposed to the seperate domes on the deluxe version.
I don’t collect 7" tin; but I did want to have a couple of pieces for my 994 to pull around the layout:
Nothing rare; just a Wabash gondola and Nickel Plate caboose with Slot & Tab couplers. It sure does make a nice looking train on the layout, and the reversing clockwork motor can be fun, too!
In case you missed it, here is my portable Marx windup layout with 6" tinplate cars.
I have found the simple joy in playing with old windup Marx trains. Like many of us who have windup trains, we end up operating them on our electric train layouts. But wouldn’t it be great to have a small dedicated windup layout complete with mechanical windup accessories. I don’t have room for another layout and windup trains are enjoyed as an occasional diversion for short periods of time, so I came up with the perfect solution to my problem…a portable case that will easily folds out into a layout on any small table (or on the floor) and will store all the trains and layout accessories. And it can all be compactly stored away when finished. Although I am not finished with the layout, here are photos and video of the basic idea.
We’ve moved on to 7 inch I see! Not much to cover here. Since there were only 4 different freight cars, and a handful of cabooses, there isn’t much to collect. However, there is quite a few different numbers for car, allowing a “variation nut” to literally go nuts buying them all.
As soon as I find where I misplaced my camera, I will post pictures of my lone 7 inch set.
since James contributed the clockwork version of the 1950’s Meteor locomotive, it might be worth mentioning that, when running wind-ups for the public, i generally get the idea most people think that when electric motors came into existence, clockworks went out the door. but they are usually surprised to hear that clockwork sets persisted into the early 1970’s, and even then it actually took an act of congress with the Consumer Product Safety Act (1972) to put an end to yet another traditional childhood pastime.
it was never a matter of technology, but of cost. without a third rail, a transformer (a big chunk of iron then, not like the modern switching supplies of today), and having a less expensive motor; clockwork sets were typically less than half the cost of a similar electric set. of course, as collectables these days, condition far outweighs the original sticker price and just off the top of my head i can think of more clockwork than electrics that are likely near the top of most Marxist’s wish lists.
one of those which i was extremely lucky to find at a bargain price, was not even a Marx product. in 1927, The Girard Model Works of Girard, PA started making toy floor trains (later including a small circle of track) selling them over the counter at department stores. in 1928, Louis Marx, already a giant in the toy industry, started selling Girard’s ‘The Joy Line’ trains on commission. it was this relationship with the company concluding in the outright purchase of a depression-hit Model Works in 1934 that usually blurs the line of where collecting Marx really starts. there were surely pieces that were out of production by 1934, but quite a bit of leftover Joy Line stock was sold by
i sure hope people feel free to jump anywhere into the ~50 years of Marx history with trains or even backtrack to cover anything interesting. no editors other than yourself in forums, …yay(?)
speaking of which, i corrected a few ambiguities in the Joy Line post. the only thing about this forum that bothers me is the inability to actually upload a picture. if Comcast decides to pull the same stunt that Cox did and remove user web space, everything i’ve posted to date will go poof.
…and to go along with Gary’s comment about jumping in anywhere in Marx history, I thought it would be fun to contrast his excellent Joy Line post with the opposite end of the Marx timeline. As Gary mentioned, Marx sold clockwork trains into the 1970’s… I received a 526 set for Christmas, 1972:
To be fair, this is NOT the actual set I received in 1972. I still have my original train - and it runs like a champ - but I played with it very, very hard and it shows it. So, I bought this much nicer set that is still in the original box with key, instruction sheet and packing slip just for nostalgia! As a side note, the price tag is still on the box - it retailed for $4.95.
The clockwork locomotive in the last years of Marx was the not-so-pretty 401. Like most of Marx, there are variations to be collected, and I have yet to get them all. This is the run of the mill black windup:
It is not unusual to find these with various parts broken from the bodies… the cab roofs and pilots were especially prone to breakage when dropped.
Besides the basic black 401 windup, there are gray 401 windups, too:
It may be a bit difficult to see the difference in color from the pictures, but it is readily apparent when they are side-by-side.
In additon to the regular windup 401’s that just featured a motor with a bell, there is also a rare version of the 401 that has the “Mother’s Nightmare” mechanical puffer bulb - the windup motor has a flap that pumps a rubber bulb attached inside the shell to the smokestack. It would puff baking soda out the stack as it ran, making a nice mess for mom to clean up! I don’t have an ex
I wouldn’t say that the CPSA of 1972 actually put an end to wind-up trains; rather, it put an end to selling Marx’s version of the wind-up train set such as my 526. It is my understanding (from secondhand info, not primary research) that in particular, the 6" tin did not meet the new safety requirements, perhaps due to the somewhat sharp corners, wheelsets that were easy to remove and the resulting loose wire axle that could be easily swallowed by a child. Obviously, exposed gearing on the underside of the older 401’s would not be allowed, either. Perhaps the Marx removeable key was a safety problem, too. At any rate, Marx did not survive as Marx for very many years after 1972 anyway. Louis Marx was getting up in years, and sold the company in the mid-1970’s. However, other windup toys continued to be around after 1972, so I don’t think we can say that the act put an end to windup trains - rather, the Marx tinplate trainset, remarkably similar to what was available in the 1930’s, would not meet the new requirements and so it ceased to be sold. Marx had been producing a line of plastic cars for many years already, and these continued to be sold after 1972 - I’m pretty sure that I received my Meteor battery operated Marx train set (with plastic cars) in 1974, very close to the end of Marx.
At least that is my limited understanding of the issue, and would gladly welcome input from those more knowledgeable of the Act’s impact on Marx trains. I’m always ready to learn something new!
i’ve read through CFR Part 1500.18 - “Banned toys and other banned articles intended for use by children”, and while there is no specific paragraph pointing a finger at Marx clockwork motors, there is enough there (spinning, sharp edges, easily dislodged parts, etc) that when grouped, presented a dilemma to the toy manufacturer who probably didn’t want to alienate parents.
i’ve got to think that James guess is correct and his early 1970’s set shows what was probably Marx last attempt to satisfy critics by enclosing the motor, but to speculate further, i’ve got to think there were other extenuating circumstances involved in their decision. by the early 1970’s technology finally was presenting an argument with the price of fractional horsepower motors dropping to the point where clockwork mechanisms as mechanical motion drives didn’t really make economical sense anymore.
add to this the general dark ages of toy trains starting with the demise of Flyer in 1966 and MPC Lionel starting in 1970. it’s surprising anyone lasted much longer.
I have mostly American Flyer but started getting Marx trains about a year ago and really like them. I’ve got several of the 6" tin sets and that is what was under the Christmas tree this past year. The tin plate has a special appeal, and I do not think a Marx train will ever not work with a little cleaning and oil.
one of the most desirable niches of Marx collecting has to be their prewar military sets and about a decade ago i got to join that club with the chance to pick up one of the largest sets made; the same 12 unit train advertised here…
1938 Toyland catalog (Phillip Morris Co.)
headed by a special weighted version of the #500 Army Supply Train locomotive, it included just about every olive drab car in the Marx arsenal.
#500 Army Supply Train locomotive & tender
fitted with the standard single reduction motor, in order to pull such a load, Marx added weights fore and aft in this version of the 2-4-2 loco. a look into the cab of one of these models should be enough to ID this uncommon version. the 500 tender also came with a green vs the black painted rear deck. the unweighted versions of the #500 locomotive can also be found as 0-4-0 wheel arrangements.
perhaps the hardest to classify O gauge train car ever made by Marx was the 2572 Ramp Car so i thought i’d post this one separately.
pictured on the box as having automatic (fork) couplers…
(2572) Automatic Unloader - Ramp Car w/ Critter tank
the actual car, though riding on scale (B) trucks, came only with fixed tab/ slot couplers. with the ramp positioned at the end a siding as pictured on the box cover, the car is activated when the pin mechanism just above the coupler contacts the ramp which will tilt the car platform up allowing the load to roll off.
it was slightly longer than (though able to couple to) 6" tin, not quite the length of a 7" car and with Olive Drab as it’s only color option, having the scale wheels set it apart from the other military pieces, this was truly an odd piece in any set, yet highly valued by collectors. …not the least of that reason being the two valid loads it could carry.
shown above as the military load version, the small tank is known to Marx collectors as the “Critter”. i rarely like to mention dollar values, but in auction, i’ve seen sets and even individual pieces containing this small metal tank with it’s simple wood turret easily exceed three figures. collector alert, …there are repro (cast resin) Critters available.
in non-military sets, the correct and also very prized load are the Deluxe Delivery trailers typically found as a pair with the litho version of a standard
I was wondering the same myself! Maybe the “Marx Tinplate Trains” title is scaring them away? I have a few sets plus some loose cars, and I like the deluxe cars the most, but I’ll occasionally run across a $20 4-wheel plastic set that I can’t refuse.
at times feeling a little envious of N-scalers being able to carry around their entire collection in one box, years ago i started to track down some small scale tin and Marx certainly helped me out; …even with a few more Disney windups.
Marx-Disney lithographed channel track train
Donald is both engineer and fireman in this Disney character litho’ed version of the #376 channel track loco. along with the rest of the cars in this set, opposite side graphics are mirror images. only one gondola was included, but the two pictured show the only car style i have seen with a color variation.
being sold mostly over the counter at department stores and considered more of a train toy than a toy train, it’s difficult to find exact information that would date these sets, but i would have to think it was around the same time Marx released the O gauge Mickey Mouse Meteor train. José Carioca is the youngest character (1943) to appear on either set and that information itself would narrow it down to the postwar era.
and as much as this small train attracts Disneyanites, the base seems to be even more of a draw for its rich graphics.
Disney channel track base
featuring characters from at least four early classic films who rarely gather for such a group pose, this piece always seems to attract more Disney fans than Marx collectors. it took quite some time to find one at a price that didn’t make me cringe.
fortunately at the same time i caught the W.D. gang sleeping, i also nabbed another, more than likely later, Marx-Disney collaboration.
i’ll begin by saying that any dates given here, and there will definitely be very few, have very little evidence (eg: catalogs, 3rd party catalog ads) to back them up. aside from the early electric channel track train with most references pointing to the late 1930’s, i would say as a best guess that all other channel track trains were likely produced in the 1950’s and 60’s. certainly anything with a plastic part would likely date to after 1953/54 when plastics first started to be used widely in the toy industry.
in the late 30’s Marx took their electric Speedway (race car) set, replaced the over-under figure-8 track with a simple oval and designed a new locomotive shell to give birth to the New York Central #5151 streamlined locomotive.
Marx electric channel track train - NYC #5151 loco & tender, #557 caboose & locomotive chassis w/ shell removed
designed not only with a reversing a/c motor, the internal gearing extended to a grit wheel and flint holder up front and under the stack cutout to produce the well known Marx sparkling effect.
Marx electric channel track trains
two different consists were offered with the same #5151 locomotive and tender as the motive power. passenger sets included 3-4 #5153 NYC Utopia coaches with a #5159 observation car; freight sets included the unnumbered Merchants Dispatch car, #9712 Comfort Coal Co (Erie) hopper & the #557 NYC caboose. these being the only cars produced, the largest freight set merely doubled up on the hopper and reefer. except for the hopper, all other cars, passenger a
